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Tlazolteotl ![]() Champion ![]() ![]() Joined: 02 Oct 2012 Location: Elephant Butte Status: Offline Points: 30159 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Posted: 21 Nov 2023 at 9:06am |
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Alan Kohler: Australians can’t afford homes – something politicians can’t risk fixinghttps://www.thenewdaily.com.au/finance/2023/11/20/housing-market-conundrum-kohler In my Quarterly Essay to be published next week (The Great Divide: Australia’s housing mess and how to fix it), I point out that the cost of housing, the most basic necessity of life, has doubled as a multiple of income in the past 23 years – from three-to-four times to seven-to-eight. This has changed everything about the economy and the way Australian society works. Can’t turn back the clock The only housing policy that would effectively deal with that would explicitly aim to reduce that ratio to what it had been for most of the nation’s history. And since drastically reducing house prices would be both impossible and disastrous, the only viable way to achieve that reduction in the house price-to-income ratio is to ensure house prices don’t rise for 18 years, through reduced demand (removing tax incentives) and increased supply (fast trains to open up a lot more land further from the cities). That’s how long it would take for incomes rising at 4 per cent per year to catch up and bring the house price-to-income ratio back to three to four times. But would any political party that actually promised to try to keep house prices unchanged for 18 years ever win an election? Definitely not. Most people own a house, often more than one, and expect it to increase in value – many need it to, especially young families, so they can build some equity. Super is too long distance, for retirement only, and, anyway, anything can happen to the sharemarket. Housing is the way Australians know how to safely build wealth. So
here’s the excruciating paradox: Everyone agrees that housing
affordability is one of Australia’s biggest economic problems, if not
the biggest, exacerbating inequality and causing deep resentment among
voters, but promising to fix it will ensure that you don’t get elected. |
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An honest politician is one who when he is bought will stay bought.
Simon Cameron |
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oneonesit ![]() Champion ![]() ![]() Joined: 06 Aug 2012 Status: Online Points: 34803 |
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There is a fundamental flaw in that article.
The housing market is still relatively strong - so someone’s buying them
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Refer ALP Election Promises
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oneonesit ![]() Champion ![]() ![]() Joined: 06 Aug 2012 Status: Online Points: 34803 |
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How about starting by stopping ALL foreign investment in all housing.
No get our clauses , shonky money transfers , limits & so forth. Just stop it altogether
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Refer ALP Election Promises
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Tlazolteotl ![]() Champion ![]() ![]() Joined: 02 Oct 2012 Location: Elephant Butte Status: Offline Points: 30159 |
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Remarkable statistic - price has doubled as a multiple of income in 23 years.
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An honest politician is one who when he is bought will stay bought.
Simon Cameron |
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rusty nails ![]() Champion ![]() Joined: 20 Mar 2013 Location: Sydney Status: Offline Points: 10689 |
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Yeah, plenty can afford to buy a third or fourth rental, but first time buyers are struggling. One of my kids just bought a house for a third of the value of the house I bought at the same age. Sure, interest rates are massively different, but still, he’d be in top 20% of income earners, I’d guess. God knows how a teacher,nurse,firefighter etc could ever afford current prices.
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oneonesit ![]() Champion ![]() ![]() Joined: 06 Aug 2012 Status: Online Points: 34803 |
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Yes - it’s almost as if the increasing rates are only further impacting those that cannot afford to buy - whilst those that can are largely unaffected
Round our way ( lower north shore Sydney) there is a lot of Asian money buying up properties. Go to any Auction & they totally dominate active participants |
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Refer ALP Election Promises
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Afros ![]() Champion ![]() Joined: 14 Jan 2009 Status: Offline Points: 14124 |
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I reckon the mess has been allowed to get to deep for any government to have the ability or desire to turn it all around.
If values were brought back, what happens to the people who brought at the top who could potentially have a house worth more than their loan? I think as a society where we have gone wrong is we're allowing services such as housing, education, health and perhaps finance could be thrown in, to have turned into businesses. My cousin lives in Brisbane, she had to go back to work 6 weeks after having a baby, her husband worked 3 different jobs all so that they could shovel cash into the banking furnace to pay off their house. There are plenty in a similar position to this and all on what are historically lower interest rates, I know people talk of the high rates of the 1980s but they had a much lower housing price to income ratio than the kids are dealing with today. Because of this we could see a real crash if the interest rates continue to climb.
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The world needs more Man United relegations
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Hello Sunshine ![]() Champion ![]() Joined: 21 Feb 2021 Status: Offline Points: 3722 |
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No-one can escape this housing crisis — it's coming for home owners tooBy business reporter Gareth Hutchens Posted
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Hello Sunshine ![]() Champion ![]() Joined: 21 Feb 2021 Status: Offline Points: 3722 |
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And well off parents of international students who are buying up accommodation for the kids.
