Join up at Crownbet - Click here - Crownbet is Thoroughbred Village’s premier betting partner - Join here now
Forum Home Forum Home > Horse Racing - Public Forums > International Racing
  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - Prix de l'Arc de Triomphe
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Events   Register Register  Login Login


Click here for the Thoroughbred Village Home Page - Australia's Premier Online Horse Racing Community. For village news, follow @TBVillage on Twitter. Also follow @Villagebet on Twitter for racing tips. Sign up for the village newsletter by clicking here: Newsletter Signup. To contact the Mayor by email: Click Here.

Prix de l'Arc de Triomphe

 Post Reply Post Reply
Author
Message
djebel View Drop Down
Champion
Champion
Avatar

Joined: 07 Mar 2007
Status: Offline
Points: 35128
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Prix de l'Arc de Triomphe
    Posted: 29 Sep 2017 at 3:45pm
Image result for lArc de Triomphe


STRIKE WHILST THE IRON IS HOT

reductio ad absurdum

The richest man is not he who has the most, but he who needs the least.

Back to Top
Sponsored Links
Click here to view the promotions at Crownbet.


Back to Top
djebel View Drop Down
Champion
Champion
Avatar

Joined: 07 Mar 2007
Status: Offline
Points: 35128
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2017 at 3:47pm
TOM KERR

History and grandeur make Chantilly a fitting venue for Enable's greatest test

There is a delicious irony in the fact the race named after the Parisian triumphal arch inspired by Napoleon Bonaparte, a man whose dreams of pan-European hegemony were confounded by Perfidious Albion, should now stand as a race arguably more treasured by British racing fans than by those of its host nation.

Every year on the turn of summer and autumn a tide of humanity crosses the English Channel by boat, train and aeroplane, hastened on their way by the congenial prospects of a weekend of good food, fine wine and fantastic racing, culminating in the running of Europe's most prestigious race: the Prix de l'Arc de Triomphe.

A change of final destination to Chantilly has done little to deter visitors from across the Channel, even if the French reportedly gave last year's race a sizable Gallic shrug.

While lacking the size or scope of Longchamp, currently completing its modernisation in anticipation of the Arc's return next year, Chantilly is a fitting host for such a race.

Steeped in racing and the horse, it is not just home to France's main training centre but also the epic Grandes Écuries, the colossal 186-metre stables that will provide a remarkable backdrop to the world's best middle distance horses this Sunday.

The Grandes Ecuries has a genesis story as spectacular as its facade. It was commissioned in 1719 by Louis Henri, the Duc de Bourbon, whose conviction that he would be reincarnated as a horse did not prevent him from the role of prime minister of France, proving that the standards required to hold high office have changed little over the intervening centuries.

Boasting wealth and fabulous delusion in equal measure, the duc had built a stable of staggering opulence, insisting only such a home would suffice to house a horse of such high rank as the cheval de Bourbon.

On Sunday, however, the horses of high rank will be found not in the magnificent stables but on the Chantilly track, with a cast of runners assembled for the Arc of which the mad duc would surely have approved.

With 18 declared on Thursday morning, the likely field consists of no fewer than 13 individual Group 1 winners, sporting 27 top-tier victories between them (with a further 34 Group wins between the entire field).

Some have suggested this year's Arc lacks depth but from this angle it looks studded through with class.

The Aidan O'Brien team alone brings a wealth of complementary high-class horses to the field, with the pace and power of exceptional miler Winter ranged alongside the middle-distance prowess of Capri and the endurance of Order Of St George. Seventh Heaven, one of the O'Brien outsiders, brings to the table winning form over Found, last year's Arc heroine.

Representing the continent are Brametot, winner of back-to-back French Classics, and Germany's Dschingis Secret, whose merits were laid bare in a ready victory against Cloth Of Stars over course and distance earlier this month. And from Britain comes Ulysses, the ever-improving Eclipse and International winner.

They all stand, however, in the long shadow cast by the Arc's first odds-on favourite since Sea The Stars in 2009: Enable. Since her stunning Oaks victory amid the thunder and lightning of a flash storm at Epsom, Enable has been untouchable, creating that intoxicating aura of invincibility that only great champions can summon.

