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Spirit of Boom

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Speediskey View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Speediskey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Mar 2018 at 4:47pm
Had 3 runners today for a Win up north, 1st and 2nd in the 250k QTIS Jewel. Takes his prizemoney up another 200k for the season, so will set nearly dead even with Written Tycoon on the two year old tables.

Plumaro looks a deadset miler and a great prospect.

Boomsara ran great.

Think they're going to sell very well at March to state the obvious. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ianb Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Apr 2018 at 8:26am
2018 Service Fee is $55,000
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Speediskey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Apr 2018 at 10:00am
Seems insane to me, but they've had 300 soft bookings/inquiries and only room for 100 outside mares, so may as well take advantage I guess.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote furious Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Apr 2018 at 10:41am
A jump maybe even a double but boy that is really going overboard.  Maybe it is a numbers thing.  Weed out the mares wanting to go to him as Speediskey says but dicey also.  And I've been his biggest fan from the sales last year onwards.  Gently Gently catchy monkey applies here also I'd think.  This sets him above say So You Think with three G1 winners.  Different sort of stallion yes but still early $20's would still off been high for a stallion based in Queensland.  Most of the 300 above wouldn't warrent a $55K fee I dare say.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Speediskey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Apr 2018 at 11:14am
I suppose the only real way to compare first season sites is based on the two year old tables, and he is 5th. The ones above him have a fee much larger than 55k.

Snitzel at 176
I Am Invincible at 110
Zoustar unconfirmed and will take a while due to court process
Written Tycoon 110

Then in 6th is NASD and his fee was 88k
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ianb Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Apr 2018 at 12:04pm
Is he any better then Lion Hunter at the same stage?
Second Chance may have the correct info on this but I believe he is equal if not a touch behind.   If memory serves me correct Lion Hunter started at 5k then jumped to either 11k or 22k based on his super first season stats with about 14 individual 2yo winners plus a group 1 winner in Lovely Jubly. Surely SOB is worth 33k tops
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mumtaz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Apr 2018 at 1:05pm
In principle I agree with the overpriced comments.

However when I saw this I also saw that his yearling average is $161 750 (breednet.com) which means that average will be 2.9 times his new fee. Given this and the 300 mares waiting there is a rational argument for the (gross!) increase.

If it were me - and I am much less experienced than they in setting fees in Qld - I would have gone for $40K, which is still dreadfully high for Qld.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Speediskey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Apr 2018 at 1:16pm
Originally posted by Mumtaz Mumtaz wrote:

In principle I agree with the overpriced comments.

However when I saw this I also saw that his yearling average is $161 750 (breednet.com) which means that average will be 2.9 times his new fee. Given this and the 300 mares waiting there is a rational argument for the (gross!) increase.

If it were me - and I am much less experienced than they in setting fees in Qld - I would have gone for $40K, which is still dreadfully high for Qld.

Lets be honest, you might get 10-20 mares from Queensland.

The vast majority are coming from NSW.

My guess before finding out was 35 + GST which I thought would have been fair.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ianb Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Apr 2018 at 2:18pm
I guess at the end of the day Eureka and the shareholders need to make hay while the sun shines. Good luck to them all. If people are willing to pay than go for it
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote lulu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Apr 2018 at 10:29am
I have to say I saw this coming. I was hoping for 30 plus and had 2 mares lined up if he was. The rumour mill had him up to as much as 80 plus.
The old case of supply and demand is always at work and is working overtime here.

If you think about it. After beating off offers from all over the shop, from studs that would have stood him for as much or even more mind you.

Bloody good luck to them!

They punted on him, put there money behind him, backed him all over the country and it has paid off.

I am out at the 50 plus as at that price he now poses a serious risk but I take my hat off to them. They have orchestrated it magnificently.

Now however, the pressure is on.
You're either Einstein or Frankenstein in this game.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lordy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Apr 2018 at 12:09pm
Does that make him the most expensive stallion even in QLD? Show a Heart stood at 33k at his peak. That was on the back of multiple G1 winners and quality product9over several seasons.

