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Topic ClosedDalasan/Merits Of Euros Jamal/djebel discussion

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djebel View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Apr 2022 at 10:00pm
TROIS COULEURS (AUS)Bay filly 1998 
Carnegie
Bay 1991
Sadler's Wells
Bay 1981
Northern Dancer
Bay 1961
Nearctic
Brown 1954
Nearco
Lady Angela
1935
1944
4-r
14-c
Natalma
Bay 1957
Native Dancer
Almahmoud
1950
1947
5-f
2-d
Fairy Bridge
Bay 1975
Bold Reason
Bay 1968
Hail to Reason
Lalun
1958
1952
4-n
19-b
Special
Bay 1969
Forli
Thong
1963
1964
3-b
5-h
Detroit
Bay 1977
Riverman
Bay 1969
Never Bend
Bay 1960
Nasrullah
Lalun
1940
1952
9-c
19-b
River Lady
Bay 1963
Prince John
Nile Lily
1953
1954
14-f
10-a
Derna
Bay 1961
Sunny Boy
Bay 1944
Jock
Fille de Soleil
1936
1935
14-f
16-a
Miss Barberie
Bay 1950
Norseman
Vaneuse
1940
1945
13-c
16-c
Juliette Heights
Bay 1985
Shirley Heights
Bay 1975
Mill Reef
Bay 1968
Never Bend
Bay 1960
Nasrullah
Lalun
1940
1952
9-c
19-b
Milan Mill
Bay 1962
Princequillo
Virginia Water
1940
1953
1-b
22-d
Hardiemma
Bay 1969
Hardicanute
Brown 1962
Hard Ridden
Harvest Maid
1955
1949
16>
3-j
Grand Cross
Brown 1952
Grandmaster
Blue Cross
1942
1946
1-k
1-l
Juliette Marny
Bay 1972
Blakeney
Bay 1966
Hethersett
Bay 1959
Hugh Lupus
Bride Elect
1952
1952
19>
21-a
Windmill Girl
Bay 1961
Hornbeam
Chorus Beauty
1953
1952
1-p
20-c
Set Free
Bay 1964
Worden
Chestnut 1949
Wild Risk
Sans Tares
1940
1939
3-f
13-c
Emancipation
Bay 1954
Le Sage
Fair Freedom
1948
1945
5-h
6-b
 Ancestor duplications:Lalun5m,5m x 5m Never Bend4m x 4m
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Apr 2022 at 10:05pm
Given she's a 1998 foal & has a triple of me favourite mare Lalun, the point of the post djebel? Confused
It takes a wise man a lifetime to grow a tree and a fool five minutes to kill one.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Apr 2022 at 10:05pm
Originally posted by JudgeHolden JudgeHolden wrote:

Originally posted by Carioca Carioca wrote:

Jamal , we all realise the last decade for Golden Slipper winners has been abysmal , We know that , but the more money the Turf Clubs throw at 2 y/o races the more clients are prepared to pay for yearlings Big smile so, who are the winners ? Wink

Nail on the head here. Truckload money into an area of racing where not only can you make a quick buck, but you’re in your own little talent pool free from overseas competition. Keeps you viable.


There is far more money thrown at open aged races than 2yo races.

There are something like 55 million dollar races for horses 3 years and up.

This argument no longer holds water.


reductio ad absurdum
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Apr 2022 at 10:06pm
Originally posted by Gay3 Gay3 wrote:

Given she's a 1998 foal & has a triple of me favourite mare Lalun, the point of the post djebel? Confused


You will all see soon enough.


reductio ad absurdum
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Apr 2022 at 10:07pm
Set Free (GB) 1964
 Aust.Id.: 457619bay mareDate of Birth: 00/00/1964 
 3 stakeswinners & 4 stakeswins 
 by Worden (FR) 1949 
 from Emancipation (GB) 1954 
  
