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Verry Elleegant |
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Jamal
Champion Joined: 25 Jul 2011 Status: Offline Points: 8659 |
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Love watching these arguments and yet some people on here think Djebel and I are bad when we are at each other's throats lol
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Australian racing is only good up to 1400m in terms of world standards when it comes to depth/quality in numbers
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Pardon_My_Dust
Champion Joined: 01 Dec 2009 Status: Offline Points: 9124 |
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Mate I'm not arguing I'm just trying to voice my opinion as most do on a forum. I've got this incessant tagger that basically argues with every opinion I give. It's guaranteed I post something and sure enough there's my stalker with a response. Almost uncanny.
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Gay3
Moderator Group Joined: 19 Feb 2007 Location: Miners Rest Status: Offline Points: 51818 |
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William Haggis: "Meanwhile, Haggas said it would take a massive performance from Verry Elleegant to win the Prix de l'Arc de Triomphe.
The star mare has been sent for a spell following her Queen Elizabeth run, with trainer Chris Waller eyeing October's Arc as a possible target for her. "The Arc is a hugely difficult race to win, no disrespect to her. I think she would find it tough because you get the solid older horses and then you get the young three-year-olds," Haggas said. "And usually the champion horses of each category go for the Arc. It's in a very good spot at the end of the season and it's a huge race. "She'd be a 16, 20-1 pop." |
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Wisdom has been chasing me but I've always outrun it!
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TJMitchell
Champion Joined: 29 Jun 2014 Location: Melbourne Status: Offline Points: 16890 |
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All things going well I would 100% go there with her.
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Time is a flat circle
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ExceedAndExcel
Champion Joined: 20 Dec 2008 Status: Offline Points: 16226 |
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She’s not winning an Arc. And honestly, she won’t even go.
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TJMitchell
Champion Joined: 29 Jun 2014 Location: Melbourne Status: Offline Points: 16890 |
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2400m, likely wet track. Wouldn't get a better chance at one of these big overseas races. Have a crack!
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Time is a flat circle
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djebel
Premium Joined: 07 Mar 2007 Status: Offline Points: 53960 |
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It's verry eeassy to say she's not winning an Arc that does not mean they should not accept the challenge.
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reductio ad absurdum
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ExceedAndExcel
Champion Joined: 20 Dec 2008 Status: Offline Points: 16226 |
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I’m not saying they shouldn’t have a go. I’m saying they won’t. Quite a difference.
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Gay3
Moderator Group Joined: 19 Feb 2007 Location: Miners Rest Status: Offline Points: 51818 |
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All the successful International trainers say you must have the right horse to take, wherever you go. Imagine if all goes perfectly untill she gets bumped or squeezed out of the gates or, given a wet track, they dawdle early. She's far too unpredictable imo, to risk carting to the other side of the planet in the hope she produces her A game on the day.
It's all very well for punters & racing enthusiasts to say 'send her, we want to prove she's better than them on their own turf' when they have nothing at all at risk bar a dented ego! |
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Wisdom has been chasing me but I've always outrun it!
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Second Chance
Champion Joined: 02 Dec 2007 Status: Offline Points: 45319 |
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Took the words right out of my mouth Gay. Fancy going that far only to cop a bump causing her to fire up and over-race. It's been known to happen.
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Pardon_My_Dust
Champion Joined: 01 Dec 2009 Status: Offline Points: 9124 |
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I'd be having a fair whack at the $20 on offer no doubt about that.
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TJMitchell
Champion Joined: 29 Jun 2014 Location: Melbourne Status: Offline Points: 16890 |
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Send soft hands Jamie over with her. An Aussie 2 for 1 special.
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Time is a flat circle
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Mr Grieves
Champion Joined: 28 Jan 2014 Location: Canberra Status: Offline Points: 929 |
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I'd say she's about a 2% chance of going
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Second Chance
Champion Joined: 02 Dec 2007 Status: Offline Points: 45319 |
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Careful TJ, you seriously risk our resident pedant/Oz bagger JudgeHolden pulling you up for referring to either VE or Jamie Kah as Aussies.
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Shrunk in the Wash
Champion Joined: 25 Mar 2016 Status: Offline Points: 9890 |
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Can you name me half a dozen who would beat her in the Arc?
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TJMitchell
Champion Joined: 29 Jun 2014 Location: Melbourne Status: Offline Points: 16890 |
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Time is a flat circle
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Pardon_My_Dust
Champion Joined: 01 Dec 2009 Status: Offline Points: 9124 |
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Just wondering, how many times has she not produced her A game on the day in the last 12-18 months? Couldn't be too many. Not rocket science let her jump, relax, find her stride and come the business end she will produce the goods. Good enough to win the L'Arc? Only one way to find out!