This, though, is her greatest test by far. She must contend with the rigours placed on her by a long season, she must see off a diminished weight advantage against the colts and older horses, and she must overcome the chaos and fury of the season's most hotly-contested Group 1 run at a track that can be an unforgiving place.

This will be unlike anything Enable has faced before, although unlike some others, who feel she is too short in such untested waters, I won't be abandoning this exceptional daughter of Nathaniel, who has shrugged off everything man and nature could throw at her with the insouciance of an epic champion in the making.

This, the second Arc ever held at stunning Chantilly, is likely also to be the last. Victory for Enable, however, will ensure its brief stay at this magnificent racecourse will live long in the memory.

Qatar Prix de l'Arc de Triomphe, card form and betting




STRIKE WHILST THE IRON IS HOT

reductio ad absurdum

The richest man is not he who has the most, but he who needs the least.

Back to Top
djebel View Drop Down
Champion
Champion
Avatar

Joined: 07 Mar 2007
Status: Offline
Points: 35128
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2017 at 3:51pm

Moore chooses 'high-class' Winter from Ballydoyle battalion in Sunday's Arc

Winter was on Thursday the one being backed for the Qatar Prix de l'Arc de Triomphe after Ryan Moore, who had the pick of five, chose to ride the dual 1,000 Guineas heroine on the logic that her stamina may be unproven but her class is not.

The decision, made after discussions with trainer Aidan O'Brien and owners Coolmore, was swayed by Winter's impressive homework since her return to action from a bruised foot.

With the prospect of two-time Arc winner Moore for assistance in the saddle, Winter, the winner of four Group 1s this season, was promptly supported into a top-priced 9-1 (from 12s), eclipsing last year's third Order Of St George as the shortest-priced of O'Brien's runners.

Explaining why he chose to ride Winter, who has yet to race beyond a mile and a quarter, ahead of Order Of St George, Idaho, Capri and Seventh Heaven, Moore said: "Winter is a high-class filly who has won four Group 1s and has won on the soft. None of us know if she'll stay a mile and a half until we try."

Star-studded Ballydoyle team

Order Of St George will be ridden by Donnacha O'Brien, while Wayne Lordan, who steered Winter to 1,000 Guineas success at Newmarket in May, will get the leg-up on William Hill St Leger hero Capri.

The O'Brien contingent is completed by Idaho, who will be ridden by Seamie Heffernan, and Seventh Heaven, the mount of Pat Smullen - who has ridden for O'Brien snr just twice in Britain and Ireland in the last five years.

Explaining the decision, O'Brien, who combined with Moore to win the Arc with Found last year, said: "We all talked things over before finalising riding plans.

"Ryan rides Winter and while we can't be sure about her going a mile and a half for the first time, we've been very happy with her since she ran second in the Matron Stakes at Leopardstown."

Last year's runner-up Highland Reel and part of O'Brien famous 1-2-3 did not feature among 18 declarations for the Chantilly showpiece, along with stablemate and Derby second Cliffs Of Moher .

'The opposition is very good'

Enable, who like Winter is a dual Classic winner, was on Thursday the general 4-5 favourite ahead of Ulysses at 7-1.

“The filly is well in herself – she’s a lovely filly and weighing more now than she did at the beginning of the year which is a good sign,” Enable's trainer John Gosden told Paddy Power. 

“It was always likely to be a big field and that’s partly why we didn’t want to run Cracksman in it. The opposition is very good and it’s a proper Arc – I just hope that we don’t get too much rain on the day as I’d love to see it on better ground when you see the good horses quicken.”

Asked if there was one horse he was particularly worried about, Gosden replied: “There’s five or six really nice horses – remember about Chantilly - it’s not an easy track with a sharp bend.”

James Doyle has picked up a good spare ride aboard One Foot In Heaven for Alain de Royer-Dupre, a fast-finishing sixth in the race 12 months ago.

Reigning French champion Pierre-Charles Boudot will be on Silverwave, but there is no place in the line-up for Olivier Peslier, the joint-record holder for the race with four Arc victories.

The ground at Chantilly remained at 3.5 on the penetrometer or soft for the second day running on Thursday morning.

Orange and Vazirabad set for Cadran clash

Gold Cup hero Big Orange was one of seven declared for Saturday’s Group 1 feature the Prix du Cadran and Frankie Dettori takes the ride.

