Join up at Bet Easy - Click here - Bet Easy is Thoroughbred Village’s premier betting partner - Join here now
Forum Home Forum Home > Horse Breeding - Public Forums > Stallions
  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - Snitzel
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Events   Register Register  Login Login


Click here for the Thoroughbred Village Home Page. For village news, follow @TBVillage on Twitter. For horseracing tips, follow @Villagebet on Twitter. To contact the Mayor by email: Click Here.

Snitzel

 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <1234 5>
Author
Message
Lordy View Drop Down
Champion
Champion
Avatar

Joined: 22 May 2010
Location: Sunshine State
Status: Offline
Points: 13435
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lordy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Dec 2015 at 8:12pm
11 Stakeswinners last season.  Equal 3rd with Redoutes Choice.  Only Fasten Rock and Exceed and Excel.  He goes alright and memories aren't quite that short.

Still expect to see people forking out more for hyped up 1st season sires at the upcoming sales. 
Back to Top
Sponsored Links
Click here to view the promotions at Bet Easy.


Back to Top
furious View Drop Down
Champion
Champion


Joined: 19 Feb 2007
Status: Offline
Points: 13097
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote furious Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Dec 2015 at 6:05am
It can happen when a sire looses a lot to stud etc.  You have to remember he had quite a few three year old G1 or SW winners retired to stud in recently.  So he doesn't have his class horses for the older races.  It happened with Bletchingly early on when they retired nearly every stakes winner he had to stud he struggled for a bit before the next generation matured enough.
Back to Top
Gay3 View Drop Down
Moderator Group
Moderator Group


Joined: 19 Feb 2007
Location: Ballarat
Status: Offline
Points: 31436
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gay3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Dec 2015 at 6:13am
bump

Experience is something you gain a few minutes after you could have used it!
Back to Top
Beliskner View Drop Down
Champion
Champion


Joined: 10 Apr 2015
Location: Victoria
Status: Offline
Points: 4236
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Beliskner Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Dec 2015 at 10:43am
Maybe my logic is completely flawed, but he would have benefited from all the hype Sizzling have, the way some people talked about him it was like he was some multiple group 1 champion race horse, yes he won the TJ Smith, but his post-2yo form never warranted the type of hype he received IMHO.

Also Wandjina to a lesser degree, hyped up as some super horse, he eventually proved himself a group 1 performer, and apparently is a fantastic type, but again IMO his not at the level i heard some people talk about him.

So there is probably that stallion making appeal to him, more so then other sires recently, their's plenty of Redoute's sons around, and too many Fastnet's need the ultimate gear change to gamble on them as a stallion, perhaps Snitzel's are seen as better stallion gamble for owners and studs looking to strike gold.


Or i am way off and what i've said is utter gibberish.
Back to Top
Lordy View Drop Down
Champion
Champion
Avatar

Joined: 22 May 2010
Location: Sunshine State
Status: Offline
Points: 13435
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lordy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Dec 2015 at 10:56am
Originally posted by Beliskner Beliskner wrote:

Maybe my logic is completely flawed, but he would have benefited from all the hype Sizzling have, the way some people talked about him it was like he was some multiple group 1 champion race horse, yes he won the TJ Smith, but his post-2yo form never warranted the type of hype he received IMHO.

Also Wandjina to a lesser degree, hyped up as some super horse, he eventually proved himself a group 1 performer, and apparently is a fantastic type, but again IMO his not at the level i heard some people talk about him.

So there is probably that stallion making appeal to him, more so then other sires recently, their's plenty of Redoute's sons around, and too many Fastnet's need the ultimate gear change to gamble on them as a stallion, perhaps Snitzel's are seen as better stallion gamble for owners and studs looking to strike gold.


