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Sepoy

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ringlock Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Sepoy
    Posted: 28 May 2012 at 5:57pm
Sepoy to stand this year, at $66,000

Edited by Gay3 - 12 Dec 2015 at 12:57pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote VSP. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 May 2012 at 6:14pm
With respect to Darley - that is ridiculous. A son of Elusive Quality @ 66k, not for me.
As a top class galloper he deserves a good fee but I would have thought 33k would about pull him up. Anyway no doubt he'll fully book and I'll be the bad judge Tongue.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote subastral Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 May 2012 at 6:25pm
Ha ha ha, $66,000 for a horse that hardly screams, nor looks, like a stallion. And as VSP points out, he is by Elusive Quality, not Fastnet Rock. Some people have too much money if they pay that.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote subastral Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 May 2012 at 6:26pm
Are they going to put him on a ladder to reach the tall mares, or will he only serve short ones like him??
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bradjm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 May 2012 at 6:42pm
Well if Manhattan rain could command 40k then he's a fair price.

66k ffs

Tell em they're dreamin
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Run For Fun Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 May 2012 at 7:49pm
The good top studs have built up a terrific client base over the years and for the main part support these clients in terms of preferential deals in relation to both fee and syndication opportunities.  Many of these clients, moreover, can significantly write their thoroughbred costs off against their primary but linked business interests.
 
These factors imo explain why a number of new stallions are frequently booked out before the start of their initial season, and goes some way to understanding why proponents can maintain that the (inflated) fee is entirely justified. 
 
History however demonstrates that the majority of private breeders paying full freight without alternate tax relief for expensive tyro stallions will end up with a hole in their aggregate areses, irrespective of the stallion concerned.  Particularly as 20-25% at very best of their foals will make the Select sales.
 
And if you need to look just a bit further, perform an analysis regarding the increase, maintenance, or reduction in fee of a selection of new stallions over their first five years at stud. 
 
As for Sepoy: terrific performer from a lovely female family, however $44k tops for mine.
 
It's hard to soar with eagles...

Cheers
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Quezacotl Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 May 2012 at 8:08pm
Why was this horse sent overseas to race in the first place...?

he should of been sent back here to race on, he is only 3 and has many more wins in him surely...one start in Dubai what a total waste of a good horse...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote melbsteve Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 May 2012 at 8:16pm
Would the 66k have been increased if he won in Dubai?  Would that be one of the reasons he went there?  I know zip about breeding so go easy on me if i am asking silly questions.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Run For Fun Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 May 2012 at 8:36pm
Mate, imo a win in Dubai wouldn't have justifed or even caused a higher fee than the announced $66k.  It was a fairly pox race from an Internation perspective, like most if not all the races on the card where few winners will have improved their stud value.
 
It's hard to soar with eagles...

Cheers
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote melbsteve Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 May 2012 at 8:49pm
Fair point, and from what i've seen so far, the form from that Dubai meeting is pretty thin.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Quezacotl Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 May 2012 at 8:54pm
Originally posted by melbsteve melbsteve wrote:

Fair point, and from what i've seen so far, the form from that Dubai meeting is pretty thin.


Hope you are wrong about that...ORTENSIA...Confused
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MichaelM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 May 2012 at 9:18pm
Originally posted by Quezacotl Quezacotl wrote:

Why was this horse sent overseas to race in the first place...?

he should of been sent back here to race on, he is only 3 and has many more wins in him surely...one start in Dubai what a total waste of a good horse...
 
I guess its the same reason they send 5-6 horses over each year to Godolphin, as they are trying to provide a link for Sheikh Mohammed between Darley Australia and the European operation.  Also they were probably trying to make him into a shuttler.  I still think he will go on to Ascot and Newmarket before returning for stud duty.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote melbsteve Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 May 2012 at 9:27pm
Originally posted by Quezacotl Quezacotl wrote:

Originally posted by melbsteve melbsteve wrote:

Fair point, and from what i've seen so far, the form from that Dubai meeting is pretty thin.


Hope you are wrong about that...ORTENSIA...Confused

I hope i am too but i was referring to (hopeless with names) the horse that beat Rocket Man then failed badly in the Kris Flyer in Singapore, then the Godolphin horse that beat SYT then got smacked in HK.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gee Gee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 May 2012 at 12:25am
Coulda woulda shoulda stayed here and won the william reid and tj smith.

fab colt. great female family.

Just a few things turn me off:
- elusive quality
- didnt race beyond 7f (but mare can negate that + his close relation induna)
- ridiculous fee

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Daraabah Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 May 2012 at 10:43pm

Mad colt, great family, best at turning out quality racing stock but lesser stallions prospects...the shadow of Untouchable casts a big cloud over a 66k fee for Sepoy and Darley would perhaps hope those people silly enough to consider it don't notice Related (Elusive Quality ex Cousins by Danehill ex Kincay by Marscay) is 3/4 'related' at just $4400....

