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2021-22 Racing Season

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote furious Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Oct 2021 at 11:25am

Well we have an exceptional crop of three year old colts.  Both sprinting and middle distance.  Will a colt step up and prove a major staying three year old?

Profondo has won a G1 over 2000m at only his third start.  A drop deed gorgeous colt with amazing ability as yet untapped he could be the later middle distance runner from this crop.  But we have the VRC Derby coming up and it doesn’t look like Anamoe or Artorius will go that way.  My thoughts say both could get the trip on class alone.

But what a dept we owe to Danehill.  Look at the above pedigrees

Anamoe – Street Boss (Mr Prospector line) from a Redoute’s Choice (Danehill line) mare

Profondo – Deep Impact (Sunday Silence sire son) from a Redoute’s Choice (Danehill line) mare

Paulele – Dawn Approach (Sadler’s Wells line) from a Flying Spur (Danehill line) mare

Captivant – Capitalist (Written Tycoon sire son) from a Commands (danehill line) mare

Artorius – Flying Artie (Sadler’s wells line) from a Redoute’s Choice (Danehill line) mare

In the Congo – Snitzel (Redoute’s Choice sire son from Danehill line) from a Var (Storm Cat line) mare

Home Affairs – I am Invincble (Green Desert line) from a Flying Spur (Danehill line) mare

I could of added colts like Tiger of Malay (Danehill line), Coastwatch (Danehill line), Bruckner (Danehill line), Remarque (Danehill line), Royalzel (Danehill line), Hilal (Danehill line), Mr Mozart (Danehill line), Ranch Hand (Danehill line), Military Expert (Danehill line) or yesterdays SA stakeswinner Cerberus (also out of a Danehill line mare)

There are of course a few not with that immediate Danehill cross.  Lightsaber has shown very good speed and he’s from the Encosta line out of a a Dream Ahead (Warning line) mare.  But let’s face it he inbred 4m x 4f to Danehill.

Asterns best son Brigantine is inbred to Sadler’s Wells as is his stablemate Alegron.  Both also carry an inbreeding to Danehill’s sire Danzig so the while Alegron’s sire Teofilo is out of a Danehill mare.

We are so used to the sireline being on top and with the start to the season Snitzel has made he will be hard to beat - Everest or no Everest - but there is no denying that the cream of the crop have the line in their pedigree.

Similar statistics are there with every colt above having one or two or more Golden Slipper winners in their pedigrees -

Anamoe – Canny Lad

Profondo – Canny Lad

Paulele – Flying Spur

Captivant – Capitalist, Luskin Star, Marscay, Vain

Artorius – Canny Lad

In the Congo – Canny Lad

Home Affairs – Canny Lad, Flying Spur

While yesterday they were praising the efforts of Stallions who have won the Caulfield Guineas so their representative in the above are –

Anamoe – Redoute’s Choice

Profondo – Redoute’s Choice

Paulele – nil

Captivant – Luskin Star, Vain

Artorius – Redoute’s Choice

In the Congo – Redoute’s Choice

Home Affairs – nil

And if a temperature hadn’t stopped him in his tracks the mighty Redoute’s would of won the Golden Slipper also.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote furious Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Oct 2021 at 11:42am
While looking to the VRC Derby.  Last season saw the first five across the line all carrying Luskin Star in their pedigree.  Don't know if he can keep up that record but horses like Gundec, El Patroness, Teewaters, Cerberus, Villaden etc all fit the bill.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Carioca Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Oct 2021 at 11:51am
Good reading furious , thanks , just a little triv. for you Smile 67 years ago last month the first of the lovely Star Kingdoms trialled at Randwick , Kingster won the Breeders and Ultrablue the Gimcrack , time goes so quick .
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote furious Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Oct 2021 at 1:01pm
It was a match made in heaven for Danehill when he arrived Carioca.  I think Star Kingdom was his kick starter.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote furious Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Oct 2021 at 9:20am
Had to laugh today with a race download from France.  Winner out of a Choisir mare,  2nd our of a So You THink mare, 4th by Starspangledbanner.  It's a very small world we are living in.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote furious Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Oct 2021 at 10:07am
Ok over the last few years many have bemoaned hard track as a disaster for horses.  Probably there are plenty who go sore but have to name a couple of WA horses from their black type races from the last couple of weeks.

