Vow And Declare

A really memorable Cup & just great to see a local victory.

It’s a satisfying result because V&D is a horse we’ve all seen work his way through the grades here, from a 2381m maiden at The Bool just over a year ago, though to the Qld winter carnival & now the pinnacle of the Melb Cup.

Well done Danny and well done V&D 👏👏

What a star this horse is. Just a consummate professional and all he knows is to stay!

Amazing initiative and courage from Craig, and phenomenal training performance from O'Brien.

How on earth did he trade at such value for so much of the pre post and final field betting? Some bookie offered $17 promo today I'm told?

Sunline...simply supreme

Ahhhhh Well ... Just another day at the Office for Australia's best Jockey.

He's probably thinking more about a Maiden at Moe tomorrow .

Tlazolteotl wrote:

JudgeHolden wrote:

That’s one in 10 years. I’m delighted for O’Brien but the fact that this is seen as some sort of triumph is kinda sad.

V&D shows why Australians aren't that interested in breeding V&Ds. Uneconomic to breed - passed in at 45k- and uneconomic to buy - very few races it can win, and even if it was an entire worth nothing after racing.

Disagree with this. What exactly is uneconomical to buy? He would have cost peanuts if someone paid the reserve, and he was placing in G1s and winning stakes races by the end of his 3yo year.

I think people who don't breed and/or race horses have a perception that most horses race at two or at least by early three. The reality is very, very few race at two, and most are racing well into their 3yo year.

He is proof that when you get a good one that can stay, you open yourself up to a multitude of great prizemoney races. If you can make the ever-shrinking step to WFA, you strike gold. Samadoubt was a WFA horse this prep. Let that sink in - as good as he is and no disrespect to him whatsoever.

There are very few 2yo races to win, and they are often highly competitive. You put all your eggs in that basket and you potentially end up with a horse without the scope to improve and progress beyond two.

Sunline...simply supreme

Sunline wrote:

Tlazolteotl wrote:

JudgeHolden wrote:

That’s one in 10 years. I’m delighted for O’Brien but the fact that this is seen as some sort of triumph is kinda sad.

V&D shows why Australians aren't that interested in breeding V&Ds. Uneconomic to breed - passed in at 45k- and uneconomic to buy - very few races it can win, and even if it was an entire worth nothing after racing.

Disagree with this. What exactly is uneconomical to buy? He would have cost peanuts if someone paid the reserve, and he was placing in G1s and winning stakes races by the end of his 3yo year.

I think people who don't breed and/or race horses have a perception that most horses race at two or at least by early three. The reality is very, very few race at two, and most are racing well into their 3yo year.

He is proof that when you get a good one that can stay, you open yourself up to a multitude of great prizemoney races. If you can make the ever-shrinking step to WFA, you strike gold. Samadoubt was a WFA horse this prep. Let that sink in - as good as he is and no disrespect to him whatsoever.

There are very few 2yo races to win, and they are often highly competitive. You put all your eggs in that basket and you potentially end up with a horse without the scope to improve and progress beyond two.

Agree with you Sunny.

The balance of imports v exports is a fair indicator of market viability. The local buying bench is far too compromised by false bidders, debt traders, syndicators and their like.

Mind you, if a trainers are savvy enough to know when a horse is better suited to a late 3yo debut, do they need to charge the same rate for the first year of racing eligibility?

Was listening to SEN yesterday, Danny O'Brien was on talking about Vow and Declare and a few others.

He said that due to how their training setup works they don't need to race V&D in unsuitable 1400 or 1600 races and they would never race him below 2000, he'll likely go Aus Cup, QE2 and the 2200m race on Stradbroke day this prep and repeat last springs prep this prep.

Danny should expect djebel to be his #1 fan now.

How long before Olillie takes the ride on this horse?

To give him the fitness foundation he had going into last spring he needs two more runs at 2400m+.

How does the Warnmabool Cup fit in with this program, could he run in both?

Remember, it might take intelligence to be smart , but it takes experience to be wise

Maybe.

I personally think Haky is well placed here! Did not run the 3200m at Sandown and so forget that and di not handle the derby day slow (night not have backed up and was second up from the break), but his Geelong Cup effort is absolutely good enough to win here and he drops half a kilo due to the cup winner being here.

Well weighted, the distance is right in his wheel house, and can sit forward and goes well second up, when right.

I think the double figures on offer is good value!

Remember, it might take intelligence to be smart , but it takes experience to be wise

Well done you two. Clap

Vow And Declare disappointing

Australian racing is only good up to 1400m in terms of world standards when it comes to depth/quality in numbers

Weight stops trains

Shawy38 wrote:

Weight stops trains

Not to that extent.

He only had 5 kgs over the limit.

reductio ad absurdum

Vow And Declare was disappointing, wasn't good enough - yes he had 61kg but as Djebel said the difference was only 5kg from the top weight (61kg) and the bottom weight (56kg).

Perhaps Timeform was spot on with that Cup win in terms of 117 which was lowest rating for a Melbourne Cup winner since Brew (2000 - 114).

Australian racing is only good up to 1400m in terms of world standards when it comes to depth/quality in numbers

He was very well treated under the Quality hcp conditions. PRetty average run