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Dr E View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dr E Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 2:07am
... oh yes, and nice work ThreeBears ... but we pay too much in taxes that we should be relying on vigilantism ... trust me, those police would love to use a few bullets on these dangerous, disrespectful bunts! (Whale ... spellcheck!)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote marble Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 7:35am
it leaves you feeling a bit sad and angry when we have helped rescue these people from lifetimes of violence only for them to bring it here. 
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Brudder_A Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 7:47am
Originally posted by Redemption Redemption wrote:

Originally posted by Brudder_A Brudder_A wrote:

Originally posted by max manewer max manewer wrote:

Jail space very limited, and the courts know it.


Why not deportation?

Or is that just not Oztraylyan to do?

Dont bother sending them to Hungary
We dont allow ungrateful scum to enter Hungary. Thumbs Up


Why would anyone bother sending then to Hungary?

Deportation would be to their country of origin.

Why do people think that immigration is a right? Really its a privilege (especially to a place like Australia) and those that do immigrate should not break the law.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Passing Through Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 7:49am
What percentage of these youth criminals are actually immigrants, or doesn't it matter?


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote marble Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 8:01am
it doesnt matter - perception is that they are immigrants and they are biting the hand that feeds them.
 compared to their population crime amongst them is very high - why?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oneonesit Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 8:07am
Originally posted by Passing Through Passing Through wrote:

What percentage of these youth criminals are actually immigrants, or doesn't it matter?


Oh I see, its my fault is it ? Oh of course, there I was thinking it was your fault because you had been left in charge, or Manuels fault for not waking you, when all the time it was MY fault. Oh, it is obvious now. I have seen the light. Well I must be punished then, mustn't I ?
 
(starts spanking himself)
 
Your a naughty, naughty boy Fawlty !
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max manewer View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote max manewer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 9:44am
In my opinion, govt assistance to the unemployed, students etc should be raised to the level of pensions generally, once the dole and the pension were the same level. Do that, and the excuse of economic circumstances crime disappears, but in concert with that a hard-ball approach in the courts is needed. Then you need the jails to house them....all of which has been badly let go in recent times. Yesterday I saw a news story about an undesirable who stole credit cards at the scene of a multiple fatality car crash, and later went on a spending spree. The news story made a point of saying he was denied bail, as if he was being made an exception. To the eternal shame of the system, it was revealed his criminal record was 20 pages long. I have no hesitation in saying he should be permanently incarcerated, why should society be subjected to page 21 ?
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mc41 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mc41 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 10:12am
Think the sentences are there just not being implemented by the bench
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Whale View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Whale Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 10:15am
Originally posted by Dr E Dr E wrote:

... oh yes, and nice work ThreeBears ... but we pay too much in taxes that we should be relying on vigilantism ... trust me, those police would love to use a few bullets on these dangerous, disrespectful bunts! (Whale ... spellcheck!)


serious question, are you an idiot ?
Australia doesn't have to cross water to find our enemies ,

We've done a mighty job of importing them ,    allowing them to breed and join TBV.       
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oneonesit View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oneonesit Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 10:33am
Originally posted by Whale Whale wrote:

Originally posted by Dr E Dr E wrote:

... oh yes, and nice work ThreeBears ... but we pay too much in taxes that we should be relying on vigilantism ... trust me, those police would love to use a few bullets on these dangerous, disrespectful bunts! (Whale ... spellcheck!)


serious question, are you an idiot ?
 Do you lack comprehension skills Whale ? The good Dr asked you for a spell check - not a bloody comment !
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max manewer View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote max manewer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 10:47am
First item of business for any govt, ought to be, law enforcement, and adequate provision of resources for same. If it is written into the law that some people should get lenient treatment because of a traumatic upbringing, or some other special circumstance, then so be it, but the law does not make those provisions, and it is not the role of anyone to second-guess laws, except elected law-makers. But that is not the way the system works these days, it is supposed to be non-discriminatory, but only a fool would believe it is.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mc41 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 10:54am
Here is part of the problem
A young South Sudanese man jailed for violent offending won a reprieve from deportation to his homeland because authorities failed to consider the impact on his family and his mental health problems.

The 25-year-man, whose identity is redacted, was jailed in 2012 for armed robbery and other offences that a sentencing judge described as "dangerous, frightening and extremely violent".
Such was his offending that the federal government cancelled his humanitarian visa – issued when he came to Australia as a refugee, aged 14 – to have him sent back to South Sudan once released from prison.