Olivier Peslier has been booked by Tim Easterby to partner the veteran High Jinx, while Dettori will also partner the William Haggas-trained Call To Mind for the Queen in the Prix Chaudenay earlier in the afternoon.

Sunday’s opening contest - the Prix Marcel Boussac - looks arguably the race of the day outside the Arc, with Charlie Appleby supplementing Wild Illusion and O’Brien leaving in the second and third from the Moyglare Stud Stakes, Magical and September.

The highly-rated French trio of Polydream, Soustraction and Efaadah also remain on course for the Boussac, while further international interest is added with the unbeaten Narella from Germany.

Moyglare winner Happily may be given the task of taking on the boys, having been left in the Prix Jean-Luc Lagardere after being taken out of the Boussac.

All the main players have remained in the Foret and the Abbaye, for which Christophe Ferland has supplemented Rimini.

Having been declared for the Arc, Winter and Seventh Heaven were withdrawn from the Prix de l’Opera, a race in which O’Brien can still choose from Hydrangea, Rhododendron and Rain Goddess.

Final declarations and jockey bookings for the five Group 1s other than the Arc will be made on Friday morning.


By Scott Burton


STRIKE WHILST THE IRON IS HOT

reductio ad absurdum

The richest man is not he who has the most, but he who needs the least.

Back to Top
djebel View Drop Down
Champion
Champion
Avatar

Joined: 07 Mar 2007
Status: Offline
Points: 35128
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2017 at 3:52pm
Chantilly: home to stables fit for a prime minister


STRIKE WHILST THE IRON IS HOT

reductio ad absurdum

The richest man is not he who has the most, but he who needs the least.

Back to Top
djebel View Drop Down
Champion
Champion
Avatar

Joined: 07 Mar 2007
Status: Offline
Points: 35128
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2017 at 4:07pm
Full draw for the Prix de l'Arc de Triomphe (in stall order)

1 Ulysses
2 Enable
3 Cloth Of Stars
4 Brametot
5 Satono Noblesse
6 Iquitos
7 Idaho
8 Winter
9 Order Of St George
10 Dschingis Secret
11 One Foot In Heaven
12 Doha Dream
13 Satono Diamond
14 Plumatic
15 Capri
16 Silverware
17 Seventh Heaven
18 Zarak 



STRIKE WHILST THE IRON IS HOT

reductio ad absurdum

The richest man is not he who has the most, but he who needs the least.

Back to Top
djebel View Drop Down
Champion
Champion
Avatar

Joined: 07 Mar 2007
Status: Offline
Points: 35128
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2017 at 5:46pm
ArticleImage


STRIKE WHILST THE IRON IS HOT

reductio ad absurdum

The richest man is not he who has the most, but he who needs the least.

Back to Top
djebel View Drop Down
Champion
Champion
Avatar

Joined: 07 Mar 2007
Status: Offline
Points: 35128
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2017 at 5:48pm
By Jamie Lynch — published 28th September 2017

It’s that stage of the season when the stage of the season becomes a big thing, her hard campaign hung around Enable’s neck as a potential anchor ahead of the Prix de l'Arc de Triomphe. Poring over statistics and pulling out relevant representatives, Jamie Lynch attempts to get to the heart of the matter.


Even something of the style, substance and steel of the Eiffel Tower is susceptible to nature’s seasonal shifts. Encouraged by the sun, expanded by the partying particles, the Eiffel Tower increases in height by as much as 17 centimetres in the summer. It’s a titbit of trivia that’s always presented this way, rather than the other, of what goes up must come down, because come the autumn, come the cold, the Tower loses a little of its powerful presence via thermal contraction.

Enable has been the Eiffel Tower of the Flat season, dominating the European landscape, monumental in her magnificence, rousing and recognisable in equal measure, and structured in elements of style, substance and steel. But if the Tower is organically scaled down around this time of the year, can the same happen to Enable? She’s a force of nature, battling the forces of nature.

Enable is on trial in the Arc, and the critical case for the prosecution is as circumstantial as the compelling case for her defence is concrete, based on the facts and figures of her faultless campaign. It’s horsepower versus hypothesis, it’s calculation versus speculation, it’s hard evidence versus hard races, so goes the anecdotal adage that a long season is a hidden fault line ripe for an October opening. That Enable has shone the brightest is unanimous. That the summer power consumption via sun-baked solar panels might have dimmed the watts is the uncertainty, and the question.