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sunline Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 May 2012 at 11:43pm
The mind boggles where this garbage comes from. Has anyone been watching the sales of late? They can't sell multiple Group 1 winning mares, let alone yearlings!

Runfer you perhaps make some sense of it all. Like you say though, it doesn't change the fact that these studs seem to put up more ridiculous fees the more the market declines.

Elusive Quality...where is that old vomit emoticon. I wouldn't send a mare for $40K.
Sunline...simply supreme
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote subastral Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 May 2012 at 11:55pm
Question to all the breeding buffs. Sepoy is well-built, but he is certainly on the small side. Will this go against him as a sire? All the great stallions seem to be big units. I remember seeing horses like Redoutes race, and you knew he would be a great sire. I don't get that from Sepoy.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MichaelM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jun 2012 at 12:21am
Correct me if I'm wrong, as I'm just working straight off the top of my head, but Northern Dancer, Danzig, Star Kingdom and Sadler's Wells were all quite small.  More Than Ready isn't exactly on the tall side either with regards to more recent times.  I think its more that from a commercial point of view, breeders demand a certain amount of size in their stallions, as they are more likely than to produce bigger stock which will have more appeal when it comes time to sell at the sales.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote subastral Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jun 2012 at 12:27am
Thanks Michael for the info
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Quezacotl Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jun 2012 at 12:43am
Originally posted by MichaelM MichaelM wrote:



Correct me if I'm wrong, as I'm just working straight off the top of my head, but Northern Dancer, Danzig, Star Kingdom and Sadler's Wells were all quite small.  More Than Ready isn't exactly on the tall side either with regards to more recent times.  I think its more that from a commercial point of view, breeders demand a certain amount of size in their stallions, as they are more likely than to produce bigger stock which will have more appeal when it comes time to sell at the sales.


Like big fat shiny red tomatoes on sale at the fruit market hey Michael...

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sunline Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jun 2012 at 1:30pm
Subbie, without doubt the best stallions over time have been less than 16 hands and, as Michael said, some of the best are tiny.
Sunline...simply supreme
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ash Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jun 2012 at 1:57pm
Originally posted by Daraabah Daraabah wrote:

Mad colt, great family, best at turning out quality racing stock but lesser stallions prospects...the shadow of Untouchable casts a big cloud over a 66k fee for Sepoy and Darley would perhaps hope those people silly enough to consider it don't notice Related (Elusive Quality ex Cousins by Danehill ex Kincay by Marscay) is 3/4 'related' at just $4400....

3/4 related to Sepoy? Yes, both by Elusive Quality out of Danehill mares in turn out of Marscay mares but no common mares in the female line is there?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote don Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jun 2012 at 3:04pm
Originally posted by Ash[/QUOTE Ash[/QUOTE wrote:

3/4 related to Sepoy? Yes, both by Elusive Quality out of Danehill mares in turn out of Marscay mares but no common mares in the female line is there?
3/4 related to Sepoy? Yes, both by Elusive Quality out of Danehill mares in turn out of Marscay mares but no common mares in the female line is there?[/QUOTE]
 
You are correct about the 3/4? its 7/8 and it matters not one iota re the "female line" -there are a few "female lines" in any pedigree and therein a lot of common mares.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote don Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jun 2012 at 3:08pm
$66,000 -One has to but wonder at these fees for unproven stallions -I always wonder what they will drop the fee to if they prove reasonably successful?? 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote progeny test Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jun 2012 at 4:14pm
ATC Golden Slipper Stakes Race Winners
2yo open set weights