But in a ruling made last month, a Federal Court judge gave the 25-year-old South Sudanese man a reprieve by ruling that the Administrative Appeals Tribunal had not considered the impact a possible deportation would have on his younger siblings and his nieces and nephews, who are all children.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Redemption Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 11:04am
Melbourne certainly isnt the most livable city in the world.

Doesnt even have a train to the airport.
Crime is thru the roof.
Road rage is thru the roof. People are eating each other at the sides of roads.
Terrorists are lurking and we pass them off as just mental basketcases, rather than labeling it a terror attack.
Oh, and airport carparking? You need to get a homeloan for that.
Dont even think the airport has wi-fi for the general public.

Homeless people are all up Elizabeth street in the heart of the city.

Went to the zoo recently and yobs from Pakenham, super nasty lesbians with children, should have been the ones behind the cages, not the animals.

Went to Carols by Candlelight, people want to punch up for a picnic rug position.
Thats the Christmas Spirit.

Oh, and Daniel Andrews totally scrwed over our taxi drivers, several of whom have since lost their homes or even suicided, despite local government selling Port Phillip shipping area for squillions, $$$$, didnt even have the heart to compensate the cab drivers a few million.

Super nice city,
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oneonesit View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oneonesit Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 11:11am
Very true redemption. Throw in the crap weather & it makes you wonder who would ever want to live in the place !
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Passing Through View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Passing Through Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 11:15am
Yes Redemption, you should move to beautiful Bankstown and listen to Dr E and Oneone moaning about how good Melbourne has it compared to their little Mecca
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max manewer View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote max manewer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 11:17am
A teenage boy is facing a string of charges, including attempted murder, after allegedly using a stolen car to go on a rampage through Melbourne’s CBD.


The 15-year-old appeared at Melbourne Children’s Court yesterday where CCTV of the alleged rampage was released and later obtained by The Herald Sun.
The video shows a 4WD driving and reversing at speed along Flinders Street just before 8am on September 30.

In the CCTV footage shown in court, the car is seen seemingly attempting to run down pedestrians, slamming into bikes, driving through red lights and pedestrian crossings.

The 15-year-old was eventually pulled from the vehicle by a member of the public. He was wearing combat gear and allegedly armed with a knife and a baton.

The teenager eventually had to be tasered by police and arrested.

Police ruled out terrorism and said they were treating the incident as mental health related.

When investigators searched the boy’s tablet they allegedly discovered thousands of disturbing searches.

He had allegedly taken screenshots of Google Maps showing the location of Melbourne landmarks, and searched for military bases and gun shops.

The 15-year-old has been charged with two counts of attempted murder, six counts of reckless conduct endangering life, and two counts of assaulting emergency services workers.

He has been released on bail, into the care of his sister and father, and is expected to appear in court again next month.
_______________________________________________________________________

Hands up who feels reassured by that story, that the system is working, charged with attempted murder, but considered to be a mental health issue, and is released into the "care" of family.....who are depended on to prevent a "relapse" and a repeat performance of this ? The system is an utter shambles.







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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote scamanda Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 11:42am
Originally posted by max manewer max manewer wrote:

In my opinion, govt assistance to the unemployed, students etc should be raised to the level of pensions generally, once the dole and the pension were the same level. Do that, and the excuse of economic circumstances crime disappears, but in concert with that a hard-ball approach in the courts is needed. Then you need the jails to house them....all of which has been badly let go in recent times. Yesterday I saw a news story about an undesirable who stole credit cards at the scene of a multiple fatality car crash, and later went on a spending spree. The news story made a point of saying he was denied bail, as if he was being made an exception. To the eternal shame of the system, it was revealed his criminal record was 20 pages long. I have no hesitation in saying he should be permanently incarcerated, why should society be subjected to page 21 ?

So your way of fixing the present problem is to give them more money.

Dead
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Passing Through Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 11:44am
The Sudanese community are asking for educational and trades training programs(mostly removed by federal govt) to get them off the streets and something to aspire to
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote max manewer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 11:47am
Originally posted by scamanda scamanda wrote:

Originally posted by max manewer max manewer wrote:

In my opinion, govt assistance to the unemployed, students etc should be raised to the level of pensions generally, once the dole and the pension were the same level. Do that, and the excuse of economic circumstances crime disappears, but in concert with that a hard-ball approach in the courts is needed. Then you need the jails to house them....all of which has been badly let go in recent times. Yesterday I saw a news story about an undesirable who stole credit cards at the scene of a multiple fatality car crash, and later went on a spending spree. The news story made a point of saying he was denied bail, as if he was being made an exception. To the eternal shame of the system, it was revealed his criminal record was 20 pages long. I have no hesitation in saying he should be permanently incarcerated, why should society be subjected to page 21 ?


