Print Page | Close Window

china

Printed From: Thoroughbred Village
Category: All Sports - Public Forums
Forum Name: Joffs All Sports Bar
Forum Description: Visit the famous All Sports Forum to chat with friends about any sporting topic
URL: http://forum.thoroughbredvillage.com.au/forum_posts.asp?TID=61543
Printed Date: 23 Feb 2020 at 7:32pm
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 11.10 - http://www.webwizforums.com


Topic: china
Posted By: Isaac soloman
Subject: china
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2018 at 9:37am
ok whale/dick, starting a new thread.

regardless of your stance, there is more and more chatter regarding ours and chinas relationship. china would have us as an extension of them. take away our quality stuff and they would not be so interested. we are just their farm, or want it to be so.
would they come to our defense in a time of crisis? think not.
our morals, way of thinking are different, although some are trying hard to deny this.
china is a disrupt-er. disruptor noun [ C ] uk ​ /dɪsˈrʌp.tər/ /-tɚ/ a person or thing that prevents something, especially a system, process, or event, from continuing as usual or as expected: endocrine/hormone disruptors.



Replies:
Posted By: Isaac soloman
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2018 at 9:38am

Beijing carefully watches Australia’s next move after Malcolm Turnbull’s ‘offensive’ comments

Sarah Martin
Chinese-Australian relations appear to be at a crossroads as power shifts.Chinese-Australian relations appear to be at a crossroads as power shifts.

A week before the Bennelong by-election, Malcolm Turnbull held a press conference in the Sydney suburb of Ryde and spoke about the Government’s new foreign interference laws.

In words that would send shockwaves all the way to Beijing, Mr Turnbull said Australia, like China, was merely “standing up” for its sovereignty as debate over China’s influence on Labor Senator Sam Dastyari raged.

“Modern China was founded in 1949 with this, with these words: ‘Zhongguoren men zhanqilai, the Chinese people have stood up’,” the Prime Minister said.

“Chinese people stand up for their sovereignty and they expect Australian people and particularly Australian leaders to stand up for theirs. That is why we respect each other and that is why they respect me and my Government.”

Except respect is not what Mr Turnbull got from the Chinese. What he got was fury.

The same day Mr Turnbull made the remarks, five Australian journalists — including this reporter — left for a trip to China, sponsored by the Chinese People’s Institute of Foreign Affairs, a Government-run think tank.

The “friendship tour” was aimed at enhancing understanding between Australia and China and sought to present the perspective of the Chinese Government to those reporting on the relationship between the two countries.

Beijing’s perspective was made abundantly clear — at times aggressively — in a series of briefings from Government officials, State-owned companies and university academics. Mr Turnbull’s comments and the Australian Government’s approach was seen as racist. It was the return of a “Cold War mentality” and the suggestion China was interfering in Australia’s domestic affairs was “ridiculous”.

The Prime Minister’s remark about “standing up” was seen as particularly offensive, given he had referred to remarks made by Chairman Mao Zedong, which marked the end of foreign occupation by the Japanese and Western powers.

“Stand up for what? It is not the Chinese Government’s official position to interfere into other countries’ affairs. This is not our policy and we have never done so and we will not do so,” one high-ranking official told the delegation, dismissing concerns raised by Australian security agencies about Chinese political influence and the proliferation of State-sponsored cyber attacks.

In a sternly worded statement, the Chinese Embassy in Canberra responded to the Government’s foreign interference laws by suggesting they were “imbued with bias towards China”.

“We strongly urge the relevant people in Australia to shake off their Cold War mentality and bias against China, immediately stop uttering false remarks that undermine political mutual trust and mutually beneficial co-operation, and take effective measures to offset negative effects so as to avoid disrupting and impacting the development of China-Australia relations,” it said.

At the same time, Australia’s Ambassador to China, Jan Adams, was summoned by Beijing’s Ministry for Foreign Affairs for a dressing down.

Chinese and Australian relations appear to be at a crossroads as power shifts in the Asia-Pacific region.

As the recent Foreign Policy White Paper made plain, Australia believes its alliance with the US will become more important as China’s power and influence grows.

The paper, released by Foreign Minister Julie Bishop last month, warned the “stakes could not be higher” for Australia as the political balance in the region shifted.

