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2022 Melbourne Cup Flemington

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Jamal View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jamal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 May 2022 at 10:09am
See link below - 2022 G1 Tenno Sho (3200m) in Japan. The winner produced a Timeflrm rating of 127.


I post this on here because maybe some of the runners behind the winner will come for the Melbourne Cup??

Cheers.
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Jamal View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Jamal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Jun 2022 at 1:03pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gay3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Jun 2022 at 12:06pm

Melbourne Cup nominations close in just over a month and one horse expected to be on the list is the Charlie Fellowes-trained Grand Alliance.

Inexperience cost the lightly raced son of Churchill when going down by a short head to Coolmore galloper Changingoftheguard in the Group 2 King Edward VII Stakes (2400m) during the Royal Ascot carnival.

Grand Alliance is being targeted at the Group 1 St Leger Stakes (2921m) at Doncaster on September 10 but Fellowes believes the Northern Hemisphere-bred three-year-old is an ideal candidate to give him an elusive first Melbourne Cup winner.

“I think the Melbourne Cup could potentially really suit him,” Fellowes said. “Northern Hemisphere three-year-olds have a big advantage and I’ve always felt you want a genuine European mile-and-a-half horse for the two-mile races because of how they pan out.

“He’s now Group-placed and it’ll be interesting to see what he’s rated but I don’t imagine he’ll be far off getting in.

“Having been a long way off being good enough before Ascot he’s right in the mix if the owners decide that’s the race to go for after the St Leger.”

CHANGINGOFTHEGUARD just sneaks home in the King Edward VII Stakes.

Another win for Ryan Moore… 🙌 pic.twitter.com/hz39lzUe26

— Ascot Racecourse (@Ascot) June 17, 2022

TAB.com.au have installed Grand Alliance as a $34 chance in their pre-nominations Melbourne Cup market.

Fellowes is a three-time placegetter in the Melbourne Cup with his star performer Prince Of Arran running third in 2018 and 2020 and second to Vow And Declare in 2019.

The popular young trainer said Grand Alliance has more natural talent than Prince Of Arran.

“They’re not overly dissimilar,” he said. “Prince Of Arran was a lazy so-and-so as well.

“He was quirky early on and took a long time for the penny to drop. They seem to like the same sort of tracks too.

“Grand Alliance is a tricky customer, he’s not straightforward and will always have that weakness but he’s clearly got tons of ability.

“Prince Of Arran got better and better and thrived down there but this guy is better up here.

“If he’s better than him in Australia he really would have a good chance if we went to the Melbourne Cup.” 

The funniest thing about this particular signature is that by the time you realise it doesn't say anything, it's too late to stop reading it.
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djebel View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Jun 2022 at 12:24pm
Carioca will be furious. 




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Jun 2022 at 1:22pm




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Jun 2022 at 1:27pm




reductio ad absurdum



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Jun 2022 at 1:49pm
Voyager,

What weight would you give Mojo Star, Grand Alliance and Camorra ?

Thanks
Matt.




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Carioca Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Jun 2022 at 1:54pm
Originally posted by djebel djebel wrote:

Carioca will be furious. 
He's welcome to come over , but if he puts this horses future first , he'll wait another year imo , on reflection his run in the Derby was ordinary , actually , quite ordinary from a cup point of view , 34/1 odds at present in the Cup ? kidding me ! LOLLOL another 100 points required there imo , btw , where's Westover ? he would carry this horse and win Wink probably Arc bound .
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Jun 2022 at 2:02pm
The Derby is his only poor performance so far.

His racing career began on 20th December last year. He has raced every month bar May. That must have stuffed him up leading into the Derby.

7 races in 7 months and he is being aimed at the Melbourne Cup. Smile




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Carioca Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Jun 2022 at 2:07pm
Blokes " talking him up " imo , he won't be here .
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Carioca Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Jun 2022 at 2:32pm
Originally posted by Carioca Carioca wrote:

Originally posted by djebel djebel wrote:

Carioca will be furious. 
He's welcome to come over , but if he puts this horses future first , he'll wait another year imo , on reflection his run in the Derby was ordinary , actually , quite ordinary from a cup point of view , 34/1 odds at present in the Cup ? kidding me ! LOLLOL another 100 points required there imo , btw , where's Westover ? he would carry this horse and win Wink probably Arc bound .
Just seen a replay of Westover winning the Irish Derby , " the most emphatic win in 15 years " according to the scribe . 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jul 2022 at 11:13am
Voyager, can you handicap Mojo Star, Grand Alliance, Camorra and now Coltrane please ?