Stakes Winning Progeny
WinnerYearRace Name That YearStatus
Juliette Marny (GB ) 19721975IRE Irish Oaks StakesCr
1975GB Epsom Oaks StakesCr
Julio Mariner (GB ) 19751978GB St Leger StakesCr
Scintillate (GB ) 19761979GB Epsom Oaks Stakes1
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Apr 2022 at 10:13pm
Originally posted by djebel djebel wrote:

Originally posted by Foxseal Foxseal wrote:

Djebel, heres a list of 2yo races >$1m that Red Hare provided on a previous post.  Yes plenty of increases to non-2yo races too but you’d have to agree that a GS being worth more than a TJ Smith or a QE Stks is just wrong on every level.

$1m Golden Gift - 1100m - early November
$2m Magic Millions (restricted) - 1200m - early January
$2m Inglis Millenium (restricted) - 1200m - early February
$1.5m Blue Diamond - 1200m - late February
$5m Golden Slipper - 1200m - mid/late March
$1m Sires Produce - 1400m - March/April before Easter
$1m Percy Sykes (fillies) - 1200m - March/April Easter weekend
$1m Showdown (restricted) - 1200m - late April
$1m Sires Produce - 1400m - late May
$1m JJ Atkins - 1600m - early June

10 races at a million plus is a lot for 2yos but there are something like another 50 for the older horses so it is a reasonable percentage.

The Slipper has been the Autumn show piece for as long as I can remember. 


I thought I read that somewhere . LOL
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Apr 2022 at 10:36pm
I find it strange that the two sales restricted races (MM Classic and Inglis Millenium) carry a bigger purse than any of the G1 events save for the Slipper, it almost allows them to carry Group 1 status even if the books don't suggest that.

I also think making the Golden Gift a $1 million race is a joke, at least by the time they get to the Slipper they've been allowed to sort themselves out into the talented and less so, the Golden Gift is to early in the season to be giving away that kind of purse for 2yo's for mine.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Apr 2022 at 10:37pm
There should be zero black type racing for 2yos before Christmas. 
reductio ad absurdum
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Apr 2022 at 2:37am
Agree re the Golden Gift - especially when you see that the Champagne Stakes doesn't even make the list. The $1m Percy Sykes also seems weird prizemoney allocation. 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Apr 2022 at 7:14am
They could take $800k off the Golden Gift, split it between the Champagne and Sires to make them worth the same and not detract from the Golden Gift's quality.  The Sires-Champagne double in Sydney may begin to feel some pressure from the Sires-Atkins double in Brisbane to attract the cream of the crop, especially if the BRC Sires re-gains G1 status as is their obvious aim and the two combined continue to be worth more than their Sydney counterparts.

Chris Waller has already proven with both Press Statement and The Autumn Sun that targeting the Atkins doesn't prohibit Guineas campaigns in both the spring and autumn of their 3yo season.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Apr 2022 at 10:11am
I do agree with the above.  The original triple crown are the three race the club should be making the crown jewels for two year olds.  
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Apr 2022 at 12:48pm
This is why I talk at times of the " good old days "Confused and I still have a hankering for them now , because it was straight forward and always separated the wheat from the Chaff , the Spring for colts , The Breeders Plate then 2 weeks later The Canonbury Stakes , the fillies, The Gimcrack the 2 weeks later The Widden Stakes , that was it till the Autumn , simples , every one knew where they stood ! in the Autumn came the Champagne then the Sires ( open to both sexes ) in /56 came the Golden Slipper to make the triple crown as its now known .
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Apr 2022 at 1:12pm
No one's commented on Verona's run at the weekend.  She also decends from a pretty good miler in Maybe Mahal.  It's always nice to see the good females lines going on with the job.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Apr 2022 at 10:23am
reductio ad absurdum
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Apr 2022 at 10:26am
reductio ad absurdum
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Apr 2022 at 10:30am
Yeah I saw those articles, interesting reads both of them but that aside, Australian racing is still weak at 1600m+, people need to look beyond the prize money line of thinking sometimes. 