Prime Minister Malcolm Turnbull’s choice of words drew ire in China.Prime Minister Malcolm Turnbull’s choice of words drew ire in China.

“As China’s power grows, our region is changing in ways without precedent in Australia’s modern history,” the report said. It called for the maintenance of the current international rules-based order, which had allowed regional prosperity to grow, and urged the US not to retreat.

China dismisses suggestions it wants to replace the existing international order with its own set of rules and says it has no interest in interfering in other’s domestic affairs.

However, it does want to give countries an “opportunity” to learn from its extraordinary economic rise, according to one official from the Ministry of Commerce.

“China is the second largest economy in the world, so we want to share our development with other countries, we want to create a more balanced, more just international order,” Zhou Mi, from the Ministry’s Chinese Academy of International Trade and Economic Cooperation, says.

Beijing believes the current international system, established in the wake of World War II, is not fair and does not adequately reflect China’s growing economic importance.

In response to the White Paper, Dr Zhou said Beijing had detected a “tougher” tone towards China and recognised concern in Australia that China would fill a vacuum in the region left by a retreating US.

“I can understand this kind of concern because we are different countries, we have difference social systems, we have different ideology, we have different values,” he said.

“With the rapid rise of China, I think not only Australia, all our neighbouring countries have some concern what China will be in the future with such an asymmetric power relationship.”

But he urged Canberra to take a “neutral status” as the power balance shifted and warned that if Australia viewed China negatively, there will be “a lot of negative feedback from China”.

The negative reaction could take the form of some sort of economic punishment.

Senior Government officials in Beijing have discussed the potential of a boycott of Australian goods if Canberra does not change its attitude towards China, in what is seen as the “worst-case scenario”.