Many here still look at Redoute's Choice as 2yo speed.  Well over in the west the old marvel Rock Magic at 12 years of age is still up there running and placing in stakes events.  The other old timer Luke's Gold by Fath was stakes placed this weekend as a 9yo.

After 61 starts (mostly on good 4 or 3's) Rock Magic is still putting in.  Must of legs of steel.

Luke's Gold has raced 66 times in a shorter time frame.  He had a suspension back in 2018 for unsoundness.  Must of been a minor problem.

One could also bring soundness into the story of State of Gold.  His grandam is a mare called It's in the Air a Co-Champion 2yo filly of her year in the USA.  She raced into her 5th year having 43 starts for 16 wins including the Vanity H (G1) twice, Ruffian H (G1, Alabama S (G1), Delaware Oaks (G1) etc.

Our Champion mare Winx also had 43 starts.  While our modern day champs Nature Strip and Verry Elleegant are both up to 33 starts.

If you race in Sydney at that top class you pretty well have to handle the wet also.  I don't know but a sticky wet track would be hard on the old legs also I would think.  Also more chance of putting your leg down in a hole or breathing in a clod.

I wouldn't want to be a track manager for quids.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gay3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Oct 2021 at 11:22am
Structures adapt to conditioning & is why shin soreness occurs but once it's fully done,there's rarely a problem as long as the surfaces trained & raced on remain the same.
How often do we see horses injured that have raced or been prepped during a wet winter, go amiss on our quickly drying Spring tracks? Bear in mind we only hear about the better ones too.
WA has a far more stable climate than the other States & I'd love to see a comparative breakdown of injury rates between the States Metrop. jurisdictions with time of year included.

The funniest thing about this particular signature is that by the time you realise it doesn't say anything, it's too late to stop reading it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote furious Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Nov 2021 at 4:59pm
Versatility as a sire is often not looked into.  But today Swats That by Shamus Award finished second in the Darley Sprint Classic over 1200m.  Less that a week after another Shamus Award went in a different direction and finished second in the Melbourne Cup over 3200m.

While Shamus Award has had most of his stakes horses win or place in the 1600m to 3200m events this season he is a son of Snitzel who usually throws brilliant speed but  obviously has stamina is there somewhere as there are a couple of his sons who can get them to go over a trip.  Sizzling with fewer runners and obviously lesser mares and Shamus Award have both bot a good middle distance horse.

I'm not sure but I think maybe Trapeze Artist is another who could go down that path of throwing both speed and stamina.  One of his closer relatives is Planet Kingdom who was one of our best sires for middle distance gallopers back in the late 1970's and 1980's.  But he could also get a brilliant miler which is the standard distance for most of this immediate family.

But brilliant milers are still our best chance for getting fast stayers.  So I'm hoping Trapeze Artist continues on and becomes another sire son of Snitzel who challenges all the imports filling up our stables!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote furious Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Nov 2021 at 5:36pm

I love to look into pedigrees and see just what is in there of interest.  Of course there are pedigrees I don’t know much about and if you’d asked me I don’t think I would of thought Extreme Choice would of done as much as he had at stud.  Yes a great little racehorse but very fleetingly on the scene.

Now I love his little sire with his ability to throw some very pretty horses with their flaxen manes and tails.  But he was far more than that siring many horses that had far greater racing careers than he did.  Although I always loved Redoute’s Choice and Not a Single Doubt was from his first crop and his first stakes winner.  With the record in the past few seasons of his sons and daughters no doubt Not a Single Doubt’s blood will be around for many years to come.