Or i am way off and what i've said is utter gibberish.
Not sure I'm following.  I don't see any particular hype horse that Snitzel produced distorting perceptions of his own quality.  He's got 70% winners to runners, 7.5% Stakes winners to runners and 6 individual Group 1 winners here in Aust.  Thats from 6 full crops of racing age.  His numbers are up there with the best and although his $88k stud fee is also up there I reckon he's justified it.
Back to Top
Beliskner View Drop Down
Champion
Champion


Joined: 10 Apr 2015
Location: Victoria
Status: Offline
Points: 4236
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Beliskner Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Dec 2015 at 11:12am
I was referring to his stud fee, don't get me wrong his definitely one of the countries top sires, but why it's gotten that high could be partly based on what i said, or i could be 100% wrong, i just think he does tend to get colts/stallions that get a bit overhyped.
Back to Top
Speediskey View Drop Down
Champion
Champion
Avatar

Joined: 18 Feb 2014
Status: Online
Points: 3671
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Speediskey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Dec 2015 at 12:24pm
Yeah to be honest none of his progeny have really been hyped that much - Wandjina had a little bit before he did anything purely because of his price tag but not hyped at all really. Sizzling was a good Queenslander and thats about it. 

I think Snitzel is a top sire, give it time to average out, hes guaranteed to finish higher on the table than he is now, wait for the two year olds to get going.
Back to Top
Hazyview View Drop Down
Yearling
Yearling


Joined: 16 Jan 2014
Status: Offline
Points: 197
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hazyview Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Dec 2015 at 12:57pm
I think Sizzling was what he was - a nice Queensland horse by, what was at the time, a cheap stallion.

Wandjina was probably a genuine top-liner by the end of his career, the All Aged 2nd against a top-of-his-powers Dissident showed that. Would have been interesting to see how he got on as a 4YO, the Australian Guineas form has also worked out well, but alas, the breeding barn called!
Back to Top
goldey View Drop Down
Champion
Champion
Avatar

Joined: 29 Dec 2012
Location: cairns
Status: Offline
Points: 4919
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote goldey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Dec 2015 at 5:09pm
A lot can said of his stallion fee rise, maybe it can be put down to the prices they are bringing at the sales , he seems to be a good producer of nice types and that is a fair  start .His Stats are good but looking at the mares they are taking , virtually any willing to part with money ,his stats may drop a little in the future  , one can't dismiss the value of his female line  maybe NASD is a better option value wise at the moment .
Back to Top
Lordy View Drop Down
Champion
Champion
Avatar

Joined: 22 May 2010
Location: Sunshine State
Status: Offline
Points: 13435
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lordy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Dec 2015 at 8:09pm
The only other stallion in his price bracket is Lonhro. Very similar stud records too. If you drop your price bracket slightly he would be among Pierro, All Too Hard and Sepoy. Reckon he's achieved a fair bit more than them at stud.
Back to Top
Hazyview View Drop Down
Yearling
Yearling


Joined: 16 Jan 2014
Status: Offline
Points: 197
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hazyview Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Dec 2015 at 8:18pm
He's definitely an elite stallion. Comparing to Lonhro, they have a very similar SW and GW %, though Lonhro has two more crops than Snitzel which very much makes me favour Snitzel. Also Snitzel already has more 2YO SW than Lonhro.

He is Mr Commercial.
Back to Top
Red Hare View Drop Down
Champion
Champion


Joined: 11 Jan 2015
Location: Victoria
Status: Offline
Points: 2580
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Red Hare Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Dec 2015 at 10:17pm
Originally posted by Lordy Lordy wrote:

The only other stallion in his price bracket is Lonhro. Very similar stud records too. If you drop your price bracket slightly he would be among Pierro, All Too Hard and Sepoy. Reckon he's achieved a fair bit more than them at stud.
True, but that doesn't mean those three are in the right bracket.

But hey, I also can't understand how people pay $1,000+ for a wrist watch.