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jul 2022 at 11:27am
Race 2 Coltrane





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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote VOYAGER Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jul 2022 at 10:24pm
Okay djebel this is what I have. The four horses, are, in my ratings, from highest to lowest rated.

1. Mojo Star
2. Coltrane
3. Camorra
4. Grand Alliance

Now by my weight allowances this is where they all sit at this point in time, on this date for the weights.

1. Mojo Star = 55 to 56kgs. His seconds in the Ascot Gold Cup (where Frankie slaughtered Stradivarius who should have clearly won), and also the St Leger is the superior form out of the four. He has carried 58.5kgs at Ascot and 57.5kgs in the St Leger and he has just fallen short so he drops in weight for a handicap, but he has proven competitive so he does only drop between 2.5kgs and 3kgs. He was off a 36 week break into Ascot and he looks to have matured since last year so I suppose you do have to include that in your weight allocation as well, so for me he should be getting 55.5kgs. That gives him his chance to win, and it also gives you room to add weight if he was to say add a group 1 win between now and September.

2. Coltrane = 53kgs to 54 kgs. Very nice win at Goodwood with the 58kgs. He is another like Mojo Star who looks as though he is maturing at the right time and with an extra four months under his belt and maybe 2 more runs and the trip to Australia, that is a good recipe for an improving type in the Melbourne Cup. The win was at Listed level so I have left some room, like with the previous runner to allocate more weight if he can add a group race to his resume, but right now he is a 53.5kgs, or 54kgs runner for me.

3. Camorra = 54. Good win in Ireland last start where he was dominant. Has raced some group 1 stayers, but not been tested in group 1 races. Has not been tested at 3200m yet so there is a gap in his form, but again he looks to be getting better as he ages.

4. Grand Alliance = 50 to 51.5kgs. His form is not quite up to that of the other northern hemisphere 3yo's who have come out so right now he should get the lower weight. However there is room for the handicapper to move if he can improve to either win or be competitive in the higher level of group racing. 

Personally I feel that this seasons classic winners in Australia were below standard (with the exception of Hitotsu) and so I would not give any of them anything above 52kgs, but of course because the handicapper still thinks the Australian derbies and oaks are a strong form reference for this race they will probably get 53 or 52 kgs. 


            
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jul 2022 at 2:59am
Thumbs Up Thanking you. 




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jamal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Jul 2022 at 12:12pm
Maybe a horse to keep an eye on? LOFT.

Won the Group 2 Belmont Gold Cup (3200m) on the 10th of June. The race is below:





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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Carioca Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Jul 2022 at 12:42pm
Nice time too , 3-16-68 . for the 2 mile.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Lord Hybrow Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Jul 2022 at 12:54pm
Loft is a German bred stayer just purchased by Ozzie Kehir & Edmund Lee and will be trained in Aust by Ben & JD Hayes.

The Belmont Gold Cup hasn’t been a great guide in the past, with recent winners like Red Cardinal & Amade not quite measuring up to top grade here in Australia.

Apparently Loft will have another start in the G2 Prix Kergolay in France next month before being shipped down here.  That race will be a better gauge on his Melb Cup credentials.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jamal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Jul 2022 at 1:07pm
At one stage Red Cardinal was the favourite for the Melbourne Cup a few months before the race.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jul 2022 at 9:34am




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jul 2022 at 9:40am
Originally posted by Lord Hybrow Lord Hybrow wrote:

Loft is a German bred stayer just purchased by Ozzie Kehir & Edmund Lee and will be trained in Aust by Ben & JD Hayes.

The Belmont Gold Cup hasn’t been a great guide in the past, with recent winners like Red Cardinal & Amade not quite measuring up to top grade here in Australia.

Apparently Loft will have another start in the G2 Prix Kergolay in France next month before being shipped down here.  That race will be a better gauge on his Melb Cup credentials.







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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Jul 2022 at 10:40am
I am sure somebody opened a thread about this guy when Gai bought him ?

I am stuffed if I can find it.



Boughey taking Joseph O'Brien route to the St Leger with Cup hope Hoo Ya Mal



By Scott Burton

George Boughey is set to take inspiration from fellow young-gun trainer Joseph O'Brien in using the Cazoo St Leger as a potential springboard for the Lexus Melbourne Cup with Hoo Ya Mal.