A grandson of Easy Date he is the ideal cross for mares carrying Snippets or Lunchtime (sire of Snippets and already sitting there through Canny Lad).  Champagne Cuddles probably comes to mind easiest with her 3f x 3m cross to Easy Date.  But the tiny Miracles of Life was 3f x 4m to Snippets.  While Lunchtime figures in another favourite Single Gaze. 

But I knew next to nothing about Extremely’s family so decided to take a look.

Hussonet has already proven himself in Australia.   The imported Going to Extremes won at G3 level on the turf and had five Australian foals who were named and a further two USA named foals and one Japanese bred named foal.  Nothing in her produce suggests we would see Extreme Choice appear from one of her daughters.  The best was a Host breed gelding who one 6 races and $88K.  Extremely didn’t help her record as she was unraced.

Didn’t know much about Nasty and Bold the sire of Going to Extremes.  But he at least was a G1 winner out over 1 ½ miles while his best appears to be G1 winner Miss Josh who also made her way to Australia and performed worst than Going to Extremes.  But interestingly her Australian bred daughter Highland Lights has produced a G2 winner Our Abbadean in New Zealand.  While another daughter has a bred a WA Listed winner.  So maybe it takes a generation for the USA dirt to get out of the system?

The next dam Old Bow Wower had 12 wins and some minor black type places and is by the Princequillo line sire Old Bob Bowers.  Old Bob Bowers claim to fame was siring the John Henry a tough and guts gelding with 39 wins to his name including 11 G1’s.  He is inbred to Bull Dog and Blue Larkspur (so nice to see a goodly some of Carbine, Trenton and Darebin in his pedigree).

We are starting to get back and still no sign of where Extreme Choice came from.  The next dam is Sweet Endeavour – unplaced.  A daughter of the Argentinian bred Endeavour from the Colombo sireline.  His dam is by Selene’s son Hunter’s Moon.  I guess you could say a good outcross for Australia with that touch of Selene’s blood.

We are back to Extreme Choices 5th dam Sweet Talk with 6 wins and minor stakes placing.  A daughter of Alibhai a son of Hyperion.  Are we are getting back to more familiar bloodlines.

Are back to the 6th dam Good Thing and I think we hit paydirt.  She was the dam of a Hall of Famer in Bed O’ Roses with 18 wins including plenty of G1’s and Champion Two year old Filly, Champion Handicap Mare etc.  Good Think herself won 7 races and stakes placed.  She was  by Discovery from the Fair Play sireline.  Discovery decends from the Darebin (AUS) mare Kildeer and was the 1935 Horse of the Year, Hall of Famer and called the Iron Horse.  His daughters produced Native Dancer and Bold Ruler so plenty of Discovery blood still around.

And now it just keeps coming.  The next dam Little Sleeper was a full sister to twice Horse of the Year in the USA Challedon.  They were by Challenger (Swynford line sire) Yes that is blood we have in plenty.  While their dam was by Sir Gallahad a son of great mare Plucky Liege a granddaughter of Carbine.

I won’t go any further.  But do you know my favourite find in Extreme Choices pedigree is a little needy called Knight Errant.  A son of the great Trenton (who I didn’t know about) Knight Errants claim to fame was jumping a fence and siring Roamer from a blind English mare.  Roamer raced as a gelding due to the fear he would turn out like his sire but went on to win 39 races being both Champion 3yo and Horse of the Year.  And also is a Hall of Famer.

The funny this is Lady Errant his daughter and 10th dam of Extreme Choice definitely threw to the stamina of Trenton.  She won a stakes event over 2 ¼ miles.  Good old Trenton knew how to sire a stayer.

So like many of our Australian speed demons of today.  Extreme Choice goes back to some pretty decent middle to long distance performers.  Some of whom have plenty of Australian and New Zealand blood in them.