https://beap.gemini.yahoo.com/mbclk?bv=1.0.0&es=UpnVH_YGIS8nbSaALvcAvjsjHr0Go.IJgIIQkWa1kEYNWyPqNy9WrcQ1QROwwt8ocjAde_6XPREKbVVdCazPHQ576sbDrv8kmUM3AoR0qKwMzo.O6p5Rt8JFFoty4_o8Zb999qbNs._1tEH0QaSb742nNAT40DNa1Nkk2qTNMIxF31vyVYJ7WtE3BtgdR7O2ag6Tu3rVX1IYdrakE6_XHDsZ4nRb44VFRbKTTmJGJ4kx0PnemhgcrZ1LRpYtKNHpMUpp1VSEzpI9KQ_RIuADZMYEqA3ridPumpolJEfw.W6IawQydd0aAyzSS5UwnP5u.eir5QgST4yN3rR4JQFehIYgxujFLztktZcWFzt5T50Uac_EyZlejtkyncdRqZrOCse_O1wcgvUpXqcyOkO7mQQWOLNJXdwodMkHilqWLOsr3JXu0KmjhQ9hmSEC.2m1ccVLGGLmTvh2OaihTlS1R9ijmS4p1hn3KicRhy4j3Yv1Ou7MTnr10l5QQM36DQVYun8XyALaAB1gKXzt9ODcL8B18sulgtoJ3XAa6KfTFtBJs5EmqjmOsK9O0XNeMSDMirOdSJCANUCfQaq4lGgxjQylCdVgRAg7S5lwmCgEyqyjiQm_kJonYtL7VVwiQ0Dmh2F3kmPpcw5MQ.TcgsjwdDXABIMuo8u5Oh2b8ronDTIIAcqAYwBLD0G6vL6r4r8z3t8nSDbOMUcYjW9o%26lp=" rel="nofollow"> https://beap.gemini.yahoo.com/mbclk?bv=1.0.0&es=UpnVH_YGIS8nbSaALvcAvjsjHr0Go.IJgIIQkWa1kEYNWyPqNy9WrcQ1QROwwt8ocjAde_6XPREKbVVdCazPHQ576sbDrv8kmUM3AoR0qKwMzo.O6p5Rt8JFFoty4_o8Zb999qbNs._1tEH0QaSb742nNAT40DNa1Nkk2qTNMIxF31vyVYJ7WtE3BtgdR7O2ag6Tu3rVX1IYdrakE6_XHDsZ4nRb44VFRbKTTmJGJ4kx0PnemhgcrZ1LRpYtKNHpMUpp1VSEzpI9KQ_RIuADZMYEqA3ridPumpolJEfw.W6IawQydd0aAyzSS5UwnP5u.eir5QgST4yN3rR4JQFehIYgxujFLztktZcWFzt5T50Uac_EyZlejtkyncdRqZrOCse_O1wcgvUpXqcyOkO7mQQWOLNJXdwodMkHilqWLOsr3JXu0KmjhQ9hmSEC.2m1ccVLGGLmTvh2OaihTlS1R9ijmS4p1hn3KicRhy4j3Yv1Ou7MTnr10l5QQM36DQVYun8XyALaAB1gKXzt9ODcL8B18sulgtoJ3XAa6KfTFtBJs5EmqjmOsK9O0XNeMSDMirOdSJCANUCfQaq4lGgxjQylCdVgRAg7S5lwmCgEyqyjiQm_kJonYtL7VVwiQ0Dmh2F3kmPpcw5MQ.TcgsjwdDXABIMuo8u5Oh2b8ronDTIIAcqAYwBLD0G6vL6r4r8z3t8nSDbOMUcYjW9o%26lp=" rel="nofollow - Be ready for a Big Data career. https://beap.gemini.yahoo.com/mbclk?bv=1.0.0&es=UpnVH_YGIS8nbSaALvcAvjsjHr0Go.IJgIIQkWa1kEYNWyPqNy9WrcQ1QROwwt8ocjAde_6XPREKbVVdCazPHQ576sbDrv8kmUM3AoR0qKwMzo.O6p5Rt8JFFoty4_o8Zb999qbNs._1tEH0QaSb742nNAT40DNa1Nkk2qTNMIxF31vyVYJ7WtE3BtgdR7O2ag6Tu3rVX1IYdrakE6_XHDsZ4nRb44VFRbKTTmJGJ4kx0PnemhgcrZ1LRpYtKNHpMUpp1VSEzpI9KQ_RIuADZMYEqA3ridPumpolJEfw.W6IawQydd0aAyzSS5UwnP5u.eir5QgST4yN3rR4JQFehIYgxujFLztktZcWFzt5T50Uac_EyZlejtkyncdRqZrOCse_O1wcgvUpXqcyOkO7mQQWOLNJXdwodMkHilqWLOsr3JXu0KmjhQ9hmSEC.2m1ccVLGGLmTvh2OaihTlS1R9ijmS4p1hn3KicRhy4j3Yv1Ou7MTnr10l5QQM36DQVYun8XyALaAB1gKXzt9ODcL8B18sulgtoJ3XAa6KfTFtBJs5EmqjmOsK9O0XNeMSDMirOdSJCANUCfQaq4lGgxjQylCdVgRAg7S5lwmCgEyqyjiQm_kJonYtL7VVwiQ0Dmh2F3kmPpcw5MQ.TcgsjwdDXABIMuo8u5Oh2b8ronDTIIAcqAYwBLD0G6vL6r4r8z3t8nSDbOMUcYjW9o%26lp=" rel="nofollow - Curtin University   https://info.yahoo.com/privacy/au/yahoo/relevantads.html" rel="nofollow - Sponsored

China is Australia’s biggest export market and sales of agricultural products such as beef, dairy and wine could be at risk if China wanted to send a warning shot. Beijing believes it could arise because Australia and China are “good economic partners but not friends”.

“China feels very frustrated, even though we have provided economic opportunities for you,” another Government official said. “You criticise China but make money from its markets.”

Australia has been put on notice that a similar backlash — which the Government claims is beyond its control — occurred against the Philippines during a dispute over contested islands in the South China Sea.

At the time, businesses boasted about not selling goods from the Philippines as the Chinese people rejected imports from the country.

It is this type of economic leverage that is causing strategic concern in Australia and among its traditional allies.

China is showing it is prepared to flex its economic muscle in order to achieve its political ambitions and is extending its field of influence beyond the Asia Pacific with the so-called One Belt, One Road initiative.

China’s strength is on bold display during our visit, with the first official stop on the itinerary an exhibition of “China’s outstanding achievements over the past five years” in central Beijing.

Scattered among the hundreds of posters of President Xi Jinping are exhibits of robots, the country’s military and social achievements, and information on the One Belt, One Road plan.

