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The refugee crisis..??!!

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Fiddlesticks View Drop Down
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    Posted: 04 Sep 2015 at 11:38am
Solution : oh here ye refugee, try abandoning your religion forever, cast away ye old dark ages ideas and leave your cult for freedom, reward will be to live in peace as intelligent normal folk in a secular society where progressive ideas and science reins.

end simplistic view]

 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Tlazolteotl Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Sep 2015 at 11:59am
Originally posted by Fiddlesticks Fiddlesticks wrote:

Solution : oh here ye refugee, try abandoning your religion forever, cast away ye old dark ages ideas and leave your cult for freedom, reward will be to live in peace as intelligent normal folk in a secular society where progressive ideas and science reins.

end simplistic view]

 

At a certain point you have to stand and fight for your country not run off to someone elses.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fiddlesticks Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Sep 2015 at 12:00pm
Originally posted by Tlazolteotl Tlazolteotl wrote:

Originally posted by Fiddlesticks Fiddlesticks wrote:

Solution : oh here ye refugee, try abandoning your religion forever, cast away ye old dark ages ideas and leave your cult for freedom, reward will be to live in peace as intelligent normal folk in a secular society where progressive ideas and science reins.

end simplistic view]

 

At a certain point you have to stand and fight for your country not run off to someone elses.


Does any even know what the Long war is about anymore..??
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote mc41 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Sep 2015 at 12:49pm
A refugee is a person who is outside their home country because they have suffered (or feared) persecution on account of race, religion, nationality, or political opinion; because they are a member of a persecuted social category of persons; or because they are fleeing a war
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote mc41 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Sep 2015 at 12:50pm
I find some contributors commenting on this issue as gutless and cowardly
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote max manewer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Sep 2015 at 1:05pm
You don't like fiddles' self-admitted simplistic view ? I think fiddles believes religion causes haemorrhoids as well.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tlazolteotl Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Sep 2015 at 2:11pm
Why is everybody in that area so freakin' useless militarily except for the religious nutters? The Iraqis and Afghans have had enough training and hardware given to them to win 3 world wars, far more training and hardware than the nutters, but they can't fight their way out of a brown paper bag.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mc41 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Sep 2015 at 5:49pm
In all honesty who wants the war stopped other than the citizens

Saudi has 1 of the worst human rights violation on record,yet nothing,zilch,who cares attitude from the worlds so called peace keepers.    
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stayer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Sep 2015 at 7:04pm
Originally posted by mc41 mc41 wrote:

In all honesty who wants the war stopped other than the citizens

Saudi has 1 of the worst human rights violation on record,yet nothing,zilch,who cares attitude from the worlds so called peace keepers.    

Good post.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote stayer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Sep 2015 at 7:07pm
Originally posted by mc41 mc41 wrote:

A refugee is a person who is outside their home country because they have suffered (or feared) persecution on account of race, religion, nationality, or political opinion; because they are a member of a persecuted social category of persons; or because they are fleeing a war

That's an asylum seeker. A refugee is in real fear of their life. May seem cold hearted to distinguish, but it's important in terms of different nations' policies etc.
"She's going through a growth phase." - GW
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fiddlesticks Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Sep 2015 at 8:25pm
Originally posted by max manewer max manewer wrote:

You don't like fiddles' self-admitted simplistic view ? I think fiddles believes religion causes haemorrhoids as well.


with all that bending over, it doesn't help..
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fiddlesticks Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Sep 2015 at 8:26pm
Originally posted by mc41 mc41 wrote:

A refugee is a person who is outside their home country because they have suffered (or feared) persecution on account of race, religion, nationality, or political opinion; because they are a member of a persecuted social category of persons; or because they are fleeing a war


So what's the reason for the war over there then...??
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jujuno Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Sep 2015 at 9:21pm
 I am ashamed to be Australian after listening to Abbott's garbage response to the refugee crisis...

 "Someone should show them how to turn the boats around!"

 the man is a shameless bas tard...

 I'd like to put him on an island with no food and a leaky boat...

 DISGUSTED...Angry
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote max manewer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Sep 2015 at 9:27pm
Did he really say that ?
 "Someone should show them how to turn the boats around!"
If that is so, it is not only he that is shameless, but the MP's that keep him as PM. I am not sure Bill Shorten is really much better, though.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jujuno Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Sep 2015 at 9:41pm
that was today's interview...this was yesterday's entree...


 Mr Abbott said on Friday: "If you want to stop the deaths, if you want to stop the drownings you have got to stop the boats.  

"We saw yesterday on our screens a very sad, poignant image of children tragically dead at sea in illegal migration," Mr Abbott told ABC radio.

"Thankfully, we have stopped that in Australia because we have stopped the illegal boats. 

"We have said to the people smugglers: 'Your trade is closed down.' 

"If you want to keep people safe, you have got to stop illegal migration and that's what we have done."


"SAD, POIGNANT IMAGE OF CHILDREN TRAGICALLY DEAD..."


 the man makes me want to vomit...even with that pathetic description, you read how little he really cares...




 

 



 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jujuno Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Sep 2015 at 9:43pm
"ILLEGAL MIGRATION.."

 he doesn't understand any of it...