 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote furious Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Nov 2021 at 3:13pm
Now here is a good one to show how genetics are so muddled in the modern thoroughbred.  A 2yo stakes race in NZ on Saturday has Tap Dancer having her first start.

Tap Dancer is by Preferment who had his first run as a July 2yo going on to win the VRC Derby, Australian Cup, Tancred etc.  The dam started even later as a feb 2yo.  She was Australian bred also being a daughter of Sepoy (a top class 2yo) but Happy Feet herself was a 6 time starter and finished around the tail of the field every time.

Now Preferment has Better Alternative a daughter of a Golden Slipper winner in Flying Spur from a mare by another Golden Slipper winner in Canny Lad.  So speed is in his pedigree although he threw to his sire's Zabeel stamina.  Although Zabeel had been a top class miler.

From all this we have a two year old running in an early 2yo stakes event.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Nov 2021 at 6:09pm

Two Year Old Pool – The Shallow End?

Tara Madgwick - Wednesday November 10

The running of the $1million ATC Golden Gift last weekend and the announcement of an increase in prizemoney for the Group I ATC Golden Slipper to $5million in 2022 got us thinking about two year-old racing and how small a percentage of the horse population is actually capable of contesting these races.

The table below shows the number of commercially bred yearlings that were offered at dedicated yearling sales each year (no online), and how many of them had raced up to the weekend after the Cup, Dec 31 and Feb 28.
 

Year

Yearlings

To Wk2 Nov

To Dec 31

To Feb 28

To Jul 30

2021

6600

153 (2.3%)

 

 

 

2020

6725

163 (2.4)

339 (5.0%)

685 (10.2%)

1781 (26.5%)

2019

6881

114 (1.7)

319 (4.6)

635 (9.2)

1794 (26.1)

2018

6769

118 (1.7)

323 (4.8)

629 (9.3)

1793 (26.5)

2017

6532

158 (2.4)

365 (5.6)

654 (10.0)

1693 (25.9)

2016

6636

172 (2.6)

396 (6.0)

684 (10.3)

1681 (25.3)

2015

6704

178 (2.7)

400 (6.0)

710 (10.6)

1734 (25.9)

2014

6801

132 (1.9)

360 (5.3)

653 (9.6)

1657 (24.4)

2013

6699

159 (2.4)

359 (5.4)

631 (9.4)

1592 (23.8)

2012

6927

158 (2.3)

383 (5.5)

704 (10.2)

1749 (25.2)


The figures in the table above show that by the time the Magic Millions 2YO Classic is run and the field for the Golden Slipper is assembled we have seen only 10% of the yearlings offered for sale on the racetrack.

And by the end of the season we’ve seen about a quarter of them with the vast majority still awaiting maturity to show their potential.

By the end of their three year-old season the tide has turned and the vast majority of horses have shown their hand with up to 85% of them having raced.
 

Year

Yearlings

To Jul 30 (2YO)

To Next July 30 (3YO)

2021

6600

 

 

2020

6725

1781 (26.5%)

 

2019

6881

1794 (26.1)

5893 (85.6%)

2018

6769

1793 (26.5)

5751 (85.0)

2017

6532

1693 (25.9)

5527 (84.6)

2016

6636

1681 (25.3)

5396 (81.3)

2015

6704

1734 (25.9)

5474 (81.7)

2014

6801

1657 (24.4)

5353 (78.7)

2013

6699

1592 (23.8)

5206 (77.7)

2012

6927

1749 (25.2)

5546 (80.0)



This explains why certain stallions that consistently produce early maturing stock find favour in the marketplace as breeders and yearling buyers try to shorten their odds of jagging that rare creature – the natural two year-old runner.

Capitalist won the Breeders Plate, Magic Millions 2YO Classic and Golden Slipper - great example of a natural 2YO talent and now a leading sire.