SoB is on the back of a few early 2yo Listed winners. Time will tell if this is sustainable, particularly in QLD where the breeding industry is not exactly booming (pun intended).
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Lordy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Apr 2018 at 12:26pm
Was meant to say most expensive EVER.

It's a shame we can't be trusted with an edit function on this site.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Speediskey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Apr 2018 at 8:31am
Originally posted by Speediskey Speediskey wrote:

I suppose the only real way to compare first season sites is based on the two year old tables, and he is 5th. The ones above him have a fee much larger than 55k.

Snitzel at 176
I Am Invincible at 110
Zoustar unconfirmed and will take a while due to court process
Written Tycoon 110

Then in 6th is NASD and his fee was 88k

Updated for this year

1. Snitzel 220k
2. I Am Invincible - Not released yet (2017 was 110k, can see it moving up)
3. Zoustar 60.5k
4. Written Tycoon 110k
5. Spirit of Boom 55k
6. Hinchinbrook (Unreleased, was 44k, can see it moving up)
7. Not a Single Doubt 99k

So despite Spirit of Boom looking really over priced at 55k, hes really on par with the lower ones around him on the two year old sire tables, and a lot less than half of them.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Speediskey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Apr 2018 at 4:45pm
Originally posted by Speediskey Speediskey wrote:

Originally posted by Speediskey Speediskey wrote:

I suppose the only real way to compare first season sites is based on the two year old tables, and he is 5th. The ones above him have a fee much larger than 55k.

Snitzel at 176
I Am Invincible at 110
Zoustar unconfirmed and will take a while due to court process
Written Tycoon 110

Then in 6th is NASD and his fee was 88k

Updated for this year

1. Snitzel 220k
2. I Am Invincible - 192.5k
3. Zoustar 60.5k
4. Written Tycoon 110k
5. Spirit of Boom 55k
6. Hinchinbrook 55k
7. Not a Single Doubt 99k

So despite Spirit of Boom looking really over priced at 55k, hes really on par with the lower ones around him on the two year old sire tables, and a lot less than half of them.

Updated after Yarraman released fees.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Second Chance Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Apr 2018 at 4:54pm
What we don't yet know is whether or not he's a one hit wonder.  Most of the other stallions mentioned havea proven record over quite some time.




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Speediskey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Apr 2018 at 6:36pm
Well of course they do, all the ones there with prove records are 2-4 times his price and have had good mares though?

The only 'new' stallions on that list are Zoustar who had a great book of mares and Hinchinbrook, who has proven to be a 'good' stallion.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sir Gov Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Apr 2018 at 6:55pm
These prices rises will ultimately send the yearling market into a spin and foal crop numbers will continue to decline.

I know everyone can only see the % increases in sales for recent years - however it wont be commercial for syndicators or smaller owners/breeders.  Stallion inflation is high!

Look at the new boys....Hellbent.....Pariah all at $20k+ 3rd stringers at best.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Second Chance Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Apr 2018 at 6:59pm
Yes, the proven stallions are entitled to command three or four times more than SOB, and I'd be heading to NASD at $99k or E&E at $82.5k long before forking out $55k for the newcomer whose two stakes-winners thus far have won in Qld Listed company. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sir Gov Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Apr 2018 at 7:28pm
Simplistic way of looking at it:

Using this years fee, comparing to returns on current yearlings. Does not factor in those on the upward trend (ie. SOB). However if you look at ROI, then those at the bottom you may want to do more work.....Written Tycoon gives the least value.

Zoustar still attractively priced vs the others.

Total Gross Avg 2018 Service Fee Return on Service Fee
Lonhro 8 $1,880,000 $235,000 $55,000 427%
Exceed and Excel  37 $11,090,000 $299,730 $82,500 363%
Zoustar 78 $15,362,500 $196,955 $60,500 326%
All Too Hard  60 $6,276,000 $104,600 $33,000 317%
Teofilo 17 $2,296,000 $135,059 $44,000 307%
Spirit of Boom 63 $10,148,500 $161,087 $55,000 293%
Sebring 72 $13,420,000 $186,389 $66,000 282%
Redoute's Choice 31 $11,930,000 $384,839 $137,500 280%
Pierro 53 $12,795,000 $241,415 $88,000 274%
More Than Ready  63 $11,042,000 $175,270 $66,000 266%
Not a Single Doubt 67 $16,710,000 $249,403 $99,000 252%
Hinchinbrook 66 $8,908,000 $134,970 $55,000 245%
I am Invincible 97 $43,000,000 $443,299 $192,000 231%
So You Think 65 $6,580,000 $101,231 $44,000 230%
Snitzel 87 $40,975,000 $470,977 $220,000 214%
Written Tycoon 75 $14,650,000 $195,333 $110,000 178%