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Baghdad Bob ![]() Champion ![]() Joined: 10 Feb 2010 Location: Victoria Status: Offline Points: 12619 |
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Of course many first time buyers on "average incomes " find it difficult to get sufficient deposit to get into the housing market, unless they want to live outside of our capital cities where prices are cheaper, whereas those that want to become landlords are of another category. Those who can afford to buy rental properties are more than likely settled into their own home and will need to gear right up and if interest rates increase their properties' values will, in all probability stagnate, or even fall, then when they do sell they will be up for CGT if any profit is made. Owning investment properties is not all beer and skittles, despite the perception it is money for jam.
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Fiddlesticks ![]() Champion ![]() ![]() Joined: 31 Dec 2012 Status: Offline Points: 48042 |
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wealthy Chinese, and no one is stopping them.
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Panspermia.
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Fiddlesticks ![]() Champion ![]() ![]() Joined: 31 Dec 2012 Status: Offline Points: 48042 |
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If govs aren't going to fix this awful mess then people buy land and lease it to others to put tiny houses on, or build more apartment complexes purely for rentals, open up land for trailer parks, make camper-vans more affordable and more places for people to camp/live. The wealthy who have houses now are a big part of the problem, they won't vote for a gov who wants to build lots more houses ( driving the value of their own property down ) yet they want to own multiple properties and charge astronomical rents to people struggling to get a foothold in life. People who have more than one investment property should be forced to sell any extra houses/apartments they own to first home buyers. The gov could give them a break on capital gains taxes. This country is supposed to be the lucky country, yeah good, if you are already wealthy, screw everyone else who wants to live a life free of debt. Just how exactly is a young person say 18 to 23 working and studying supposed to rent anything when firstly real estates won't let to young people with no references, and the cost of that rental would make them bankrupt anyways ?
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Panspermia.
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Baghdad Bob ![]() Champion ![]() Joined: 10 Feb 2010 Location: Victoria Status: Offline Points: 12619 |
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How does that work when Investor A has two units valued at $700,000 each and Investor B has one unit worth $ 1,500,000 ? Investor A has to sell one of his units whilst Investor B, with more equity, is able to retain his investment property. I am afraid government intervention in to the private property market will not work
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Carioca ![]() Champion ![]() Joined: 13 Nov 2015 Status: Online Points: 21190 |
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Hello Sunshine ![]() Champion ![]() Joined: 21 Feb 2021 Status: Offline Points: 3722 |
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the Chinese are the untouchables.
Cant touch them because they will withdraw markets. Albanese weak as pi$$.
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Fiddlesticks ![]() Champion ![]() ![]() Joined: 31 Dec 2012 Status: Offline Points: 48042 |
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How bout you offer some answers Bobby instead of continually finding excuses for your self.
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Panspermia.
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Afros ![]() Champion ![]() Joined: 14 Jan 2009 Status: Offline Points: 14124 |
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Bobby clearly has some investment properties, based on comments from him over a period of time here,
Bobby's opinions on the housing situation are driven by self interest, not the greater good.
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The world needs more Man United relegations
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furious ![]() Champion ![]() Joined: 19 Feb 2007 Status: Offline Points: 24315 |
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I have a daughter who has got to $100K but still can't afford to buy in the Sydney basin. As she has to leave home at 5am every money to get to work going further afield wouldn't work but she can only get $250K from the bank and let's face it nothing of that value anywhere around.
Even when I die this house has to be sold as the six have part of it so where she and her brother will live is up in the air. My home wont give any of them enough to get something. At least three have a house or a unit. So three with and three without.
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Baghdad Bob ![]() Champion ![]() Joined: 10 Feb 2010 Location: Victoria Status: Offline Points: 12619 |
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I do have investment properties in suburban Melbourne, which along with my SMSF, provide me with a retirement income so that I do not rely on any government welfare, in fact, as I should, I pay income tax on my income from those investments. My concern today is helping out my sons to get into the property market, which without my help they would find it difficult. To buy an average 3 bedroom home inner better suburbs of Melbourne will set them back $ 2K +, so the only hope they have is a help from my wife and myself. Sure it is difficult for young people to get into the housing market, but like those have gone before them , unless they get that bit of help, they could finish up as renters for life.
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Brudder_A ![]() Champion ![]() Joined: 01 Apr 2013 Location: Uzhhorod Status: Offline Points: 4003 |
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Time to live in a rusty caravan near Wodonga and know how to drive a truck...
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rusty nails ![]() Champion ![]() Joined: 20 Mar 2013 Location: Sydney Status: Offline Points: 10689 |
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Huh?