Capitalist won the Breeders Plate, Magic Millions 2YO Classic and Golden Slipper - great example of a natural 2YO talent and now a leading sire.



They are out there… we’ve all seen them and they invariably stand out from the crowd as soon as they are broken in.

They are the horses that adapt well to change, thrive on work and have the size, strength and toughness to withstand early training.

They are physically and mentally mature beyond their actual age and while their peers invariably catch up to them and frequently run straight past them at three, they have the unique opportunity to run for huge prizemoney against a very small pool of adversaries.

Horses contesting races such as The Everest, Cox Plate and Melbourne Cup might be able to return year after year for a crack at the same prize, but they also have to face the very best opposition, often sourced from all over the world, making these races much harder to win.

There is a justified place for two year-old racing and two year-old sires in our vibrant and successful Australian breeding and racing industry, but let’s not ever lose sight of the fact that it is a small, but integral part of a far bigger picture.
 
The introduction of a race like the soon to be $8million ATC Golden Eagle (1500m) for four year-olds is a ground breaking race where we can actually expect to see the very best horses from a generation, barring those that have already been packed off to stud following Group I success at either two or three.

Below is a table of the top Southern Hemisphere bred money earners in Australia this season and the month in which they made their debut.

 

Horse

Sire

MoneyWon

Debut

Foaling

Debut Age

Nature Strip

Nicconi

8129100

2017-10-10

2014

Oct 3yo

Verry Elleegant

Zed

5699000

2018-07-07

2015

Jul 2yo

Incentivise

Shamus Award

5454200

2020-08-19

2016

Aug 4yo

I'm Thunderstruck

Shocking

4792750

2021-01-13

2017

Jan 3yo

Masked Crusader

Toronado (IRE)

2732000

2019-11-28

2016

Nov 3yo

Eduardo

Host (Chi)

2270000

2018-06-18

2013

Jun 4yo

Anamoe

Street Boss (USA)

2264850

2020-10-10

2018

Oct 2yo

Superstorm

Sebring

1737100

2019-08-31

2016

Aug 3yo

Think It Over

So You Think

1690250

2018-12-08

2015

Dec 3yo

Count De Rupee

Real Impact (Jpn)

1610750

2020-08-06

2017

Aug 3yo

Home Affairs

I Am Invincible

1444100

2021-01-30

2018

Jan 2yo

Icebath

Sacred Falls

1407250

2019-02-16

2016

Feb 2yo

Hitotsu

Maurice (Jpn)

1268750

2021-02-06

2018

Feb 2yo

Nonconformist

Rebel Raider

1229250

2019-11-28

2016

Nov 3yo

Lost And Running

Per Incanto (USA)

1217250

2020-05-15

2016

May 3yo



Below is a table of the top Southern Hemisphere bred money earners in Australia last season and the month in which they made their debut.
 

Horse

Sire

MoneyWon

Debut

Foaling

Debut Age

Classique Legend

Not A Single Doubt

7132000

2019-02-20

2015

Feb 3yo

Verry Elleegant

Zed

5462050

2018-07-07

2015

Jul 2yo

Colette

Hallowed Crown

4457575

2019-12-08

2016

Dec 3yo

Bivouac

Exceed And Excel

3452600

2018-10-20

2016

Oct 2yo

Nature Strip

Nicconi

2882650

2017-10-10

2014

Oct 3yo

Icebath

Sacred Falls

2242600

2019-02-16

2016

Feb 2yo

Eduardo

Host (Chi)

2242350

2018-06-18

2013

Jun 4yo

Stay Inside

Extreme Choice

2237350

2021-01-23

2018

Jan 2yo

Arcadia Queen

Pierro

2206250

2018-09-19

2015

Sep 3yo

Gytrash

Lope De Vega (IRE)

2005225

2018-02-17

2015

Feb 2yo

Ole Kirk

Written Tycoon

1989050

2020-02-15

2017

Feb 2yo

Tofane

Ocean Park

1800750

2019-03-19

2015

Mar 3yo

Explosive Jack

Jakkalberry (IRE)

1789730

2020-11-25

2017

Nov 3yo

Anamoe

Street Boss (USA)

1737075

2020-10-10

2018

Oct 2yo

 




reductio ad absurdum



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote furious Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Nov 2021 at 6:24am
Yes they run more of their two year olds in Europe than we do.  Don't think it hurt Anamoe any.  And if your horse is a two year old early comer and you don't race the late maturers can catch and pass you pretty quickly.

