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Who Shot Thebarman |
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Dr E
Champion Joined: 05 Feb 2013 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 28563 |
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Lucky to only get 1.5 ... He DID beat Sea Moon and Ethiopia .... and Anudjawun!
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In reference to every post in the Trump thread ... "There may have been a tiny bit of license taken there" ... Ok, Thanks for the "heads up" PT!
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Bonfield
Champion Joined: 07 Nov 2013 Status: Offline Points: 10291 |
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Yeah, 1.5kgs seems excessive for a G2 win.
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Tassam
Champion Joined: 27 Aug 2007 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 2757 |
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It has to be based on form! Sea Moon has only been performing to Group 2/3 in Aus, and did nothing to change that. Ethiopia was injured...
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Geraldo
Champion Joined: 14 Jan 2014 Location: Kent, England Status: Offline Points: 5818 |
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He can get into the Caulfield Cup now, so long as Waller takes out a couple of his horses?
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Geraldo
Champion Joined: 14 Jan 2014 Location: Kent, England Status: Offline Points: 5818 |
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Actually I think maybe in without Waller sacrificing.
Quite a few withdrawals we know about. Foreteller? Silent Achiever , Red Cadeaux, Royal Descent, Side Glance? Puccini ? Puissance De Lune, Moriarty. Most of those horses having alternative targets. |
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Geraldo
Champion Joined: 14 Jan 2014 Location: Kent, England Status: Offline Points: 5818 |
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There seems to be quite a few people knocking Who Shot The Barman.
Has shown he runs 2400m and 3200m well, and in big fields, and on Good ground. Looks to be one of Waller's two main hopes for the Caulfield Cup, and main hope for the Melbourne Cup. If you're looking for a low-weighted horse, and in form too, there doesn't seem to be too many alternatives. |
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Sunline
Champion Joined: 01 Jul 2008 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 22302 |
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If the internationals don't stand up, he can absolutely figure. He reminds me a bit of the Shocking type. Excellent Australasian stayer who has plenty of stamina and will go into the race in excellent form and down in the weights.
The CC will tell all. If he wins or goes close he's a serious chance.
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Sunline...simply supreme
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jacko1
Champion Joined: 26 Jun 2007 Status: Offline Points: 1801 |
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Yes Saturday is d-day. You know he'll stay, but will he have the class to sprint with them. If he can get out and begin winding up in time I think he will be near them at the end.
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Lordy
Champion Joined: 22 May 2010 Location: Sunshine State Status: Offline Points: 13887 |
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Took a long time to wind up last start. In a higher class race like the CC he may be found wanting. Different story with the extra 800m on the bigger track in the MC.
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Tassam
Champion Joined: 27 Aug 2007 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 2757 |
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Shocking was many lengths better than this guy, c'mon please. I'm defending shocking because all through the prep that he won the MC, I was backing him, great result. Many knocked him, but the simple fact was that he wasn't fit until the cup. He would carry Who Shot Thebarman. Fair enough the barman is a true stayer, but some stayers can run those distances much faster than others After all this, I should probably back him now |
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Gee Gee
Champion Joined: 31 Aug 2009 Status: Offline Points: 8300 |
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Junoob will beat him home.
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Dr E
Champion Joined: 05 Feb 2013 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 28563 |
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He reminds me of the old style kiwi raider, lightly raced, just done enough to qualify, proven 2 miler and in with a postage stamp on his back! ... I could almost imagine The Pumper picking him up and carrying him that last furlong!
I fear he is too close to the class (Japanese) under the modern day compressed weights, but he is honest and consistent, and that puts him ahead of plenty that will turn up on the day.
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In reference to every post in the Trump thread ... "There may have been a tiny bit of license taken there" ... Ok, Thanks for the "heads up" PT!
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racinglover
Champion Joined: 05 Jul 2011 Status: Offline Points: 4520 |
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Carries 55kg in both cups unless I'm mistaken & he won the Auckland Cup with. 52.5....
He's hardly in well at the weights I wouldn't have thought. |
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Dr E
Champion Joined: 05 Feb 2013 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 28563 |
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No, not in well, but that was the impression he gave me when he first emerged ... in the old days, he would never have come over here and won a lead up race, risking a penalty!
Of Waller's, Opinion is the one i would like to be on in either cup, if he gets a run.
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In reference to every post in the Trump thread ... "There may have been a tiny bit of license taken there" ... Ok, Thanks for the "heads up" PT!
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ncarter
Champion Joined: 16 Feb 2012 Location: Perth Status: Offline Points: 445 |
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Opinion? Please Dr E. The offer slaughtered it. The lady trainer could get the cups double!
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Bonfield
Champion Joined: 07 Nov 2013 Status: Offline Points: 10291 |
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I think he's a big chance in both cups. Progressive type with the right trainer.