So your way of fixing the present problem is to give them more money.

Dead

Yep, you must provide a basic level of sustenance, the dole does not. By what logic the dole was disconnected from the same level as the pension, to now $150 a week less, I don't know, but I can see how it could create desperation, even among those that don't waste a cent on non-necessities.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote scamanda Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 11:48am
Originally posted by mc41 mc41 wrote:

Here is part of the problem
A young South Sudanese man jailed for violent offending won a reprieve from deportation to his homeland because authorities failed to consider the impact on his family and his mental health problems.

The 25-year-man, whose identity is redacted, was jailed in 2012 for armed robbery and other offences that a sentencing judge described as "dangerous, frightening and extremely violent".
Such was his offending that the federal government cancelled his humanitarian visa – issued when he came to Australia as a refugee, aged 14 – to have him sent back to South Sudan once released from prison.

But in a ruling made last month, a Federal Court judge gave the 25-year-old South Sudanese man a reprieve by ruling that the Administrative Appeals Tribunal had not considered the impact a possible deportation would have on his younger siblings and his nieces and nephews, who are all children.

So this is the new defense for the convicted youth?

And the big question is, who paid for this young Sudanese man's defense in court?
I'll bet he didn't pay for it himself.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Whale Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 11:52am
They have come from unimaginably horrendous conditions, allowances must be made
Australia doesn't have to cross water to find our enemies ,

We've done a mighty job of importing them ,    allowing them to breed and join TBV.       
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shrunk in the Wash Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 11:53am
Originally posted by max manewer max manewer wrote:

Originally posted by scamanda scamanda wrote:

Originally posted by max manewer max manewer wrote:

In my opinion, govt assistance to the unemployed, students etc should be raised to the level of pensions generally, once the dole and the pension were the same level. Do that, and the excuse of economic circumstances crime disappears, but in concert with that a hard-ball approach in the courts is needed. Then you need the jails to house them....all of which has been badly let go in recent times. Yesterday I saw a news story about an undesirable who stole credit cards at the scene of a multiple fatality car crash, and later went on a spending spree. The news story made a point of saying he was denied bail, as if he was being made an exception. To the eternal shame of the system, it was revealed his criminal record was 20 pages long. I have no hesitation in saying he should be permanently incarcerated, why should society be subjected to page 21 ?


So your way of fixing the present problem is to give them more money.

Dead

Yep, you must provide a basic level of sustenance, the dole does not. By what logic the dole was disconnected from the same level as the pension, to now $150 a week less, I don't know, but I can see how it could create desperation, even among those that don't waste a cent on non-necessities.


It needs toi be a 2 edged approach. Harsh penalties then a massive amount of education & training once in the jail system.
Minors should be trained in apprenticeships and other skills and have mentors of quality to help them
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote scamanda Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 11:55am
Originally posted by max manewer max manewer wrote:

Originally posted by scamanda scamanda wrote:

Originally posted by max manewer max manewer wrote:

In my opinion, govt assistance to the unemployed, students etc should be raised to the level of pensions generally, once the dole and the pension were the same level. Do that, and the excuse of economic circumstances crime disappears, but in concert with that a hard-ball approach in the courts is needed. Then you need the jails to house them....all of which has been badly let go in recent times. Yesterday I saw a news story about an undesirable who stole credit cards at the scene of a multiple fatality car crash, and later went on a spending spree. The news story made a point of saying he was denied bail, as if he was being made an exception. To the eternal shame of the system, it was revealed his criminal record was 20 pages long. I have no hesitation in saying he should be permanently incarcerated, why should society be subjected to page 21 ?


So your way of fixing the present problem is to give them more money.

Dead

Yep, you must provide a basic level of sustenance, the dole does not. By what logic the dole was disconnected from the same level as the pension, to now $150 a week less, I don't know, but I can see how it could create desperation, even among those that don't waste a cent on non-necessities.

So you want to up the dole so that every recipient can live the same lifestyle as those that have worked their entire lives.

Where's the incentive to get a job?

Not to mention the added strain on the government, or should I say tax payer.