The Derby runner-up was sold to an Australian syndicate led by Sir Owen Glenn for £1.2 million at the eve-of-Ascot Goffs London Sale and will be heading to join the training tandem of Gai Waterhouse and Adrian Bott for the latter half of the Melbourne Spring Carnival.

Waterhouse told the Racing Post last weekend that "the Melbourne Cup is the dream" with Hoo Ya Mal, who was last seen running second to Desert Crown in the Derby at odds of 150-1 for Ahmad Al Shaikh and Andrew Balding.

However, the son of Territories was the surprise name among 27 entries for the St Leger on Tuesday and will be trained for the race by Boughey, who is a big believer in the O'Brien method with three-year-olds en route to Flemington.

"He's a horse who Gai and Adrian have bought to step up to two miles with in Australia," said Boughey. "It's well documented that Joseph O'Brien has been the master of taking them down there and winning as three-year-olds.

"He went via the St Leger route, whether it be the Irish or the English, and I just think that stretching him out that far before he goes is key.

"Personally, before I knew the horse, I doubted whether he would stay the Derby trip, but he got a beautiful ride and settled very well. I think that's the way with him, he needs to be ridden to finish and that's probably what we'll do going forward.

"The first target is probably the Gordon Stakes at Goodwood. It's not set in stone, but it's the logical place for a horse who's been runner-up in a Derby.

"His work's been pleasing us and William Buick sat on him yesterday morning so working back from Goodwood is the first plan."





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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bombers41 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Jul 2022 at 6:15am
Surely Kyprios has to be right in calculations - especially if he betas Stradivarious again in the Goodwood Cup on Tuesday - I will be watching closely...30/1 still available on betfair....

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Jul 2022 at 1:55pm
He goes to the Irish St Leger next time out. Hopefully that is a lead up for the Melbourne Cup.




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Jul 2022 at 4:22pm




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote Foxseal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Jul 2022 at 5:06pm
Has Godolphin indicated whether they will being UK horses to Melb for the Cups?

Noticed Charlie Appleby has a horse called Secret State running in a nondescript 3yo handicap at Goodwood tonight.  Currently $25 in Melb Cup betting.  Race at the watchable time of 10.50pm so might check him out.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Foxseal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Jul 2022 at 2:52pm
That horse of Charlie Appleby’s I mentioned in yesterday’s post won overnight at Goodwood - Secret State.

Didn’t watch the telecast live, but was there any post race interview with Charlie about the potential of a trip to Melbourne?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rhino Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Jul 2022 at 3:09pm
Well spotted Foxseal. Backable odds as well. Hope you got on. 

This is all I could find:

Wednesday: Goodwood

Secret State may have earned the chance to avenge his dam and claim a Classic victory after scoring an impressive success in the 1m4f handicap.

His odds for the Cazoo St Leger were slashed to 8-1 (from 12-1) after he defied top weight to complete a four-timer.

In 2010, Jacqueline Quest sprang a huge shock when passing the post first in the 1,000 Guineas at 66-1, only to be demoted as she hung right and interfered with runner-up Special Duty, who was controversially awarded the race.

Twelve years later, her son Secret State hung left in the closing stages of this £50,000 event but he was clear of his rivals and ran out a ready length-and-a-quarter winner under William Buick.

The 11-4 favourite, who won the King George V Handicap at Royal Ascot last month, will step up to 1m6f in the St Leger and his jockey said: "He stays well. You'd think he would step up in trip in time. He's very genuine and I'm not quite sure why he hung left today. It's the first time he's been on the track, so that's maybe why."

Trainer Charlie Appleby won the St Leger last year with Hurricane Lane and is now eyeing a key trial for his latest Classic hopeful.

"I think probably the most logical step now is to head to the Great Voltigeur with him," he said. "He's most definitely improving with each run. We came here with a lot of confidence. The Royal Ascot form has worked out very well and he's done nothing but improve throughout the early summer."

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote VOYAGER Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Jul 2022 at 3:44pm
I know it will not happen, but if the VRC want to upstage the Everest, they need to move heaven and earth to get Stradivarius out for the cup.

This horse would generate as much publicity as Phar Lap did in America after his one victory!

He would still be a hope with 60kgs wouldn't he?

Okay that is the end of the dream, back to reality.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Afros Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Jul 2022 at 7:03pm
I get your point Voyager, but as much as racing fans such as ourselves would be excited to see him here, the stark reality is that the average person on the street would not know who he is or even get any more excited about him than any other European horse in the race.
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