 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gay3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Sep 2015 at 9:52pm
Alternate simplistic view: Continue to relocate & absorb all refugees untill each of these warmongering countries/warlords & ISIS have only each other left to kill.
When/if sanity ever prevails with fair & equitable, undisputed rulers in charge, allow gradual resettlement tho' God only knows what they'll survive on Confused
These wars have prevailed for thousands of years but now, civilians realise they have some semblance of a chance of a better life in an alternate country.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote whitt0 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Sep 2015 at 10:01pm
jujono - u speak so much sense. I prefer the Libs but his/party view has DISGUSTED me. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote max manewer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Sep 2015 at 10:05pm
Abbott is a sheep of hit, and it is not a recent discovery on my part. Simply could not vote for the Libs with him in the side, let alone on top. It frightens me that he is still PM, shows how thin the ranks of possible leaders are.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stayer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Sep 2015 at 10:23pm
Originally posted by Fiddlesticks Fiddlesticks wrote:


Originally posted by mc41 mc41 wrote:

A refugee is a person who is outside their home country because they have suffered (or feared) persecution on account of race, religion, nationality, or political opinion; because they are a member of a persecuted social category of persons; or because they are fleeing a war


So what's the reason for the war over there then...??

Just pointing out the distinction, Fiddles. Frankly, there ARE many people who take the path of what Abbott disgustingly (in this case) called "illegal migration" - they can not be legally classified as "refugees" because there is no direct threat to their life. To make it worse, they often deliberately come without any papers etc, knowing that if they land, they will at least be able to stay until it is proven that they don't fall under refugee status. That's why "stop the boats" is a policy. A nation that has signed up to international "law" agreements "must" take in refugees, but is entitled to regard illegal immigrant asylum seekers as law breakers who clog up the system.
Not saying I agree with it, but that's the reality. I studied this stuff and did volunteer work with refugees, and the simplistic ideas that get thrown around are pretty far off reality.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stayer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Sep 2015 at 10:25pm
Oops and just realized Fiddles wasn't referring to my distinction at all - thought he was responding to my response to the post he responded to!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote mc41 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Sep 2015 at 12:42am
Stopping the boats doesn't stop the deaths, they just die somewhere else.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote max manewer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Sep 2015 at 12:45am
That was the advertising pitch for Ratsak, " they go away to die." And some people do regard these desperate people as rats. The Germans seem intent on rectifying some of the sins of the past with a more humanitarian attitude.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hollywood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Sep 2015 at 12:54am
I've said it before and I'll say it again. What goes around comes around. Make no mistake about it. One day Australia will have people fleeing here as refugees. It might be in 10 years time .... it might be in 100 years time. It will happen and when it does I would love to be around to see the reaction of those that demonise and refuse entry to refugees today.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stayer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Sep 2015 at 1:23am
Originally posted by mc41 mc41 wrote:

Stopping the boats doesn't stop the deaths, they just die somewhere else.

Actually it's the horrible people who run these boats who are responsible for their deaths. They are callous people who deal in stuff most people don't want to know about.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jujuno Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Sep 2015 at 1:39am
Originally posted by whitt0 whitt0 wrote:

jujono - u speak so much sense. I prefer the Libs but his/party view has DISGUSTED me. 

 until Abbott took over the Lib leadership, I had never voted anything else but LNP...now I would be ashamed to give them my vote...

 this is not a genuine Liberal Party...

 Angry

 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Passing Through Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Sep 2015 at 10:07am
Originally posted by Fiddlesticks Fiddlesticks wrote:

Solution : oh here ye refugee, try abandoning your religion forever, cast away ye old dark ages ideas and leave your cult for freedom, reward will be to live in peace as intelligent normal folk in a secular society where progressive ideas and science reins.

end simplistic view]

 

Whatever you think of the Assad regime, Syria is a secular state, they have progressive modern views compared to most of their neighbors and religion isn't a factor in daily life. They were considered lower middle income by world standards before this war. These refugees all carry iphones and laptops. 

They are escaping a prehistoric closed minded group trying to take that from them and the west who are promoting a civil war in their country. What are they supposed to do? You say they should go to Saudi Arabia? A country that is still in the dark ages and everything Syria is transitioning out of. SA also have a war of their own they are dealing with on their border Why would people cross through other countries to get there? 

The fact is that approx 4 million people have crossed borders to wait with their immediate neighbors till things settle down, if they ever do. Just like Europe in the 30's a number of people don't see things getting better and look for a better place to relocate their families. Who can blame them.

Our PM uses ISIL for his political advantage deeming them more evil than the nazis but telling people they shouldn't leave there, because we don't want them. Rather they should stay put and hope that ISIL or Australian bombs don't kill them 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oneonesit Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Sep 2015 at 11:40am
Very easy to be critical on this issue...much harder to put up acceptable alternatives. If we want an open border policy to help everyone else around the world...fine...however kiss good bye your current standard of living. Must have an impact...both financially & culturally. Plenty of suburbs in Sydney paying the penalty of poor cultural assimilation let me tell you. We should at least probably double our intake due to current global problems...question is will it ever get any better...just seems to move around from hotspot to hotspot. Will this be deemed "good enough" by those currently critical ?...I doubt it. The need will "always" be there to take more...& any argument against it will always look poor when the reality of a kid drowning at sea sea is put up. As for Shortens mob being critical of Abbott....deary me. What an absolute abomination of a performance they put in...short memories obviously...best just shut up on this issue !
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oneonesit Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Sep 2015 at 11:56am
Current estimates of global "displaced people" is in excess of 50 million...a figure that is growing rapidly day by day. Should Australia take all these people ? Obviously not...so what is an acceptable figure ?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tlazolteotl Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Sep 2015 at 12:13pm
Originally posted by oneonesit oneonesit wrote:

Current estimates of global "displaced people" is in excess of 50 million...a figure that is growing rapidly day by day. Should Australia take all these people ? Obviously not...so what is an acceptable figure ?

You will never get a number out of the bleeding hearts for their generosity is boundless. But I propose a figure of 20 million- 20 million Muslims- that will make us all feel virtuous. I'll leave it to your children to deal with the consequences.Big smile
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