Snitzel has over 1,057 foals on the ground. Some might suggest that his 2015 book (if it's as big as his last three, leaving 150+ foals) would be the last, before the laws of diminishing returns take over. I wonder if the studs take that into consideration when pricing to a market or turning over their roster?
Back to Top
bradjm View Drop Down
Champion
Champion


Joined: 13 Mar 2007
Location: Australia
Status: Offline
Points: 6175
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote bradjm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Dec 2015 at 6:10am
His figures sit a little above al Maher who never had the same opportunity and can be had for not much more than the gst component of snitzel.

Snitzel however is a sales ring darling.
Back to Top
Hazyview View Drop Down
Yearling
Yearling


Joined: 16 Jan 2014
Status: Offline
Points: 197
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hazyview Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Dec 2015 at 7:12am
That's kind of a blinkered way of looking at it - you've got to be getting stock (colts and fillies) which appeal to the commercial market, Al Maher is a failure in this sense, especially as his colts need to be gelded!

You would quickly go broke breeding to Al Maher, you'd be ok with Snitzel.
Back to Top
Lordy View Drop Down
Champion
Champion
Avatar

Joined: 22 May 2010
Location: Sunshine State
Status: Offline
Points: 13435
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lordy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Dec 2015 at 7:46am
Al Maher's stud record is quite good, especially when you look at his price.  Not in Snitzel's class though.

As for opportunity, they both started at a similar fee.  Al Maher got larger books early on.
Back to Top
bradjm View Drop Down
Champion
Champion


Joined: 13 Mar 2007
Location: Australia
Status: Offline
Points: 6175
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bradjm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Dec 2015 at 1:49pm
Originally posted by Hazyview Hazyview wrote:

That's kind of a blinkered way of looking at it - you've got to be getting stock (colts and fillies) which appeal to the commercial market, Al Maher is a failure in this sense, especially as his colts need to be gelded!

You would quickly go broke breeding to Al Maher, you'd be ok with Snitzel.



Yes as I said snitzel is a sales ring darling

No blinkers
Back to Top
Hazyview View Drop Down
Yearling
Yearling


Joined: 16 Jan 2014
Status: Offline
Points: 197
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hazyview Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Dec 2015 at 2:21pm
Originally posted by bradjm bradjm wrote:

Originally posted by Hazyview Hazyview wrote:

That's kind of a blinkered way of looking at it - you've got to be getting stock (colts and fillies) which appeal to the commercial market, Al Maher is a failure in this sense, especially as his colts need to be gelded!

You would quickly go broke breeding to Al Maher, you'd be ok with Snitzel.



Yes as I said snitzel is a sales ring darling

No blinkers

Because he produces what the market wants. Al Maher does not. They have similar 'results' but the make up of those results is very different which leads to the difference in the sales ring.

It's not the sales ring hyping up Snitzel, more the fact that he produces what this country wants. I think saying 'sales ring darling' is doing him a disservice, that's all.
Back to Top
lotto7 View Drop Down
Champion
Champion
Avatar

Joined: 14 Jan 2009
Status: Offline
Points: 1133
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lotto7 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Dec 2015 at 9:08am
Originally posted by Hazyview Hazyview wrote:

Originally posted by bradjm bradjm wrote:

Originally posted by Hazyview Hazyview wrote:

That's kind of a blinkered way of looking at it - you've got to be getting stock (colts and fillies) which appeal to the commercial market, Al Maher is a failure in this sense, especially as his colts need to be gelded!

You would quickly go broke breeding to Al Maher, you'd be ok with Snitzel.



Yes as I said snitzel is a sales ring darling

No blinkers

Because he produces what the market wants. Al Maher does not. They have similar 'results' but the make up of those results is very different which leads to the difference in the sales ring.

It's not the sales ring hyping up Snitzel, more the fact that he produces what this country wants. I think saying 'sales ring darling' is doing him a disservice, that's all.


