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John McNair. |
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JudgeHolden
Champion Joined: 16 Apr 2011 Status: Offline Points: 11728 |
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Oh yes it was Djebel.
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Quezacotl
Champion Joined: 04 Jul 2011 Status: Offline Points: 14993 |
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Not all Group1 races are created equally Djebel...as i'm sure you are aware of, however, they are still penciled up in the record books as G1's.. *eg: NZ, Singapore & Hong Kong G1's...by comparison not G1 quality here, and probably rate as G3 in Europe, but the facts are they are G1's,.. and G1's that are well within Bufferings talents. Djebel the Newmarket handicap was won by Hay List yesterday ..would you agree it took a geniune G1 rated performance to win it..? |
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SPRINTER SACRE - "SIMPLY THE BEST"
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djebel
Premium Joined: 07 Mar 2007 Status: Offline Points: 53960 |
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Have a look at the ground chopping up before they reach the course proper.
http://bigpondvideo.com/Horse_Racing/429259 http://bigpondvideo.com/Horse_Racing/429208 http://bigpondvideo.com/Horse_Racing/429199 They are clearly cutting into that ground prior to the course proper. In my considered opinion it was not a good track. |
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reductio ad absurdum
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djebel
Premium Joined: 07 Mar 2007 Status: Offline Points: 53960 |
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Yes. |
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reductio ad absurdum
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JudgeHolden
Champion Joined: 16 Apr 2011 Status: Offline Points: 11728 |
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So we should ignore official track penetrometer ratings, and instead rely on Djebel's video analysis? Give it away son.
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djebel
Premium Joined: 07 Mar 2007 Status: Offline Points: 53960 |
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You can do what you like. I have provided the evidence to suggest the track was not good.
Did you bother looking at the videos ? Does the penetrometer check the whole course every square inch of it ? Do you know where they check ? |
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reductio ad absurdum
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ChrisB
Champion Joined: 14 Feb 2012 Status: Offline Points: 2290 |
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Back to the form books .........how have G3 stayers faired here in Melb Cup - most have been embarassed, with a few like Media Puzzle, Crime Scene etc running good races.
How have "our" G1 star sprinters faired in HK and their locals?
How did Americain go in HK? What about Jimmy Choux?
HK has very strong racing......to compare Singapore to HK suggest you watch more Bananas in Pyjamas than horse racing
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JudgeHolden
Champion Joined: 16 Apr 2011 Status: Offline Points: 11728 |
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Alright I'll bite. You have provided no evidence the track wasn't good, only an opinion. You opinion flies not only in the face of the official rating, but also when compared to the results from the same program the previous year. But by all means, keep punching.
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Blind Faith
Champion Joined: 20 Sep 2011 Status: Offline Points: 1533 |
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No but neither could I imagine her running 1400m in 1:25:14. They would have run faster had she been there no doubt. Hay List ran 10.39 10.49 10.60 (31.48) for half that race, Buffering was very similar. That is spectacular in anyone's money. |
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djebel
Premium Joined: 07 Mar 2007 Status: Offline Points: 53960 |
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Stop carrying on like a big girls blouse. Have you looked at the VIDEOS ? What do you see when you watch those VIDEOS. Open your fricken eyes. It is only when they get on the course proper does it look like a good track, The first part of those 3 straight track races they are clearly kicking up the ground. When African Pulse beat Karuta Queen down the straight last spring they also said it was a good track. Anybody who watches the video can see it was not. |
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reductio ad absurdum
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JudgeHolden
Champion Joined: 16 Apr 2011 Status: Offline Points: 11728 |
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YAAAAWNNNN you blokes.
BF, I said fully extended, so enough with the sophistry. There is nothing I could further add in terms of facts and figures to dispel your ridiculous arguments, so let me just say this: In last year's Newmarket, we saw BC's peak performance. This was a gallop that rating analysts such as Dominic Beirne and Michael McHugh record as the best in their databases, of all horses. Timeform rate it as the best gallop in this country since at least Kingston Town and IHF rate as the best ever by a mare. If you think that win yesterday by HL comes close, you really need to find another sport.
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scamanda
Champion Joined: 11 Oct 2008 Location: The Manor Status: Offline Points: 16246 |
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From RISA. Track ratings for the first 4 races were officially a dead 4. Race 4 was run at 1.55pm AEDST.Track ratings for races 5 to 9 were Good 3. Race 5 was run at 2.35 pm. So in 40 mins the track improved from a dead 4 to a good 3. The track did look to chop up a bit when they reached the course proper. |
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Blind Faith
Champion Joined: 20 Sep 2011 Status: Offline Points: 1533 |
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Don't see ANYONE arguing that at all. You're either barking up the wrong tree or searching for a red herring. A couple of people think Hay List might have been able to beat BC with the weight turnaround, based on what they saw in the Lightning. If you dismiss that as a possibility I'd say you're in for a long career as a losing punter, assuming you bet of course. |
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JudgeHolden
Champion Joined: 16 Apr 2011 Status: Offline Points: 11728 |
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BF,
What weight turn around are you talking about? Djebel posted that yesteday's race put HL "very close to the great mare". Rubbish I say. And neither you nor Djebel has given the slightest evidence to the contrary. But then I'm still waiting to hear from you about Rocket Man's bleeding attack. Stick to picking on North Queensland yokels. |
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djebel
Premium Joined: 07 Mar 2007 Status: Offline Points: 53960 |
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Some people hope that Hay List dodges the great mare and gets his own opportunity to build a picket fence.