That said if the horse isn't ready it's easy not to race.  But if the later maturing types in Europe are out and running at least as late two year olds in England - we in the so called land of speed must have failed big time to have so few up and running.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote furious Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Nov 2021 at 6:31am
And also having said that the trainers from Europe in Australia do get them up and running.  Social media has a lot to answer for.

I do meetings in Enland, late in the season about the equivalent of April/May,  where there can be six or seven two year old races - over every distance and all with decent fields.  Now we might have as many races spread over Australia for two year olds in April but most are below 1600m.  These English staying 2yo year olds are out over 2000m.

I know our racing is different.  Our training is different.  I've been to Newmarket and Chantilly and have seen the beautiful training set ups that their horses thrive in.  But come on - we are being left behind.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Carioca Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Nov 2021 at 12:29pm
Never stopped our champions from the past furious to develope and show their ability around the world , from Carbine to Phar Lap to Shannon and everything in between , like anything in competitive sport whether it be swimming , golf , tennis , boxing and athletics , IF your got it , your got it know matter what conditions you train under imo. Cheers .
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gay3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Nov 2021 at 1:19pm
The difference then compared to now Carioca, is the huge discrepency in prizemoney & it's been proven time & again you don't race turf horses on dirt at the elite level if you've an once of commonsense.
The funniest thing about this particular signature is that by the time you realise it doesn't say anything, it's too late to stop reading it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Nov 2021 at 2:39pm
Interesting Gay, The star White filly in Japan whose name escapes me right now, her next start is scheduled to be on dirt I believe. 




reductio ad absurdum



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Carioca Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Nov 2021 at 3:28pm
Originally posted by Gay3 Gay3 wrote:

The difference then compared to now Carioca, is the huge discrepency in prizemoney & it's been proven time & again you don't race turf horses on dirt at the elite level if you've an once of commonsense.
Gay3 LOL was this post meant for me ? can you add a little bit more please , can't make head nor tail .Smile
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote furious Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Nov 2021 at 3:47pm
Look I don't know about the differences between turf and grass.  Obviously there are some.  I sometimes wonder when a none descript USA mare comes up with a grandson like Extreme CHoice.  Sure she had some ability.  But could it be some of these are actually grass horses forced to run on dirt for the extra money and they come to Australia and find the tracks they need.  Or is it the different mare population, or sire population which suits their families!

I don't know.  I can only observe and like the above dive into a pedigree and try to make out what makes a family I know nothing about tick.

It is so much easier when an Anamoe crops up with his female line having performed in Australia from day one and Street Boss (Street Cry), Redoute's Choice, Whiskey Road, Sovereign Edition, Hermes, Summertime, Foxbridge, Lucullus (an earlier German import into NZ) and earlier Traducer who was a pretty outstanding sire in NZ and got the dam of Darebin who took the blood back overseas.

From Foxbridge on up to Anamoe not a misstep in sire choice.  A very nice group.

But after Hussonet - Nasty and Bold, Ole Bob Bowers, Endeavour didn't strike me a outstanding sires.  Yet the stakes winners got better as you got back into the line with Alibhai, Discovery, Challenger, Sir Gallahad etc.  So the family must of been crying out for all the Hyperion, Swynford backgrounds in so many of our mares.