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Gay3
Moderator Group Joined: 19 Feb 2007 Location: Miners Rest Status: Offline Points: 51818 |
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You know what they say about money & fools? Truly am sorry but I couldn't resist when I came up with a very rare 'smart' one |
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Wisdom has been chasing me but I've always outrun it!
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Second Chance
Champion Joined: 02 Dec 2007 Status: Offline Points: 45319 |
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Well we certainly don't know who'll run in the Arc in seven months time. Particularly emerging 3 and 4yo's.
However were VE was to have fronted and over-raced on such a tricky circuit in last year's race there's at least five who could've and probably would've beaten her home, ie Sottsass, In Swoop, Persian King, Enable and Stradivarius.
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Jamal
Champion Joined: 25 Jul 2011 Status: Offline Points: 8659 |
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You need a world class horse to win an Arc. Verry Elleegant is a good horse but not sure she is world class
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Australian racing is only good up to 1400m in terms of world standards when it comes to depth/quality in numbers
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Jamal
Champion Joined: 25 Jul 2011 Status: Offline Points: 8659 |
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But having said that...right track conditions - tick, 2400m - tick. She may well place in an Arc which would be a good effort....great effort in fact but she'll need to go to another level..the Arc is at 2400m race at another level from the Tancred and Caulfield Cup - two races which she won. |
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Australian racing is only good up to 1400m in terms of world standards when it comes to depth/quality in numbers
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kavg
Champion Joined: 08 Jun 2009 Status: Offline Points: 3993 |
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VE is world class.
How can she beat Addeybb and then be beaten only half a length against one of the world's top horses. Addeybb won the Champion Stakes fiddlesticks, a year after running a close 2nd in the same race to the also world class Magical. Surely you can see that Jamal as anyone who can't recognise how good she is, does not have any idea on comparing horses. And they are probably the same that are saying that Winx wasn't world class as she never raced overseas, but we all know VE would never have been able to compete with Winx. |
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Prejudice is an emotional attachment to ignorance.
DiEM25 for the world. |
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TJMitchell
Champion Joined: 29 Jun 2014 Location: Melbourne Status: Offline Points: 16890 |
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That CC victory has form through AVD who has form back to Ghaiyyath, who was THE BEST horse in Europe last year.
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Time is a flat circle
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ExceedAndExcel
Champion Joined: 20 Dec 2008 Status: Offline Points: 16226 |
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Don’t follow European racing so no. But she is no So You Think and he could only run what, 4th? And she sure is no Winx either. It would need to be a weak year for her to be any chance.
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Jamal
Champion Joined: 25 Jul 2011 Status: Offline Points: 8659 |
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So You Think was ridden badly in that Arc - jockey got too far back. Wide gate didnt help either but flew home and would if ran 2nd I reckon....at the very least 3rd.
Edited by Gay3 - 20 Apr 2021 at 9:34pm |
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Australian racing is only good up to 1400m in terms of world standards when it comes to depth/quality in numbers
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Shrunk in the Wash
Champion Joined: 25 Mar 2016 Status: Offline Points: 9890 |
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Well, that makes your first comment look very odd. If you don’t follow their racing or have any knowledge of the current horses over there there is no way that you could make any claims re her winning this years race If anyone would like to tell me who the top 6 2400m horses are over there, I’d like to hear |
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ExceedAndExcel
Champion Joined: 20 Dec 2008 Status: Offline Points: 16226 |
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No need to have specific knowledge Shrunk. All that’s needed is to know that on the whole their 2400m racing is lengths superior to hear. Just read what several handicappers have said about the matter. Would have to be a very average year for her to have a chance.
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ExceedAndExcel
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Shrunk in the Wash
Champion Joined: 25 Mar 2016 Status: Offline Points: 9890 |
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Cheers, I read those comments and they don’t make any sense Blencowe, the “expert” quoted was using her timeform rating* as a yardstick against horses like Magical to boost his argument.....Magical is retired as is Winx and SYT Blenowe clearly has a set against her as he then ignores his own timeform ratings that have Addeybb as the 4th highest rated horse in Europe. That’s behind the 4000m Stradavarius and a couple of last seasons 3yos who are unproven as older horses If Addeybb is in the too 4 VE can’t be too far behind which makes her a very real chance in the Arc As I asked, who will beat her aside from the big A?
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Shrunk in the Wash
Champion Joined: 25 Mar 2016 Status: Offline Points: 9890 |
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Current No 1 in Europe is Palace Pier, trained by John & Thady Gosden and rated 132. Last updated to cover racing to 18/04/2021. The lists cover horses that have run or been entered to run this season, or are reported still to be in training. A complete file of the 2020 Flat end-of-season ratings is available here.
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