I started with nothing and still have most of it left
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote max manewer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 11:59am
Originally posted by scamanda scamanda wrote:

Originally posted by max manewer max manewer wrote:

Originally posted by scamanda scamanda wrote:

Originally posted by max manewer max manewer wrote:

In my opinion, govt assistance to the unemployed, students etc should be raised to the level of pensions generally, once the dole and the pension were the same level. Do that, and the excuse of economic circumstances crime disappears, but in concert with that a hard-ball approach in the courts is needed. Then you need the jails to house them....all of which has been badly let go in recent times. Yesterday I saw a news story about an undesirable who stole credit cards at the scene of a multiple fatality car crash, and later went on a spending spree. The news story made a point of saying he was denied bail, as if he was being made an exception. To the eternal shame of the system, it was revealed his criminal record was 20 pages long. I have no hesitation in saying he should be permanently incarcerated, why should society be subjected to page 21 ?


So your way of fixing the present problem is to give them more money.

Dead

Yep, you must provide a basic level of sustenance, the dole does not. By what logic the dole was disconnected from the same level as the pension, to now $150 a week less, I don't know, but I can see how it could create desperation, even among those that don't waste a cent on non-necessities.


So you want to up the dole so that every recipient can live the same lifestyle as those that have worked their entire lives.

Where's the incentive to get a job?

Not to mention the added strain on the government, or should I say tax payer.


no honest person should be subjected to an unliveable dole payment, because the system can't weed out the shysters. It is a matter of enforcing the law, not using a low dole payment to deter people who would abuse the system, but as a side effect, punishes the genuine.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote scamanda Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 12:02pm
You should get your name on the possibles and probables for the Greens next senate candidacy.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shrunk in the Wash Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 12:02pm
Originally posted by max manewer max manewer wrote:

Originally posted by scamanda scamanda wrote:

Originally posted by max manewer max manewer wrote:

Originally posted by scamanda scamanda wrote:

Originally posted by max manewer max manewer wrote:

In my opinion, govt assistance to the unemployed, students etc should be raised to the level of pensions generally, once the dole and the pension were the same level. Do that, and the excuse of economic circumstances crime disappears, but in concert with that a hard-ball approach in the courts is needed. Then you need the jails to house them....all of which has been badly let go in recent times. Yesterday I saw a news story about an undesirable who stole credit cards at the scene of a multiple fatality car crash, and later went on a spending spree. The news story made a point of saying he was denied bail, as if he was being made an exception. To the eternal shame of the system, it was revealed his criminal record was 20 pages long. I have no hesitation in saying he should be permanently incarcerated, why should society be subjected to page 21 ?


So your way of fixing the present problem is to give them more money.

Dead

Yep, you must provide a basic level of sustenance, the dole does not. By what logic the dole was disconnected from the same level as the pension, to now $150 a week less, I don't know, but I can see how it could create desperation, even among those that don't waste a cent on non-necessities.


So you want to up the dole so that every recipient can live the same lifestyle as those that have worked their entire lives.

Where's the incentive to get a job?

Not to mention the added strain on the government, or should I say tax payer.


no honest person should be subjected to an unliveable dole payment, because the system can't weed out the shysters. It is a matter of enforcing the law,.


A very valid point lost on manyClap
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote max manewer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 12:07pm
Originally posted by scamanda scamanda wrote:

You should get your name on the possibles and probables for the Greens next senate candidacy.



I am unaware that the Greens have taken a stand on that issue, certainly did not happen in the Labor years.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote scamanda Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 12:07pm
It is a matter of enforcing the law,.
A very valid point lost on manyClap

Originally posted by mc41 mc41 wrote:

Here is part of the problem 
A young South Sudanese man jailed for violent offending won a reprieve from deportation to his homeland because authorities failed to consider the impact on his family and his mental health problems.

The 25-year-man, whose identity is redacted, was jailed in 2012 for armed robbery and other offences that a sentencing judge described as "dangerous, frightening and extremely violent".
Such was his offending that the federal government cancelled his humanitarian visa – issued when he came to Australia as a refugee, aged 14 – to have him sent back to South Sudan once released from prison.

But in a ruling made last month, a Federal Court judge gave the 25-year-old South Sudanese man a reprieve by ruling that the Administrative Appeals Tribunal had not considered the impact a possible deportation would have on his younger siblings and his nieces and nephews, who are all children.

Yeah. Because it's working so well.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Whale Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 12:09pm
Originally posted by scamanda scamanda wrote:

You should get your name on the possibles and probables for the Greens next senate candidacy.




so any compassionate, sensible approach attracts the "ultimate " insult from you Confused
Australia doesn't have to cross water to find our enemies ,

We've done a mighty job of importing them ,    allowing them to breed and join TBV.       
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ThreeBears Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 12:15pm
They have come from unimaginably horrendous conditions, allowances must be made
They are not stupid. They know allowances are being made and are taking every advantage possible of those extra opportunities to offend and reoffend. The amount of crimes committed by those already on bail speaks volumes.
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