Have to agree with brad here as I think Snitzel is a sales ring darling on the back of results. He is producing the same type of horse that he was earlier in his career but struggled a bit and hence the price drop in service fees. Then came the results and the success in the ring followed. The type has not changed at all just that people will now buy them in the ring because of the results he has had on the track. Don't believe sales ring darling is doing the horse a disservice at all. He is a good stallion, gets results and his progeny is popular in the sales ring.
Back to Top
Lordy View Drop Down
Champion
Champion
Avatar

Joined: 22 May 2010
Location: Sunshine State
Status: Offline
Points: 13435
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lordy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Jan 2016 at 5:33pm
I was going into bat for Snitzel in this thread.  Even so I can't understand why the market went nutso for his stock at the sales last week.
Back to Top
goldey View Drop Down
Champion
Champion
Avatar

Joined: 29 Dec 2012
Location: cairns
Status: Offline
Points: 4919
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote goldey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Jan 2016 at 8:50pm
Had a Group 1 winner
In Hong Kong today.
Back to Top
furious View Drop Down
Champion
Champion


Joined: 19 Feb 2007
Status: Offline
Points: 13097
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote furious Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Jan 2016 at 7:13am
With Umatilla in the pedigree he's inbred to Dancing Show 4 f x 3m.  Interesting to see that one he beat in maiden in Australia (Winston's Lad) has also made his way to Hong Kong and is also a winner there.
Back to Top
furious View Drop Down
Champion
Champion


Joined: 19 Feb 2007
Status: Offline
Points: 13097
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote furious Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Feb 2016 at 7:44am
He has had a very good month of February with a dual HKG1 winner and a G2 & G3 winners in Sydney. Plus four other stakes placed.
Back to Top
furious View Drop Down
Champion
Champion


Joined: 19 Feb 2007
Status: Offline
Points: 13097
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote furious Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Aug 2016 at 9:49am
This boy has started this season flying.  Three stakes winners in two weeks and lots of stakes placed also.  If he can get one or two of his three year olds up over a distance (something which has happened previously) he could go close to winning this season.  Likewise I am Invincible has commence with good results.  So two stalilons who have been selling exceptionally well have come out firing for the purchases.
Back to Top
furious View Drop Down
Champion
Champion


Joined: 19 Feb 2007
Status: Offline
Points: 13097
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote furious Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Aug 2016 at 9:50am
buyers might of been a better word as I left the er off anyway!
Back to Top
goldey View Drop Down
Champion
Champion
Avatar

Joined: 29 Dec 2012
Location: cairns
Status: Offline
Points: 4919
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote goldey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Aug 2016 at 11:11am
Had a group winner in Japan over the weekend also .
Back to Top
furious View Drop Down
Champion
Champion


Joined: 19 Feb 2007
Status: Offline
Points: 13097
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote furious Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Aug 2016 at 11:34am
Over $900,000AUS to the winner for that G3 in Japan.  Boy they race for some big prizes.
Back to Top
djebel View Drop Down
Champion
Champion
Avatar

Joined: 07 Mar 2007
Status: Offline
Points: 36794
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Mar 2017 at 10:30am


STRIKE WHILST THE IRON IS HOT

reductio ad absurdum

The richest man is not he who has the most, but he who needs the least.

Back to Top
furious View Drop Down
Champion
Champion


Joined: 19 Feb 2007
Status: Offline
Points: 13097
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote furious Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Mar 2017 at 12:10pm
It nice to know the little boys can make the grade.  You don't have to be a big big boy.
Back to Top
acacia alba View Drop Down
Champion
Champion


Joined: 30 Oct 2010
Status: Offline
Points: 24391
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote acacia alba Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Mar 2017 at 1:06pm
Golly he has made the grade alright !Clap
animals before people.
Back to Top
goldey View Drop Down
Champion
Champion
Avatar

Joined: 29 Dec 2012
Location: cairns
Status: Offline
Points: 4919
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote goldey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Mar 2017 at 3:47pm
His stats as a broodmare sire are quiet freakish also .
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <1234 5>
  Share Topic   

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Forum Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 11.10
Copyright ©2001-2017 Web Wiz Ltd.

This page was generated in 0.047 seconds.