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Sunline
Champion Joined: 01 Jul 2008 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 22302 |
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Weights are +2kg on real weights so he's actually 0.5kg up on Auckland Cup win which seems about right. More about how he fares in comparison to others. He will carry a very winnable weight and has the stamina. The only box left to be ticked is class and we'll know on Saturday afternoon. |
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Sunline...simply supreme
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Tlazolteotl
Champion Joined: 02 Oct 2012 Location: Elephant Butte Status: Offline Points: 31422 |
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If you can run 3200m right out that pretty much guarantees you of being in top 10 in MC because the majority of any MC field can't.
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Gee Gee
Champion Joined: 31 Aug 2009 Status: Offline Points: 8300 |
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Lexus, Queens Cup and Sandown Cups horse.
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Dr E
Champion Joined: 05 Feb 2013 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 28563 |
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The Offer is a wet tacker - no rain about, just read the stewards report after the event - Jarred up and wouldn't let go in the straight ... WST will finish ahead of The Offer, behind Opinion.
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In reference to every post in the Trump thread ... "There may have been a tiny bit of license taken there" ... Ok, Thanks for the "heads up" PT!
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Sunline
Champion Joined: 01 Jul 2008 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 22302 |
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I think Who Shot Thebarman has been relatively unextended in both wins this prep. Although he looked in trouble last start and was under hard riding, he got there with plenty of time in the end and was throttled right back down. He was just getting warmed up.
He'll improve again, will enjoy the pace up front and will appreciate the open spaces from his barrier to wind up. He might not win as the bonny mare shapes up well for this but I expect him to be knocking on the door of the big one and he'll shorten in the market. |
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Sunline...simply supreme
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djebel
Premium Joined: 07 Mar 2007 Status: Offline Points: 53960 |
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With what sort of weight ? He strikes me as being good enough to win any of our staying races although I wonder how he will go around Caulfield, I prefer him at Flemington.
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reductio ad absurdum
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Gee Gee
Champion Joined: 31 Aug 2009 Status: Offline Points: 8300 |
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Ok i didn't know the Bart Cummings was a G3 (thought it was Listed)
The Lexus and Queens are G3s, so he'll carry top weight with the 107 Vic Rating. Unless Lloyd nominates his large supply of 110 rated plodders
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Gay3
Moderator Group Joined: 19 Feb 2007 Location: Miners Rest Status: Offline Points: 52004 |
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Drink to the health of an Irish barman
Glen Boss onboard Who Shot Thebarman. Picture: COLLEEN PETCH THE O’Leary brothers’ favourite aunt didn’t live quite long enough to see the horse they named after her favourite saying, but she’s with the “boys” in spirit. Or perhaps spirits. If Who Shot Thebarman gets away with the Caulfield Cup next weekend, the barmen at the course had better look slippery or there’ll be a riot among the visiting Kiwi contingent. The extended O’Leary clan and half the Wanganui district are crossing the Tasman to see the local hero take a tilt at the rest of the world. Win, lose or draw, they’ll be thirsty. “Aunty Julie” died “maybe 10 years ago”, about the same time as her brother Humphrey O’Leary, father of the dairy-farming brothers who milk a few thousand cows between them so they can afford to feed a galloper. Aunty Julie was famous in the family for demanding “Who shot the barman?” as soon as she walked through the door at Christmas or birthdays or the like, expecting to be met with a glass of something to her taste. For years her four O’Leary nephews and their three sisters saved the signature phrase as the name for a halfway decent horse. It looks as if they picked the right one. When the plain bay with the catchy moniker won the Auckland Cup at just his ninth start in March, there were about 40 O’Learys in the stand, all wearing their (ahem) orange ties and caps to match the family racing colours. As one delighted racing writer noted, the “hooting and hollering” O’Learys poured down the steps “like lava” after the race. The big clue that the horse is special was that the family matriarch, Joan O’Leary, was there in her wheelchair that day — the first time she’d been to the races in nearly 20 years. Joan was a McCashin before she married into the O’Leary tribe and the orange and white spots and cap worn by Who Shot Thebarman’s jockey are the old McCashin colours her forebears used. Her son Michael points out fairly plainly that “being Irish” (despite a century or so of farming in New Zealand) the family never call their colours “orange”. They prefer “tangerine”. When Michael and Danny and Shaun and Humphrey junior were kids — along with their sisters Eileen, Marie and Joan — they used to canter their ponies around the local roads with their father as he exercised a racehorse. “Dad” O’Leary called the farm Kerry Gold Stud in honour of his ancestors in the old country and always kept a steeplechaser for the same reason. He loved jumpers and