Any study of the end-game effects of a full-on season is neither scientific nor statistically sound, due to the wide variety of factors at play, as well as the differences in motivation and methods. All the same, it’s useful to at least endeavour to put some meat on the bare bone of contention, as it’s the pivotal issue for the pivotal horse in the Arc.

We filtered down all the horses, since the year 2000, who, if not quite in the same boat as Enable, steered a similar course across the stamina-sapping sea, as high-rolling three-year-olds who had a ‘hard season’, determined by quality and quantity of races over an extended period.

Leaving aside sprinters, who play a slightly different game, there were 169 who broadly qualified as being in a comparable position to where Enable is now. Just over half, 87 to be exact, maintained their high standards to the end, 34 of them winning Group 1s on their final three-year-old start well into the autumn.      

Of the 82 whose form dipped, perhaps drained by a strenuous campaign, 23 of them flopped at the Breeders’ Cup, which is obviously more layered - therefore less statistically meaningful – in the list of legitimate excuses, for the travelling, timing and, in some cases, the dirt surface.

Thinking more through the prism of Enable, there were 40 fillies amongst the examined 169, and the even-money split was much the same, with 21 of them climaxing on a high. And breaking it down by trainers offers extra encouragement for the Enablers, as the statistical story is that John Gosden plays this particular game well, much better than most, in fact. By our reckoning, since 2000, Gosden has been at the high-stakes autumn table with 13 hard-working three-year-olds, and as many as ten proved to be a big dice that kept rolling. Only Great Heavens and Masked Marvel, who both got lost in an Arc, and Rainbow View (fifth in Ladies’ Classic, on dirt, on her eighth race of the year) ended in a whimper, when everything else went out with a bang.

If that’s inspiration for Enable, then her homework might be the following five case studies, who most resemble her, in points of view, for points of order and points of reference.

QUARTER MOON (2002)More a pathfinder than a prototype, not in the same league as Enable ratings-wise but contested three Oaks (runner-up at Epsom and the Curragh) on her way to France, where she might have been over the top anyway but found the trip too short in the Opera.

SNOW FAIRY (2010) Pretty much the pin-up girl for Enable, for the most elegantly electrifying example of how to sashay down an elongated catwalk. Had a break before her end-of-year engagements (back-to-back Group 1 wins in Japan), but, like Enable, did the Oaks-Irish Oaks double amid four top-level races in the meat of the season. Third to Danedream – another Enable idol – in the following year’s Arc.

L’ANCRESSE (2003) Started her season on April 13th, a week before Enable did, and posted a personal best nine races later on October 25th, when second in the Breeders’ Cup Filly & Mare Turf. In between she ran in four classics (second in Irish Oaks), as well as the Yorkshire Oaks. A lesson in constitution, as important as class in the Arc.

ISLINGTON (2002) L’Ancresse was beaten in the aforementioned Filly & Mare Turf by the four-year-old Islington, who did plenty as a three-year-old too, off the blocks at Newbury in April and running down an Enable-related road – won Yorkshire Oaks by five lengths – to the Arc, where she raised her game again but checked in only fifth, just lacking Enable’s power-packed punch.

GOLDEN HORN (2015) Different sex, but even more in common with Enable, beyond the Gosden/Dettori axis.  April reappearance: check. May trial win: check. Four full-on Group 1 performances, breaking the 130 barrier: check. Arc glory: ?

Breaking the 130 barrier on the Timeform scale, as she did in the King George, is what matters most with Enable in the Arc. Of all the factors that will determine how Enable performs at Chantilly, first and foremost is her ability, and on that measurement she’s head if not shoulders above the opposition in Paris.

That’s the long and short of it. Better to be long into the season than short on talent. Neither the statistics nor the samples point overwhelmingly one way or another as to the effects, at this stage, of a rigorous campaign, but what’s clear from what’s calculable is that John Gosden plays this hand especially well, and a Queen like Enable is a big card to play.




STRIKE WHILST THE IRON IS HOT

reductio ad absurdum

The richest man is not he who has the most, but he who needs the least.