History may not repeat itself but if you can't find anything close in a pedigree look back and find what the female line actually works with.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote furious Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Nov 2021 at 3:49pm
Forgot to add then hope like anything the class hasn't left the building.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote furious Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Nov 2021 at 3:34pm
Ok elsewhere in a thread we were talking about handicapping.

Now let me say I don't understand handicapping in the slightest.  And one of the reasons ran today in the Hunter.

1st and 3rd have very similar backgrounds one in Australia and one in England.  Top Ranked (Top Rank overseas) had 13 starts for 6 wins 1 second and 1 third.  Like Lost and Running he won his first four starts with 58, 60.5, 55.5 and 63 kg.  After a third he won the G3 Superior Mile with 58.5.  THen came a 6th in a G2.  He came out next to win the LR Doncaster Mile with 59.5 and finish 3rd in the G1 Lockinge S with 57.  Then 6th in a G1 with 57, 2nd LR with 62, 4th in a G2 with 57.5 and now third at first run her with 58.

How similar a story to Lost and RUnning's record of 12 starts 7 wins, and 2 places.  Lost and Running won his first four starts with 58, 57, 59.5 and 60.  THen came a 2nd with 59, 1st with 58.5 and a LR 1st with 53.5 (massive drop there compared with English rival with his 59.5 in the LR win and 58.5 in his G3 win).  THen this season 8th G2 55, 4th G2 58.5, 4th Everest 58.5 and 2nd Classique 56.

Now I ask you the English horse comes out with a G3 and LR win and a G1 and LR place and another G2 4th to his name and gives weight to a LR winner who carried a lot less to win that race than his English competitor.

So the Aussie/NZ'er with the lesser record gets more weight and yes wins.  Yet people here constantly run down our horses and say the form in Europe is superior.  I say this boy makes that arguement a tad iffy.  Or our handicap has the idea our horses are superior and weights accordingly.  Otherwise the Englsh horse should of been top weight.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote furious Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Nov 2021 at 3:35pm
that should read 3 thirds by the way for Top Ranked.  Sorry.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote furious Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Dec 2021 at 10:02am
Lets hope the second half of the season runs smoothly.  Best wishes to all for Christmas tomorrow.  HOpe its a good one for you all.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote furious Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Jan 2022 at 7:38am
It's the Magic Millions races this weekend and once again local stallions come out on top for the two and three year old races.  But very few would of seen the local lads sharing the top numbers in the two year old race.  The Mission and Heroic Valour have Russian Revolution beating them if you include the Emergencies.  But without a doubt the favourite Coolangatta will take some beating.  The interesting thing in not one of the second season sires have a runner in this two year old race.  A very strange turn around for such a strong group.

That is changed in the three year old race with Star Turn (2), Capitalist (2) and Flying Artie all have at least runner.  While Piping Hot the dam of the favourite in the two year old race also has Snitzonfire running in the three year old race.  I am Invincible has the number in this one though with three listed.  There is even an unbeaten runner to add interest into this mix.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote furious Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Jan 2022 at 9:14am
The second horse Russian Conquest has an interesting pedigree mix.

He decends from a grand mare called Marquerite dam of four stakes winners including the triple crown winner Gallant Fox.

Now we all know Russian Conquest decends from a fine broodmare in Ciboulette (alongs with Flying Spur and Encosta de Lago).  Now Ciboulette could be a key here.  She is by Chop Chop and grandson of Gallant Fox.  Makes for a interesting pedigree.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote furious Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Jan 2022 at 9:26am
And no I didn't mark it to follow! 

 But that is one of the reasons it's not a bad idea to find out what worked with the best in a family.  Or what was the best in a family.  You just never know.  Now there is a fair bit of the Ciboulette family in Australia thanks no doubt to Rolls producing Flying Spur and being grandam of Encosta de Lago.  But that brings up two stallions to look for in broodmares to cross to Russian Revolution.

