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Winx |
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Lordy
Champion Joined: 22 May 2010 Location: Sunshine State Status: Offline Points: 13887 |
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I reckon Might and Power would have given her something to catch.
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therealkramer
Champion Joined: 12 Feb 2014 Status: Offline Points: 2026 |
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Once that hack Moreira aka the Happy Valley Donut King, got off her back it's been onwards and upwards.
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3blindmice
Champion Joined: 22 Oct 2012 Status: Offline Points: 18105 |
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Serious injuries with long periods out not a fair excuse for you Tlaz? Which are the "not legitimate" excuses? Do you reckon Winx is on Lasix? How would Winx go if asked to carry level weights at WFA? Probably (?), well possibly given her tenacity, loses a coupe of races in Sydney and almost certainly unlikely to have beaten Humidor last year's CP, although we'll never know. Which is the way it should be. And, I'm not knocking her in the least.
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3blindmice
Champion Joined: 22 Oct 2012 Status: Offline Points: 18105 |
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KT won from 1200m to 3200m and should have won our greatest handicap carrying 59kg, something Winx will never be asked to do let alone achieve. Different horses, different options, different eras. Both Champions of our turf irrespective of what happens to Winx from this point.
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maccamax
Champion Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Status: Offline Points: 41473 |
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Might & Power was an Epsom Failure. Winx Won both the big Rdwick Miles. We are all crazy when we start comparing the top horses of different era's Lordy . I always say The Buffs best run ever ( in my mind ) Was When he was gallant in defeat in the Stradbroke . The weight difference crucified him but he tried so hard. Another underestimated one was Northerly , Winx reminds me of him. He did whatever had to be done .. Walk and then fly or break the course record if he had to. I go back a long way and it's sad to say anything is better than Bernborough, Comic Court , Todman , Tulloch , Manikato , Vain , Kingston Town, Makybe Diva, Black Caviar etc . Better stop or I'll cry. I forgot Rainbird = 1st one to win the Cup after WW2. |
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Balciano
Champion Joined: 09 Nov 2016 Status: Offline Points: 860 |
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Agree with this Ada Hunter. Kingston Towns acceleration in the Autumn/Spring of 1980 was something to behold. The way he put good horses away in the space of 2 or 3 strides was ridiculous. The Guineas/Tancred/Derby/Sydney Cup were carbon copies of each other. As an older horse, after his suspensory ligament issues he was still a champion, but the turn of foot wasn't quite there with the rare exception like the 1981 George Main. He's similar in that regard to Manikato, who people tend to recall as a warhorse who won his races on grit and heart alone. But like the King, prior to his bleeding attack/heart attack/leg issues, he was a brilliant galloper who would decimate fields. I recall him winning a George Ryder by 6 or 7 lengths, something I never thought we'd see again. The fact these 2 geldings built up such imposing records in spite of their ailments just adds to their greatness IMO. Though I'm glad Kingston Town's final comeback as a 9 yr old never eventuated. Winx on the other hand, well what else can be said? She's the only horse I know that could go through an entire Spring campaign undefeated, culminating in a track record Cox Plate win, and people were genuinely debating if she was as good as she was 6-12 months earlier. If thats not a testament to her greatness I don't know what is. |
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Redemption
Champion Joined: 09 Apr 2017 Location: Melbourne Status: Offline Points: 5387 |
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If we turn it into a science, Winx actually defies physics and logic. Her cadence actually increases as the race gets longer. Her cadence is completely off the map. I loved the King, but the truth is, Octagonal was running faster sectionals than Kingston Town, so make what you want of that. I rated the Octagonal and Saintly era, higher than the Kingston Town era. The only standout race of the modern era, in which nobody would have bettered, was Might and Powers Caulfield Cup win. Not a horse in the world would have beaten him that day. Outside of that, Nobody in the world would have beaten Winx in her 2nd Cox Plate victory. Winx would indeed win a Melbourne Cup, as her cadence increases the further she goes, which is why she defies all physical logic. She is a freak.
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Tlazolteotl
Champion Joined: 02 Oct 2012 Location: Elephant Butte Status: Offline Points: 31290 |
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I think she will lose the Ryder if it's a dry track- Don't laugh- it could happen one day in Sydney. It's the way she is being caught flat-footed at the shorter distances. Depends on the opposition of course. If it's a typical Sydney bog she wins.
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Speediskey
Champion Joined: 19 Feb 2014 Status: Offline Points: 4116 |
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What absolute rubbish. |
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Tlazolteotl
Champion Joined: 02 Oct 2012 Location: Elephant Butte Status: Offline Points: 31290 |
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In fact I won't be surprised if she doesn't start. |
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3blindmice
Champion Joined: 22 Oct 2012 Status: Offline Points: 18105 |
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What makes you think that? Beaten easily at 2400m against her own age and sex in her only start beyond 2200m.
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Speediskey
Champion Joined: 19 Feb 2014 Status: Offline Points: 4116 |
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Also beaten at 2000 against her own age and sex the start before that. Don’t pretend like the trip to QLD didn’t make her. |
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maccamax
Champion Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Status: Offline Points: 41473 |
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The last race to use to compare greatness is the Melbourne Cup. It's a bluddy suped up Welter. . A handicap that captures the hearts & hopes of everyone who has racing in their blood. Milions thrown at it very successfully and it stands with Worlwide interest , stops a Nation and all of those nice things BUT it is still a Glorified Welter on Racings pedestals. |
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3blindmice
Champion Joined: 22 Oct 2012 Status: Offline Points: 18105 |
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Not pretending anything. Blind Freddie can she she's improved. Cox Plate horses have won the Cup on class altho its a different race these days. She hasn't been trained to win distance races since her filly days. Rubbish and obviously unsubstantiable comments like his add nothing to the discussion. I'll see if I can find it and post but I'm sure I heard Waller say she's best at middle distances so that's where they'd keep her.