stayers and infected his children with the bug. One of the neighbours had won the Auckland Cup with Ruata in 1961 and the horse became a local legend. Michael recalls: “We’d ride past and Dad would say ‘Look under the trees in the yards there and you’ll see Ruata’.” The boys grew up racing each other around the paddocks on their ponies and it left them with an itch to scratch. The family has had a few good gallopers, including a jumper called Fontera who went to Japan to run in the rich Nakayama Grand Jump in 2005. But they suspect Who Shot Thebarman is the horse of a lifetime. Michael claims to have selected the horse on pedigree, sight unseen. He tells the story that he called the breeder Wayne Stewart to ask if he had any youngsters for sale by Yamanin Vital, an old and fairly unfashionable horse that stood for a humble service fee of $6000 and produced a string of tough stayers and jumpers before he died four years ago. Stewart’s stud is deep in the South Island, a huge distance from the O’Learys’ home district in the North, so they did the purchase by telephone. Stewart told O’Leary he had a paddock full of young horses and promised he had selected the best-looking one for them. When he told Michael the colt’s mother was the third foal of the oddly-named Ears Carol, it sealed the deal. The O’Learys have a theory that a mare’s third foal is her best. Besides, they liked her bloodlines. And they especially liked the price because Scots aren’t the only ones to love a bargain. Michael recalls doing the deal for “eight grand”. Wayne Stewart says it was “$10,000”. They are both right: in 2009, 10 Kiwi dollars was worth about eight Australian. Either way, it wasn’t much for a horse that would win half a million dollars on his way to a run in the Caulfield Cup that could well get him into the Melbourne Cup. One thing they are sure of is that if “Thebarman” can handle the tight Caulfield course to win, he’ll “get the distance” at Flemington on the first Tuesday in November. AGAIN, the O’Learys have a theory. Most modern racehorses are raised in tiny stud paddocks, but they let the colt grow up in a big cow paddock, the way New Zealand horses were traditionally reared early last century. “In big paddocks they can run as far as they like because they don’t have to stop at the fence line,” says Michael, who suggests small paddocks have led to the current rash of sprinters in Australasia and the consequent domination of the Cups by European raiders. Their horse is six but has had only 14 starts. He didn’t have his first start until early last year. Banjo Paterson’s galloping rhymes might not be quite as well-known in New Zealand as they are here but one of them, Father Riley’s Horse, might have a new burst of life around Wanganui this week. It’s about a race in a bush district where “the folk were mostly Irish round about” and had all backed a dark horse “lent” to the local priest by a scallywag horse thief, Andy Regan. Paterson wrote about the mystery horse: “…the hopes of all the helpless, and the prayers of all the poor, Will be running by his side to keep him straight.” Which is exactly what will be happening all over New Zealand and parts of Caulfield racecourse next Saturday. Much betting and praying will be followed by much singing and drinking. Racegoers who see a herd of over-refreshed Kiwis wearing loud ties and caps late that afternoon should remember one thing. That colour … it’s tangerine. Comments |
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Wisdom has been chasing me but I've always outrun it!
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Ecair Issoire
Champion Joined: 10 Nov 2011 Location: Melbourne Status: Offline Points: 16586 |
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anyone still think guy can be competitive in the melb cup..
beating anudjawun by 3L..doesn't enthuse me.. 3200m will suit better than 2400m..but i'd say 9th - 13th..is about his range. |
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James
Champion Joined: 15 Jan 2011 Location: Melbourne Status: Offline Points: 7230 |
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Was ordinary yesterday. Would have like to see him stick on just behind the first few home but couldn't do it. Can't touch him in the cup off that. Don't think Waller has the cattle to win a cup at the moment.
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Browndog
Moderator Group Joined: 30 Oct 2009 Location: Brunswick Hds N Status: Offline Points: 35559 |
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Stewards yesterday:
Who Shot Thebarman (NZ) - post race endoscopy detected a degree of mucus/mucopus that may have affected the geldings racing performance and a veterinary clearance will be required prior to racing again.
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Lordy
Champion Joined: 22 May 2010 Location: Sunshine State Status: Offline Points: 13887 |
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Ridden upside down a bit yesterday and he overraced early. Didn't like him dropping back to 2400 when he looked like he needed further at his previous start.
Can forgive that run and will but much better suited over 3200 at Flemington. I'm not about to load up though.
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Gay3
Moderator Group Joined: 19 Feb 2007 Location: Miners Rest Status: Offline Points: 52004 |
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Wallers' opinion y'day morning was that if they can't be competitive in the CC, they (his) don't warrant a Melb Cup start.
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Wisdom has been chasing me but I've always outrun it!
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Lordy
Champion Joined: 22 May 2010 Location: Sunshine State Status: Offline Points: 13887 |
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He's pretty much spot on there. Trouble is this is the Melbourne Cup and the owners might want to press on.
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