Back to Top
Ticino View Drop Down
Champion
Champion


Joined: 20 Oct 2008
Location: Germany
Status: Offline
Points: 2334
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ticino Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2017 at 7:00pm
Hello,
unfortunately the second German Runner in the 'Arc' Iquitos (by Adlerflug-Irika by Areion, 17 starts,
6 wins, 5 placings) is missing in the preview.
 
In the 'Prix Dollar' (Saturday) Wild Chief (by Doyen) will start, "Prix Chaudenay" Monreal (by Peintre Celebre), "Prix Daniel Wildenstein" Wonnemond (by Areion) and Noor al Hawa (by Makfi).
 
regards, Ticino
Back to Top
Second Chance View Drop Down
Champion
Champion
Avatar

Joined: 02 Dec 2007
Status: Offline
Points: 13936
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Second Chance Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2017 at 7:13pm
Was going to say why do we need a hundred or more sorrowfully unedited paragraphs of historical waffle, little of which goes even close to establishing why Enable can or can't win the L'Arc.

But decided not to as it at least keeps this great race towards the forefront of our International focus.  Smile
Back to Top
Ticino View Drop Down
Champion
Champion


Joined: 20 Oct 2008
Location: Germany
Status: Offline
Points: 2334
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Ticino Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Sep 2017 at 8:27pm
Hello,
here is one more adding to the race card of the "Arc Weekend". Narella (Reliable Man - Naomia by Monsun, won "Zukunfts Rennen", a race for 2 year olds) will ran in the "Prix Marcel Bossac" on Sunday.
 
regards, Ticino
Back to Top
acacia alba View Drop Down
Champion
Champion


Joined: 30 Oct 2010
Status: Offline
Points: 23694
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote acacia alba Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Sep 2017 at 12:32am
Why is the Arc being run at Chantilly ??
Are they doing up things at the home track ??
God knows it needs it !!
What a sad and sorry place it was when I was there.
Chantilly, on the other hand, is an amazing place. 

animals before people.
Back to Top
acacia alba View Drop Down
Champion
Champion


Joined: 30 Oct 2010
Status: Offline
Points: 23694
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote acacia alba Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Sep 2017 at 12:33am
Originally posted by djebel djebel wrote:

Chantilly: home to stables fit for a prime minister
animals before people.
Back to Top
acacia alba View Drop Down
Champion
Champion


Joined: 30 Oct 2010
Status: Offline
Points: 23694
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote acacia alba Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Sep 2017 at 12:39am
That in the background are the stables for the chateau .  Chateau Chantilly.   Can you imagine that ??   Stables !!!!  The whole place is just gob smacking amazing !!!
They fell into nothing, and then the Aga Khan took it on, and restored them, and now they are the Museum Of The Horse.  Amazing place.  Some of the stuff to see there is an eye opener.
But what a back ground for racing !! 
 

animals before people.
Back to Top
horlicks View Drop Down
Champion
Champion


Joined: 26 Feb 2010
Status: Offline
Points: 3917
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote horlicks Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Sep 2017 at 10:54am
Originally posted by acacia alba acacia alba wrote:

Why is the Arc being run at Chantilly ??
Are they doing up things at the home track ??
God knows it needs it !!
What a sad and sorry place it was when I was there.
Chantilly, on the other hand, is an amazing place. 



Complete rebuild of the facilities at Longchamp.
Sketches look fantastic.

Back there next year
Back to Top
acacia alba View Drop Down
Champion
Champion


Joined: 30 Oct 2010
Status: Offline
Points: 23694
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote acacia alba Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Sep 2017 at 10:59am
Be worth seeing when its completed .
animals before people.
Back to Top
Ticino View Drop Down
Champion
Champion


Joined: 20 Oct 2008
Location: Germany
Status: Offline
Points: 2334
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Ticino Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Oct 2017 at 8:05am
Hello,
I forgot to mention the fillies Lacazar (by Adlerflug) and Ashiana (by Mastercraftsman) are both
starting in the "Prix L'Opera" during the Arc Weekend.
 
Btw, the race was won first time during the early Nineties by the Germanbred filly Martessa
(by Solarstern).
 
regards, Ticino
Back to Top
Brudder_A View Drop Down
Champion
Champion


Joined: 01 Apr 2013
Location: Atlantic City
Status: Offline
Points: 1191
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Brudder_A Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2017 at 3:01am
3YO Enable, with L. Dettori bolts in by 2 1/2 lengths..
Cloth of Stars, who finished second in the Qatar Prix Foy (G2) also found late run to take second for Godolphin. Ulysses, winner of the Juddmonte International (G1), finished third in a likely prep for the Longines Breeders' Cup Turf (G1T) at Del Mar.