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Second Chance Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Apr 2018 at 7:59pm
Good post.

Will be interesting to see if SOB will return the same percentile result for yearlings conceived this year at five times his initial fee.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote adolphus twirk Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Apr 2018 at 11:48pm
Stallion fees are not sustainable at high levels. Shades of the GFC and collateral debt obligations or going back to the sixties, pyramid selling. 8 years ago I got a mare to Written Tycoon for $6600. Good stallion but not $110000 and the same argument applies to many others. I can see a market turning to gelato in 2,years time
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lulu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Apr 2018 at 12:04pm
Originally posted by Sir Gov Sir Gov wrote:

Simplistic way of looking at it:

Using this years fee, comparing to returns on current yearlings. Does not factor in those on the upward trend (ie. SOB). However if you look at ROI, then those at the bottom you may want to do more work.....Written Tycoon gives the least value.

Zoustar still attractively priced vs the others.



Simplistic yes. Sir Gov.
Another way to look at those figures and to perhaps determine value going forwards, would be to look at the service fees paid at the time for those stallions versus average yearling price.

You can see a totally different perspective on say Written Tycoon for a start.

Then factor in the mare quality after subsequent price hikes and yearling prices in the furure . Market factors being equal of course.

Lonhro 88k
Exceed and Excel 110k
Zoustar 44k
All Too Hard 55k
Teofilo 22k
Spirit Of Boom 11k
Sebring 66k
Redoutes Choice 110k
Pierro 77k
More Than Ready 66k
Not A Single Doubt 33k
Hinchinbrook 16.5k
I Am Invincible 55k
So You Think 55k
Snitzel 88k
Written Tycoon 19.8k