I hope they stalk the great mare. Where ever Peter Moody decides to run her in her prep run for England Hay List should turn up. He can win the TJ Smith and the All Aged and take her on where ever that maybe. She is not due to run until well after those two events. |
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reductio ad absurdum
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JudgeHolden
Champion Joined: 16 Apr 2011 Status: Offline Points: 11728 |
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I actually agree with that, Djebel, from a racing point of view. He is the only horse who makes her work, as Moody says. Provided they don't risk their horse. He is a gelding, and will be running around long after she is gone. I don't think they'll ever meet again, however
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jujuno
Champion Joined: 25 Jan 2010 Location: Coasting Status: Offline Points: 36440 |
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can someone tell me what the last two dozen posts have to do with John McNair? put them over in the Newmarket thread... |
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Desert War, Rain Lover, Latin Knight, Hay List, Mustard...my turf heroes...
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jujuno
Champion Joined: 25 Jan 2010 Location: Coasting Status: Offline Points: 36440 |
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Desert War, Rain Lover, Latin Knight, Hay List, Mustard...my turf heroes...
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jujuno
Champion Joined: 25 Jan 2010 Location: Coasting Status: Offline Points: 36440 |
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now that has something to do with J McNair
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Desert War, Rain Lover, Latin Knight, Hay List, Mustard...my turf heroes...
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Blind Faith
Champion Joined: 20 Sep 2011 Status: Offline Points: 1533 |
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Ask Djebel what he meant. I've already explained what my comments were about. Had BC been in Saturday's race she would have been giving Hay List 3.0kgs instead of receiving the usual 2kgs. Based on the Lightning in all likelihood she would have tasted her first defeat but we'll never know. Wrt Rocket Man either your memory or observation skills need some work. Posted: 18 Dec 2011 at 2:10pm
There were reports that RM had blood and mucus in his nostrils and throat. That doesn't mean he bled tho. |
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JudgeHolden
Champion Joined: 16 Apr 2011 Status: Offline Points: 11728 |
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"There were reports that RM had blood and mucus in his nostrils and throat. That doesn't mean he bled tho."
So can you give me some links to THAT, BF? |
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djebel
Premium Joined: 07 Mar 2007 Status: Offline Points: 53960 |
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When John McNair says Hay List has never been at his best when the two great horses have met, Why do 99% of people dismiss this as nonsense ?
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reductio ad absurdum
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JudgeHolden
Champion Joined: 16 Apr 2011 Status: Offline Points: 11728 |
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...and you seem to be suggesting that if you load BC with enough weight HL will eventually beat her. Thanks for that, Brainiac.
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djebel
Premium Joined: 07 Mar 2007 Status: Offline Points: 53960 |
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Who me ? I do not want any championship decided by weight. |
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reductio ad absurdum
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subastral
Champion Joined: 28 Jul 2011 Location: Melbourne Status: Offline Points: 34887 |
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In every sport, when you lose, you accept the loss, and try again. You don't make excuses. Hearing McNair say he has never been fit is the same as a losing coach complaining about umpires as the reason they lost. It just doesn't win you any fans. All he has to say is "we are getting closer, we will live to fight another day, and one day we might just get her". Then you wouldn't have 10 pages of posts of people bagging him.
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racinglover
Champion Joined: 05 Jul 2011 Status: Offline Points: 4520 |
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He didn't even say it about the lightning i didn't think, i thought after that he said we can't beat her.
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JudgeHolden
Champion Joined: 16 Apr 2011 Status: Offline Points: 11728 |
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No Djebel. I posted while your last post was going through. That was directeed to BF. Though your previous post was a bit cheeky. Not even I'm going to bite on that.
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jujuno
Champion Joined: 25 Jan 2010 Location: Coasting Status: Offline Points: 36440 |
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he did say that...and this morning he virtually said if they can't beat her here then why travel to Ascot to lose again... |
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Desert War, Rain Lover, Latin Knight, Hay List, Mustard...my turf heroes...
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Blind Faith
Champion Joined: 20 Sep 2011 Status: Offline Points: 1533 |
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Someone who can't use a search function calling another a "brainiac"? I'm deeply wounded LOL. I don't know how you operate on public forums but I'm not given to making things up to suit. Enjoy your search we'll see you back here in a few days. With regard to your comment about loading up BC - do you understand what handicap races are about? I doubt it. Under the Vic G1 guidlines she was actually well in with 61.5 compared to her rating. |
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Blind Faith
Champion Joined: 20 Sep 2011 Status: Offline Points: 1533 |
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Except if it's WFA? |
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