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Speediskey
Champion Joined: 19 Feb 2014 Status: Offline Points: 4116 |
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Actually he said he thinks she was a miler. He was wrong.
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3blindmice
Champion Joined: 22 Oct 2012 Status: Offline Points: 18105 |
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Can't find that comment but there are quite a few which have Waller saying 1600m is her best distance. He may wish to modify that now after 3 CPs, 2 course records and a 5.5l thrashing of some very good horses in the QEII.
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Carioca
Champion Joined: 13 Nov 2015 Status: Offline Points: 21698 |
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Don't know about being wrong Speediskey, an Epsom, Doncaster , 3 or 4 Gr races on her merry way also over a mile, quite a few top milers won or placed over the years in a CP, Personally I would'nt doubt Wallers judgment when discussing her optimum, but that's me. |
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3blindmice
Champion Joined: 22 Oct 2012 Status: Offline Points: 18105 |
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Iirc more than a couple on here also rate her Ryder run as her best ever. Don't do ratings but I'm not convinced of that esp as it was a heavy track. Cox Plate 1 for mine.
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Redemption
Champion Joined: 09 Apr 2017 Location: Melbourne Status: Offline Points: 5387 |
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I honestly find it amusing that people think she wouldnt win a Melbourne Cup.
She would absolutely brain them. It would be over at the hometurn. I would love her to run in the Cup. She would win by a furlong.
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3blindmice
Champion Joined: 22 Oct 2012 Status: Offline Points: 18105 |
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Little wonder you're a Russia, er Trump supporter
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Nobody
Champion Joined: 23 Oct 2011 Status: Offline Points: 1189 |
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Thinking a start ahead to the Ryder on GS day. Older opposition to Winx is fairly thin on the ground, but since the Ryder is 3 weeks after Aust Guineas and 2 weeks after the Randwick Guineas, there appears to be some capable 3yo's that could give her a tougher fight than Red Excitement on their way through to the Doncaster. In no particular order, Showtime, Mighty Boss, Trapeze Artist, Pierata and Kementari are capable of an upset. Thoughts?
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Tontonan
Champion Joined: 13 Oct 2007 Status: Offline Points: 3898 |
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I think the 3YOs needed to do more against the Japs in the Futurity to pose a realistic threat to the champ.
I am not bagging them, Showtime ran well, but was run down by the older horses - and I expect Winx would run away from both of them.
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Redemption
Champion Joined: 09 Apr 2017 Location: Melbourne Status: Offline Points: 5387 |
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is Lasqueti Spirit running?
She is 200-1 Im going to back her to run a place. Hoping they try to make a 10 length lead into the straight, Winx to run her down again.
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Speediskey
Champion Joined: 19 Feb 2014 Status: Offline Points: 4116 |
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She’d wanna be going a lot better, on last prep they could whip her the whole way around and I’d doubt she would see the lead over a mile.
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maccamax
Champion Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Status: Offline Points: 41473 |
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The best thought about Winx is :- What would you do if she was yours.
Personally I would never stop Thanking her , and I would do exactly what Waller's team is doing now . Molly coddle her as much as possible , hopefully get her to better the mighty Black Caviar record. That is a big ask for a middle Distance performer. Very vulnerable at Runs one & two of a preperation. I wouldn't dream of putting her through the overseas travel , She is older , and even though she matured late , she will be starting to feel father Time . . Not a lot of biscuits left in the tin , so enjoy a Champion while we have her ... NOTHING IS FOREVER. |
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Straight Connector
Champion Joined: 27 Aug 2015 Location: Sydney Status: Offline Points: 1702 |
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Fully agree, there is nothing to gain now by travelling overseas.
The QE11 & Cox Plate are hers. There are no real competitors for these races. The only probable thing that could stop her is travel (& associated vac's). So why bother now? We offer the some of the best prize money in the world... take it! She has nothing to prove to anyone. |
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Redemption
Champion Joined: 09 Apr 2017 Location: Melbourne Status: Offline Points: 5387 |
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I think is she went overseas and wins, she only goes up a little in history rankings.
Win 4 Cox Plates in a row, and you go up much further in history. It would be talked about for a long long time, not one win overseas.
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3blindmice
Champion Joined: 22 Oct 2012 Status: Offline Points: 18105 |
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"TAB has taken it’s biggest ever bet on Winx ahead of her return in the Chipping Norton Stakes at Royal Randwick on Saturday, with one confident punter placing $108,000 on the champion mare to win at $1.06. It surpasses the previous largest of $106,500 at $1.15 to win the 2017 Cox Plate. “It doesn’t matter what price she is, the punters just want to be on her to win, similar to the days of Black Caviar,” said TAB’s Gerard Middleton" |
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Nick
Champion Joined: 21 Mar 2009 Status: Offline Points: 3442 |
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F overseas!
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stayer
Champion Joined: 10 Aug 2010 Status: Offline Points: 21888 |
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Sorry but I disagree re Winx staying here. If she's "Great" she deserves a chance to prove it and it's been a weak patch in Oz in her time. You don't want her looked back on as a champion who never raced against other champions.
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