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<td ="xl66" width="43" style="width:32pt">Total</td>
<td ="xl68" width="89" style="width:67pt">Gross</td>
<td ="xl68" width="69" style="width:52pt">Avg</td>
<td ="xl68" width="121" style="width:91pt">2018 Service Fee</td>
<td ="xl66" width="155" style="width:116pt">Return on Service Fee</td>
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<tr height="21" style="height:16.0pt">
<td height="21" ="xl66" style="height:16.0pt;margin-right:0px;padding-bottom:    2px;padding-top:2px">Lonhro</td>
<td ="xl70">8</td>
<td ="xl71">$1,880,000</td>
<td ="xl71">$235,000</td>
<td ="xl71" style="margin-right:0px;padding-bottom:2px;padding-top:2px">$55,000</td>
<td ="xl67">427%</td>
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<tr height="21" style="height:16.0pt">
<td height="21" ="xl66" style="height:16.0pt;margin-right:0px;padding-bottom:    2px;padding-top:2px">Exceed and Excel </td>
<td ="xl70">37</td>
<td ="xl71">$11,090,000</td>
<td ="xl71">$299,730</td>
<td ="xl71" style="margin-right:0px;padding-bottom:2px;padding-top:2px">$82,500</td>
<td ="xl67">363%</td>
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<tr height="21" style="height:16.0pt">
<td height="21" ="xl66" style="height:16.0pt">Zoustar</td>
<td ="xl70">78</td>
<td ="xl71">$15,362,500</td>
<td ="xl71">$196,955</td>
<td ="xl71">$60,500</td>
<td ="xl67">326%</td>
</tr>
<tr height="21" style="height:16.0pt">
<td height="21" ="xl66" style="height:16.0pt;margin-right:0px;padding-bottom:    2px;padding-top:2px">All Too Hard </td>
<td ="xl70">60</td>
<td ="xl71">$6,276,000</td>
<td ="xl71">$104,600</td>
<td ="xl71" style="margin-right:0px;padding-bottom:2px;padding-top:2px">$33,000</td>
<td ="xl67">317%</td>
</tr>
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<td height="21" ="xl66" style="height:16.0pt;margin-right:0px;padding-bottom:    2px;padding-top:2px">Teofilo</td>
<td ="xl70">17</td>
<td ="xl71">$2,296,000</td>
<td ="xl71">$135,059</td>
<td ="xl71" style="margin-right:0px;padding-bottom:2px;padding-top:2px">$44,000</td>
<td ="xl67">307%</td>
</tr>
<tr height="21" style="height:16.0pt">
<td height="21" ="xl66" style="height:16.0pt">Spirit of Boom</td>
<td ="xl70">63</td>
<td ="xl71">$10,148,500</td>
<td ="xl71">$161,087</td>
<td ="xl71">$55,000</td>
<td ="xl67">293%</td>
</tr>
<tr height="21" style="height:16.0pt">
<td height="21" ="xl66" style="height:16.0pt;margin-right:0px;padding-bottom:    2px;padding-top:2px">Sebring</td>
<td ="xl70">72</td>
<td ="xl71">$13,420,000</td>
<td ="xl71">$186,389</td>
<td ="xl71" style="margin-right:0px;padding-bottom:2px;padding-top:2px">$66,000</td>
<td ="xl67">282%</td>
</tr>
<tr height="21" style="height:16.0pt">
<td height="21" ="xl66" style="height:16.0pt;margin-right:0px;padding-bottom:    2px;padding-top:2px">Redoute's Choice</td>
<td ="xl70">31</td>
<td ="xl71">$11,930,000</td>
<td ="xl71">$384,839</td>
<td ="xl71" style="margin-right:0px;padding-bottom:2px;padding-top:2px">$137,500</td>
<td ="xl67">280%</td>
</tr>
<tr height="21" style="height:16.0pt">
<td height="21" ="xl66" style="height:16.0pt;margin-right:0px;padding-bottom:    2px;padding-top:2px">Pierro</td>
<td ="xl70">53</td>
<td ="xl71">$12,795,000</td>
<td ="xl71">$241,415</td>
<td ="xl71" style="margin-right:0px;padding-bottom:2px;padding-top:2px">$88,000</td>
<td ="xl67">274%</td>
</tr>
<tr height="21" style="height:16.0pt">
<td height="21" ="xl66" style="height:16.0pt;margin-right:0px;padding-bottom:    2px;padding-top:2px">More Than Ready </td>
<td ="xl70">63</td>
<td ="xl71">$11,042,000</td>
<td ="xl71">$175,270</td>
<td ="xl71" style="margin-right:0px;padding-bottom:2px;padding-top:2px">$66,000</td>
<td ="xl67">266%</td>
</tr>
<tr height="21" style="height:16.0pt">
<td height="21" ="xl66" style="height:16.0pt">Not a Single Doubt</td>
<td ="xl70">67</td>
<td ="xl71">$16,710,000</td>
<td ="xl71">$249,403</td>
<td ="xl71">$99,000</td>
<td ="xl67">252%</td>
</tr>
<tr height="21" style="height:16.0pt">
<td height="21" ="xl66" style="height:16.0pt">Hinchinbrook</td>
<td ="xl70">66</td>
<td ="xl71">$8,908,000</td>
<td ="xl71">$134,970</td>
<td ="xl72">$55,000</td>
<td ="xl67">245%</td>
</tr>
<tr height="21" style="height:16.0pt">
<td height="21" ="xl66" style="height:16.0pt">I am Invincible</td>
<td ="xl70">97</td>
<td ="xl71">$43,000,000</td>
<td ="xl71">$443,299</td>
<td ="xl71">$192,000</td>
<td ="xl67">231%</td>
</tr>
<tr height="21" style="height:16.0pt">
<td height="21" ="xl66" style="height:16.0pt;margin-right:0px;padding-bottom:    2px;padding-top:2px">So You Think</td>
<td ="xl70">65</td>
<td ="xl71">$6,580,000</td>
<td ="xl71">$101,231</td>
<td ="xl71" style="margin-right:0px;padding-bottom:2px;padding-top:2px">$44,000</td>
<td ="xl67">230%</td>
</tr>
<tr height="21" style="height:16.0pt">
<td height="21" ="xl66" style="height:16.0pt">Snitzel</td>
<td ="xl70">87</td>
<td ="xl71">$40,975,000</td>
<td ="xl71">$470,977</td>
<td ="xl71">$220,000</td>
<td ="xl67">214%</td>
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<td height="21" ="xl66" style="height:16.0pt">Written Tycoon</td>
<td ="xl70">75</td>
<td ="xl71">$14,650,000</td>
<td ="xl71">$195,333</td>
<td ="xl71">$110,000</td>
<td ="xl67">178%</td>
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You're either Einstein or Frankenstein in this game.
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lulu View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote lulu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Apr 2018 at 12:45pm
Hope someone can fix up that mumbo jumbo.
You're either Einstein or Frankenstein in this game.
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Lordy View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lordy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Apr 2018 at 1:54pm
Originally posted by adolphus twirk adolphus twirk wrote:

Stallion fees are not sustainable at high levels. Shades of the GFC and collateral debt obligations or going back to the sixties, pyramid selling. 8 years ago I got a mare to Written Tycoon for $6600. Good stallion but not $110000 and the same argument applies to many others. I can see a market turning to gelato in 2,years time

It all starts with people paying way too much for yearlings. This is effectively untried stock yet they are valued as if they're already Group winners. If/when that market softens the flow on effect will happen quickly. People paying massive fees for so.emof these stallions are hoping it can sustain for at least another 3 years or they will get burnt.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote linghi11 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Apr 2018 at 3:24pm
The stallion owners have jacked their fees up like there’s no tomorrow.
to the victor
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sir Gov Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Apr 2018 at 5:02pm
Sending my mares to NZ - market irrational here.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cityboy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Apr 2018 at 9:53am
I did that a few years ago and recommend it
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lulu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Apr 2018 at 7:25pm
Originally posted by Lordy Lordy wrote:

Originally posted by adolphus twirk adolphus twirk wrote:

Stallion fees are not sustainable at high levels. Shades of the GFC and collateral debt obligations or going back to the sixties, pyramid selling. 8 years ago I got a mare to Written Tycoon for $6600. Good stallion but not $110000 and the same argument applies to many others. I can see a market turning to gelato in 2,years time

It all starts with people paying way too much for yearlings. This is effectively untried stock yet they are valued as if they're already Group winners. If/when that market softens the flow on effect will happen quickly. People paying massive fees for so.emof these stallions are hoping it can sustain for at least another 3 years or they will get burnt.

I am hearing you loud and clear. However, the increased prizemonies and richer races that are seemingly growing all the time are keeping many people both interested and profitable. 

I'll agree though that stallion fees are becoming way too expensive and the toughest part is that the buying bench in my opinion is becoming very polarised. 

Everyone with enough folding is after a Snitzel or an IAI at present. Spirit Of Boom is just massively popular right NOW! 
Who knows, he may be as popular as he is ever going to get!

But with 4 stakes winners from 39 runners at 10.5% stakes winners to runners and 14 individual winners from those 39 runners so far. He may be overpriced, but then that's only if you don't have the money, and he is not as overpriced as some.

I believe they are both limiting and screening mares and turning back many, so the best is obviously to come  Do you think though that for a second he would stand for less in the Hunter where 2 known big players had a crack at getting him?
Not on your nelly.

In the end, no doubt to hang onto him, the shareholders had to be appeased.
And wouldn't you just love to be one?Smile

And I can tell you that I knocked back a Written Tycoon some seasons back for 3k plus and sent one 2 seasons back at 45 plus. 

The first one would have in hindsight made me a little bit , the second one touch wood should do very well.
Things change, move and slip through your fingers in this game. You need a crystal ball and an ability to adapt, a lot of luck and very deep pockets.  Oh and did I mention a lot of luck?Smile

You're either Einstein or Frankenstein in this game.
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