Australian racing is only good up to 1400m in terms of world standards when it comes to depth/quality in numbers
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Apr 2022 at 10:57am
for crying out loud we already know that is your opinion, you don't need to bring it up every five minutes.
Winning isn't everything, it's the only thing
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Apr 2022 at 12:38pm
But I can Shawy and I will, I'll keep saying it. I apologise that my views don't align with yours. Have a great day 

Cheers 
Australian racing is only good up to 1400m in terms of world standards when it comes to depth/quality in numbers
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Apr 2022 at 3:45pm
How do you explain our sprinters going overseas and becoming dams of Oaks, Derbies and World Cups when they weren't tried over those trips themselves Jamal?  We have stayers and middle distance horses they run in the Golden Slipper every year and very few go over the trips they then deserve to as older horses!
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Apr 2022 at 3:46pm
that should read dams or sires of
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Apr 2022 at 4:56pm
Furious, have you seen the update in the Exported Mares thread ?

Sea Siren produced a debut winner by Galileo over 2600m. 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Apr 2022 at 5:46pm
I know Djebel.  Sorry I should post more I have to download races world wide every day.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Apr 2022 at 6:25pm
Originally posted by Jamal Jamal wrote:

But I can Shawy and I will, I'll keep saying it. I apologise that my views don't align with yours. Have a great day 
Cheers 


I doubt there's even one member who isn't annoyed & frustrated by your constant repetition. We're all fully aware of your views & don't need a never ending barrage of same, so be prepared for selective removal in future which will be non negotiable.

It takes a wise man a lifetime to grow a tree and a fool five minutes to kill one.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Apr 2022 at 6:45pm
Originally posted by djebel djebel wrote:

Furious, have you seen the update in the Exported Mares thread?  Sea Siren produced a debut winner by Galileo over 2600m.  

She's had four foals by Galileo and so far they appear limited.  I'd have her to Kingman quick smart however don't know that they use Juddmonte stallions
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Apr 2022 at 12:53pm
They see speed and or brilliance.......

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Apr 2022 at 4:45pm
Jamal that comment shows you want reaction, not debate.

If someone doesn't wish to engage in debate with you that's their choice, not yours, you behave like, at best a child, at worst a troll.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Apr 2022 at 4:46pm
Afros you'd be surprised how much Djebel actually agrees with me.
Australian racing is only good up to 1400m in terms of world standards when it comes to depth/quality in numbers
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Apr 2022 at 4:48pm
Originally posted by Jamal Jamal wrote:

No Djebel you abusing me should not happen at all. Simple. 

Also by you ignoring me - what does that show? Poor form.

You have nothing new or interesting to say. You are boring, and as you showed on Sunday you are a troll and a liar.

I will try my hardest to not talk to you in any manner and on any thread including this one in the future.
reductio ad absurdum
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Apr 2022 at 4:52pm
Djebel why don't you take a look in your own backyard with how you act on this forum? Stop pushing blame onto others and look at yourself. 

By you walking away...it shows that you do not want to improve. 
Australian racing is only good up to 1400m in terms of world standards when it comes to depth/quality in numbers
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Apr 2022 at 4:55pm
Originally posted by djebel djebel wrote:

Originally posted by Jamal Jamal wrote:

No Djebel you abusing me should not happen at all. Simple. 

Also by you ignoring me - what does that show? Poor form.

You have nothing new or interesting to say. You are boring, and as you showed on Sunday you are a troll and a liar.

I will try my hardest to not talk to you in any manner and on any thread including this one in the future.

You do not get it Djebel - people who have a different view are not liars or trolls. By you using the "you are a troll line" that just shows that you have no substance in what you are saying and you want to cast blame onto others. It means also that its lazy way of thinking. Stop calling people trolls who have a different opinion/view to you. Seriously...
Australian racing is only good up to 1400m in terms of world standards when it comes to depth/quality in numbers
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