You can learn a lot not just relying on what is on the page in front of you.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote furious Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Jan 2022 at 9:49am
Didn't have too bad a day for picks over the years racing at the MM carnival yesterday.  First race 2nd, the Bigboyroy (Juliet) won, Away Game was third, Socialist 3rd, and the my 2nd Juliet runner Wisdom of Water won.

Devil's Throat 4f x 4f to Dancing Show from her female line.

Bigboyroy (Juliet line horse) I do try and find them

Away Game picked her dam from the sales and this one by Snitzel so followed

Socialist f x m to Danehill and f x m to Marscay

Wisdom of Water (Juliet) what can I say.  I've followed stakes winners for almost 60 years and her line is very good at getting them!


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote furious Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Feb 2022 at 7:14am
Have you heard or seen the adds for the up coming Karaka Sales.

NZ are crowing about their superior record for numbers against runners in Australian stakes races.  They fail to point out that they send their cream of the crop across here each season and leave the also rans at home!

 They also fail to point out that fewer already tested Australian gallopers head over the sea in their direction (money isn't worth it) but from the yearlings bought to race over there we have a pretty good record in their stakes races.

No I'm just a bit fed up with their adds crowing about their superiority at the moment.  They breed wonderful animals and so do we.  When we have a Winx, Black Caviar, Kingston Town we are on top.  When they have a VEllegant, Sunline etc they are on top.  Our bloodlines are mixed and do mix very well.  

Just advertise the very good animal you breed without going into trying to prove your better than your neighbour!


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote furious Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Mar 2022 at 2:17pm
Coming up to the Slipper and I'm still in the dark but have a sneaking regard for the Sebring colt Sejardan.  I followed a few Sebring's from last years sales but missed this boy even though he has a pedigree which I admire.  Love the Rolls 4m x 5f.  And talk about being bred for this seasons - Sebring, More than Ready, Hinchinbrook (1/2 to Snitzel), Snippets, Encosta de Lago.  If he couldn't go in the wet there would be something wrong with him.

Coolangatta has been the benchmark 2yo up till now but her trainer is talking down her ability to handle the wet tracks. There is enough in her pedigree - More than Ready and Kenmare - to say she'll have a go but probably won't have her brilliance on a really heavy track.  And Sejardan is up and running and fit for it.

Likewise Fireburn has More Than Ready sitting in her pedigree although it's touch and go if a So You THink can handle the wet.  THis one seems to.  While Promitto's sire has Encosta de Lago as the sire of his dam.

Then we have Daumier with his dam by Street Cry you would think a wet track would be no issue.  We all remember Winx flying through the mud. 

You would think anything from the Snitzel line would go ok and that brings in quite a few  Russian Revolutions.

But for all that I having a year where I can't make my mind up.  Who knows in two weeks we could get a good track.  I'm not expecting it though.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote furious Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Mar 2022 at 2:20pm
Oh and I forgot Magic who made a good impression a week or so ago.  Son of Snitzel should eat the mud up and still have a turn of foot.  Only trouble is - can he compete with a fully fit Sejardan.  Most of my thoughts lead back to him.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote VOYAGER Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Mar 2022 at 11:59pm
Don't worry furious if the breeding buffs are having trouble, then the form analysts are doing just as tough.

I know he will not make the field but I would have loved to see Wallers Showcourt in the slipper1 He would have won the Todman with better luck and he looks a top hope for both the Sires and Champagne Stakes.

I am starting to think Daumier can at least place. Fully fit and he can take up a close spot of he draws well.

Seven Veils and Dashing Legend have good substance to their form, but Dashing Legend wont be there.

Sejardan won well and he has to be in the top four or five at this point. 

I know the stable have a knack of doing the unexpected, but seriously if Coolangatta wins the slipper, after not having a run since the Magic Millions, this stable is the best training duo I have ever seen. 
Remember, it might take intelligence to be smart , but it takes experience to be wise
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