Enable might be challenging Winx as top Turf horse after this performance.

How about a match race next year in Eng-er-land?
Back to Top
acacia alba View Drop Down
Champion
Champion


Joined: 30 Oct 2010
Status: Offline
Points: 23694
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote acacia alba Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2017 at 10:53am
A record 5th Arc for Frankie .
Wow, thats some filly !  Look at all she has won, and is only 3 .
animals before people.
Back to Top
Shrunk in the Wash View Drop Down
Champion
Champion


Joined: 25 Mar 2016
Status: Offline
Points: 2372
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shrunk in the Wash Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2017 at 11:09am
Surely she has a rest then comes out for the Championships
Back to Top
djebel View Drop Down
Champion
Champion
Avatar

Joined: 07 Mar 2007
Status: Offline
Points: 35128
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2017 at 4:23pm
Originally posted by Shrunk in the Wash Shrunk in the Wash wrote:

Surely she has a rest then comes out for the Championships

That would be nice.

What sort on inducement would the racing public allow Peter V'landys do to get her here ?




STRIKE WHILST THE IRON IS HOT

reductio ad absurdum

The richest man is not he who has the most, but he who needs the least.

Back to Top
goldey View Drop Down
Champion
Champion
Avatar

Joined: 29 Dec 2012
Location: cairns
Status: Offline
Points: 4846
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote goldey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2017 at 5:36pm
Not sure if any horse with a rating that high will ever grace our shores?
Back to Top
djebel View Drop Down
Champion
Champion
Avatar

Joined: 07 Mar 2007
Status: Offline
Points: 35128
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2017 at 5:38pm
You are correct, Races here are just not valuable enough unfortunately.




STRIKE WHILST THE IRON IS HOT

reductio ad absurdum

The richest man is not he who has the most, but he who needs the least.

Back to Top
djebel View Drop Down
Champion
Champion
Avatar

Joined: 07 Mar 2007
Status: Offline
Points: 35128
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 2017 at 5:40pm


STRIKE WHILST THE IRON IS HOT

reductio ad absurdum

The richest man is not he who has the most, but he who needs the least.

Back to Top
djebel View Drop Down
Champion
Champion
Avatar

Joined: 07 Mar 2007
Status: Offline
Points: 35128
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Oct 2017 at 7:08pm
CHANTILLY REACTION FRENCH WOE

After two years of hurt, what are the prospects of a home revival in 2018?

By Scott Burton

The Arc’s sojourn in the magnificent surroundings of Chantilly is over after two years and, looking back at the results, there will perhaps be plenty of the town’s racing folk who can’t wait to get back on the road to Longchamp in 2018.

For the second year in a row French trainers managed only one win from the seven Group 1s across the weekend, and none on Sunday, with the biggest prize of all going abroad for the sixth time in ten years.

So how bad was it in the context of the last ten years, and are there any long term trends working against the home team when it comes to their showpiece weekend of the year?

2017 in context

Over the last decade, French-trained horses have accounted for 31 of the 70 Group 1 winners at the meeting which is, unsurprisingly given the geographical location, the most of any individual nation.

You don't have to go back to far to find years when the boot was very much on the other foot, with the home team bagging five of the seven top-level races in both 2012 and 2013.

Britain has an impressive 25 wins, while Ireland have weighed in with an average of one a year.


How many of the last ten of the main races have been won by the home team?

7 - Lagardere
5 - Opera
5 - Cadran
4 - Arc
4 - Boussac
4 - Foret
2 - Abbaye


The role of owner-breeders

As one of the pinnacles of the Flat racing calendar the meeting is a target for all the major owner/breeders in Europe.

In fact, the six main powerhouses have accounted for almost 50 per cent of the Group 1 winners on Arc weekend since 2008, though not all of their winners were actually the result of their own breeding operations.