Year Winner Race Name That Year Status Distance
2012 Pierro (AUS) 2009 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Group 1 1200m
2011 Sepoy (AUS) 2008 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Group 1 1200m
2010 Crystal Lily (AUS) 2007 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Group 1 1200m
2009 Phelan Ready (AUS) 2006 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Group 1 1200m
2008 Sebring (AUS) 2005 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Group 1 1200m
2007 Forensics (AUS) 2004 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Group 1 1200m
2006 Miss Finland (AUS) 2003 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Group 1 1200m
2005 Stratum (AUS) 2002 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Group 1 1200m
2004 Dance Hero (AUS) 2001 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Group 1 1200m
2003 Polar Success (AUS) 2000 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Group 1 1200m
2002 Calaway Gal (AUS) 1999 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Group 1 1200m
2001 Ha Ha (AUS) 1998 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Group 1 1200m
2000 Belle Du Jour (AUS) 1997 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Group 1 1200m
1999 Catbird (AUS) 1996 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Group 1 1200m
1998 Prowl (AUS) 1995 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Group 1 1200m
1997 Guineas (AUS) 1994 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Group 1 1200m
1996 Merlene (AUS) 1993 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Group 1 1200m
1995 Flying Spur (AUS) 1992 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Group 1 1200m
1994 Danzero (AUS) 1991 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Group 1 1200m
1993 Bint Marscay (AUS) 1990 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Group 1 1200m
1992 Burst (AUS) 1989 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Group 1 1200m
1991 Tierce (AUS) 1988 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Group 1 1200m
1990 Canny Lad (AUS) 1987 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Group 1 1200m
1989 Courtza (NZ) 1986 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Group 1 1200m
1988 Star Watch (AUS) 1985 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Group 1 1200m
1987 Marauding (NZ) 1984 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Group 1 1200m
1986 Bounding Away (AUS) 1983 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Group 1 1200m
1985 Rory's Jester (AUS) 1982 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Group 1 1200m
1984 Inspired (AUS) 1981 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Group 1 1200m
1983 Sir Dapper (AUS) 1980 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Group 1 1200m
1982 Marscay (AUS) 1979 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Group 1 1200m
1981 Full On Aces (AUS) 1978 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Group 1 1200m
1980 Dark Eclipse (AUS) 1977 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Group 1 1200m
1979 Century Miss (AUS) 1976 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Principal race 1200m
1978 Manikato (AUS) 1975 ATC Golden Slipper Stakes Principal race 1200m
1977 Luskin Star (AUS) 1974 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Principal race 1200m
1976 Vivarchi (AUS) 1973 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Principal race 1200m
1975 Toy Show (AUS) 1972 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Principal race 1200m
1974 Hartshill (AUS) 1971 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Principal race 1200m
1973 Tontonan (AUS) 1970 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Principal race 1200m
1972 John's Hope (AUS) 1969 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Principal race 6F
1971 Fairy Walk (AUS) 1968 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Principal race 6F
1970 Baguette (AUS) 1967 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Principal race 6F
1969 Vain (AUS) 1966 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Principal race 6F
1968 Royal Parma (AUS) 1965 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Principal race 6F
1967 Sweet Embrace (AUS) 1964 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Principal race 6F
1966 Storm Queen (AUS) 1963 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Principal race 6F
1965 Reisling (AUS) 1962 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Principal race 6F
1964 Eskimo Prince (AUS) 1961 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Principal race 6F
1963 Pago Pago (AUS) 1960 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Principal race 6F
1962 Birthday Card (AUS) 1959 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Principal race 6F
1961 Magic Night (AUS) 1958 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Principal race 6F
1960 Sky High (AUS) 1957 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Principal race 6F
1959 Fine And Dandy (AUS) 1956 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Principal race 6F
1958 Skyline (AUS) 1955 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Principal race 6F
1957 Todman (AUS) 1954 STC Golden Slipper Stakes Principal race 6F




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Australian Turf Club Limited and Victoria Racing
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote progeny test Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jun 2012 at 4:23pm
How many of these colts would be able to stand for $60000 if they were alive today ?

Todman, Vain, Marscay, Rory's Jester ? YES

Below that price, NO

Danzero, Luskin Star, Baguette, Flying Spur, Sir Dapper, Marauding, Star Watch, Canny Lad
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote reng Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jun 2012 at 6:18pm
Flying Spur at his peak stood for more; Canny Lad, Marauding at their peak should have too.  Star Watch would have if he hadn't died after 2 crops.  

Given that only 1 in 10 stallions make it as commercial prospects, aren't you being pretty harsh?

Time will tell with Sepoy - I wonder how much advantage he had being from the EI crop but from a non-EI affected farm...
The problem with Opportunity is that it wears overalls and looks like work.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BAZZ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jun 2012 at 9:50pm
i was expecting about 66 k for his fee and dont think its so unrealistic. sepoy was one of the best two year olds ever in australia. i am not a fan of elusive quality but that doesnt matter. i would have liked to see him at 44k but was expecting him to be 66 at least.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote VSP. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jun 2012 at 10:11pm
I wonder what fee Pierro deserves then?
Outstanding type, slashing 2YO, & son of a Champion Sire here in Aus.
 
66k is CRAZY for any new stallion in the current market place. Serving a book of 150 mares or so @ that figure means many of the mare owners will make a loss from their produce. And thats a guarantee.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AussieOi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jun 2012 at 11:27pm
66k is Ouch. SYT is at 66k, wich i dont agree with either, but Sepoy definately NOT
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