It’s difficult to get into the housing market, like it’s always been? And you acknowledge your kids will need your help to get into home ownership. This is the first generation where that’s been the case. |
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Baghdad Bob ![]() Champion ![]() Joined: 10 Feb 2010 Location: Victoria Status: Offline Points: 12619 |
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It has always been difficult to get into the housing market, my parents were renters for their lives and they died 30 years ago.
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rusty nails ![]() Champion ![]() Joined: 20 Mar 2013 Location: Sydney Status: Offline Points: 10689 |
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After the 60’s pretty much everyone could get a foothold in the property market.
In the 80’s anyone who had a job, and didn’t have a gambling or drinking addiction could buy a house. In the 90’s, all the kids were getting low start loans with 95% LVR’s. (and keeping their payments to approx 30% of their income) Today, young professionals earning $200k still can’t get in easily. If you’re a copper or a nurse, you’re out of the market. That’s never,ever been the case previously.
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rusty nails ![]() Champion ![]() Joined: 20 Mar 2013 Location: Sydney Status: Offline Points: 10689 |
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Ignoring that over 1/2 the kids have been whacked with a HECS debt of $50k, that previous generations
Didn’t cop.
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VOYAGER ![]() Champion ![]() ![]() Joined: 04 Aug 2007 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 18469 |
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I hope that the paragraphs in the OP are just a snippet of the column because if that was the whole article then the writer is someone who does not know what they are talking about, as far as the solution is concerned.
Problem - The problem is very specific. Allowing first home buyers the opportunity to get into the housing market without having to over finance. Cause of problem - The cause of the problem is an exponential increase in the number of real estate investors. When you have a section of the society who owns two or more properties, the supply for first home owners decreases (this is due to investors looking to buy less expensive investment homes than their own home), so they target brand new homes or low cost homes which would normally be the target of first home buyers. The solution - Forget current homes and get the first home buyers into new homes. Offer no interest no deposit mortgages to first home buyers, and limit the prices of the houses ($450,000 to $720,00). These prices could be subsidised by the government, which already is being offered (in NSW the government will pay for 40% of a homes cost for eligible first home buyers. The government owns 40% of the home but this is a good way for first home buyers to get into the market). So this is how the policy would work. The value of the home $720,000. The NSW government first home buyers ownership subsidy is worth $288,000. The buyer needs a loan for $432,000, so they go to the federal government and secure the no deposit no interest loan for 30 years or 360 months. So the home buyer has entered the market. Now the monthly repayments will be $1200. No investors allowed to access these mortgages, with the exception of grand parents or parents who want to secure their children's futures. If they invest there will be caps put on the rent they can ask for which will be enough to cover the payments and a small amount for any maintenance and the annual rates. Because the monthly payments do not increase this rent will only increase to cover costs. Obviously this means there needs to be cooperation between all levels of the governments and I would not be holding my breath for that to happen. The answer is simple and I do not understand why no party implements this policy, because if they did it would be a vote winner. This policy is something which could benefit everyone in society.
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Remember, it might take intelligence to be smart , but it takes experience to be wise
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Fiddlesticks ![]() Champion ![]() ![]() Joined: 31 Dec 2012 Status: Offline Points: 48042 |
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This I agree with 20000% I mean why does Australia need/allow foreigners to buy property ?All housing is supposed to house citizens and residents who are living in the country period. All countries of the west should be housing their own people first and foremost, and stuff anyone who wants to buy from overseas. Overseas investment in Australian property is a virus on this nation, there are whole apartment complexes that are owned by internationals with no one living in them because the owners just want an investment that grows in value. To let people live in them would cost them money in security, maintenance, estate agents etc etc so they buy new apartments and leave them empty, this is criminal imo. I'm actually looking at buying a large SUV/wagon in case I can't renew my current lease or find myself unemployed, at least i'll be able to sleep and move around in the SUV.
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Panspermia.
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rusty nails ![]() Champion ![]() Joined: 20 Mar 2013 Location: Sydney Status: Offline Points: 10689 |
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The answer ignores market forces.
If 100,000 people can all of a sudden afford $300k more than they could yesterday, then the market at that end will explode, and prices will go up by $300,000
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rusty nails ![]() Champion ![]() Joined: 20 Mar 2013 Location: Sydney Status: Offline Points: 10689 |
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The only solution is to wind back all the tax perks, which is political suicide.
That’s why no one from either party wants to touch it.
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Plastic letters ![]() Champion ![]() Joined: 21 Jan 2023 Location: Sydney Status: Online Points: 2773 |
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Not sure about teachers. I know 3 who earn well over 120k. Duel incomes take them over 200k a year. they can’t afford a house First year out of uni, the start up is 85k |
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Plastic letters ![]() Champion ![]() Joined: 21 Jan 2023 Location: Sydney Status: Online Points: 2773 |
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To my mind it seems older singles are the ones struggling with the massive rent hikes and the ability to buy
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