Owner/Breeders Arc weekend record in Group 1 races over the last decade

9 - Aga Khan
6 - Coolmore
6 - Maktoum (Godolpin, Shadwell and Sheikh Ahmed)
4 - Wertheimer et Frere
4 - Khalid Abdullah
4 - Al Shaqab


What immediately strikes from the above list is how many of those entities operate in more than one country.

Taking the list from the top, eight of the nine winners to carry the Aga Khan's green silks were trained in France, though the likes of Zarkava and Shalanaya were bred in Ireland and could have been sent to John Oxx just as easily as Alain de Royer-Dupre or Mikel Delzangles.

It's a similar story with Juddmonte, Al Shaqab and the various Maktoum entities: each employs trainers in Britain, Ireland and France.

Indeed Enable's dam, Concentric, was a product of the Andre Fabre academy and few would argue that the seven-time Arc winning trainer might not have crafted a fine career for her had the Juddmonte team decided differently.

The fact is that the partition of winners between where they are trained is something of an arbitrary business when it comes to these big owner/breeders.

The two exceptions in the list are Wertheimer et Frere – whose interests lie solely in France – and Coolmore, who have a small number of horses in training with Fabre and Jean-Claude Rouget but who have the vast concentration of their firepower housed with Aidan O'Brien at Ballydoyle.

Ballydoyle, Chantilly and the wheel of fortune

Aidan O'Brien enjoyed a fine return on his French adventures early in his career but has only really begun to return to those heights on Arc weekend in the last two years, sending out two winners at each meeting.

O'Brien frequently sends his best fillies to contest the Prix Marcel Boussac and it is no surprise to find that he has trained the winner three times in the last decade, a figure which surely would have risen to four had Happily not been rerouted to take on the colts in the Lagardere this time around.

The last named race has not been so much of a target for O'Brien in recent years, having dominated it in the late 1990s and early 2000s.

It is perhaps no coincidence that France's period of relative dominance in the Lagardere has coincided with O'Brien's relative lack of interest.

The Chantilly challenge

The other obvious point to make is that the two near-whitewash years for France have coincided with the Arc's temporary relocation to Chantilly.

The two meetings took place on quite different ground yet both seemed to favour horses that could travel near to the pace but that stayed on well at the finish.

Despite the fact that Chantilly has a longer home straight than Longchamp, it seems it has not favoured the traditional French tactic of sitting in behind and riding a finish.

Perhaps the final piece in the jigsaw is just bad luck. Chantilly last year and Pau this year have suffered with illness but, more than that, the very best French horses have not made it to Chantilly for the country's biggest weekend.

Last year Almanzor ran at Leopardstown and Ascot but bypassed the Arc.

In 2017, Al Wukair might have developed into a real threat at middle distances, but injury in the middle part of the season meant that Andre Fabre has decided to keep to a mile with Al Shaqab's colt rather than step him up.

As Christophe Soumillon said so eloquently in these pages last week: "Winning the biggest races and riding champions is always the goal and, while it hasn’t happened quite so much recently, all the time I am riding for the best people and there is always the chance for that to turn around pretty quickly."



STRIKE WHILST THE IRON IS HOT

reductio ad absurdum

The richest man is not he who has the most, but he who needs the least.

Back to Top
Second Chance View Drop Down
Champion
Champion
Avatar

Joined: 02 Dec 2007
Status: Offline
Points: 13936
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Second Chance Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Oct 2017 at 7:15pm
I reckon the Frog trainers' preference for running horses every three weeks is the cause of their inability to win Group races in their own country.

That or....
Back to Top
djebel View Drop Down
Champion
Champion
Avatar

Joined: 07 Mar 2007
Status: Offline
Points: 35128
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Oct 2017 at 7:17pm
You might well be right again.

The Pommy horse is able to be produced when ever the target race comes up. 




STRIKE WHILST THE IRON IS HOT

reductio ad absurdum

The richest man is not he who has the most, but he who needs the least.

Back to Top
djebel View Drop Down
Champion
Champion
Avatar

Joined: 07 Mar 2007
Status: Offline
Points: 35128
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Oct 2017 at 6:58pm


STRIKE WHILST THE IRON IS HOT

reductio ad absurdum

The richest man is not he who has the most, but he who needs the least.

Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply
  Share Topic   

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Forum Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 11.10
Copyright ©2001-2017 Web Wiz Ltd.

This page was generated in 0.117 seconds.