The coalition has so far been wary of the vast infrastructure program, which already has almost $2 trillion in projects under way, but Labor has indicated it wants to be involved.

Some Chinese Government officials believe the Turnbull Government’s position reflects the fact the bilateral relationship between Australia and China is at an all-time low, or at least going through “a very bad time”.

The question being asked is whether the recent hardline stance against China is a fundamental policy shift or whether it is short-term political rhetoric.

Beijing is watching closely Australia’s next move.

Sarah Martin travelled to China as a guest of the Chinese People’s Institute of Foreign Affairs



Posted By: max manewer
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2018 at 9:47am
Strange analysis, Isaac. What we see today in China is a country rising again to its rightful place as one of the great peoples of the world, after a long period of being "disrupted" by external powers, firstly the Europeans, later their Japanese neighbours. What happens in the future probably more depends on internal tensions, China is not some homogenous culture, all marching in step. But only a churl would deny them a moment of pride, for how far they have come, in so short a time.


Posted By: Whale
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2018 at 10:02am
Originally posted by max manewer max manewer wrote:

Strange analysis, Isaac. What we see today in China is a country rising again to its rightful place as one of the great peoples of the world, after a long period of being "disrupted" by external powers, firstly the Europeans, later their Japanese neighbours. What happens in the future probably more depends on internal tensions, China is not some homogenous culture, all marching in step. But only a churl would deny them a moment of pride, for how far they have come, in so short a time.



True, China was the dominant country in the world and wants to regain that position. Of course America thinks it is its god given right to occupy that spot and any country with such aspirations is an evil empire
Do you eat Chinese Isaac food that is ,not people  Smile

The study of world power has been blighted by Eurocentric historians who have distorted and ignored the dominant role China played in the world economy between 1100 and 1800.  John Hobson’s[1] brilliant historical survey of the world economy during this period provides an abundance of empirical data making the case for China ’s economic and technological superiority over Western civilization for the better part of a millennium prior to its conquest and decline in the 19th century.

China ’s re-emergence as a world economic power raises important questions about what we can learn from its previous rise and fall and about the external and internal threats confronting this emerging economic superpower for the immediate future.



-------------
Victor Orban 1.74 m, Michael Bloomberg 1.73 m, Emmanual Macron 1.77 m, George Soros 1.8 m


Posted By: Shawy38
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2018 at 10:05am
Ill have the fried rice and lemon chicken please


Posted By: Whale
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2018 at 10:20am
It is especially important to emphasize how China , the world technological power between 1100 and 1800, made the West’s emergence possible.  It was only by borrowing and assimilating Chinese innovations that the West was able to make the transition to modern capitalist and imperialist economies. http://www.globalresearch.ca/wp-content/uploads/2010/04/118505.jpg" rel="nofollow -

China:  The Rise and Consolidation of Global Power 1100 – 1800

In a systematic comparative format, John Hobson provides a wealth of empirical indicators demonstrating China ’s global economic superiority over the West and in particular England .  These are some striking facts:

As early as 1078, China was the world’s major producer of steel (125,000 tons); whereas Britain in 1788 produced 76,000 tons.

China was the world’s leader in technical innovations in textile manufacturing, seven centuries before Britain ’s 18th century “textile revolution”.

China was the leading trading nation, with long distance trade reaching most of Southern Asia, Africa, the Middle East and Europe .  China’s ‘agricultural revolution’ and productivity surpassed the West down to the 18th century.

Its innovations in the production of paper, book printing, firearms and tools led to a manufacturing superpower whose goods were transported throughout the world by the most advanced navigational system.

China possessed the world’s largest commercial ships.  In 1588 the largest English ships displaced 400 tons, China ’s 3,000 tons.  Even as late as the end of the 18th century China ’s merchants employed 130,000 private transport ships, several times that of Britain . China retained this pre-eminent position in the world economy up until the early 19th century.

British and Europeans manufacturers followed China ’s lead, assimilating and borrowing its more advanced technology and were eager to penetrate China ’s advanced and lucrative market.

Banking, a stable paper money economy, manufacturing and high yields in agriculture resulted in China ’s per capita income matching that of Great Britain as late as 1750.

China ’s dominant global position was challenged by the rise of British imperialism, which had adopted the advanced technological, navigational and market innovations of China and other Asian countries in order to bypass earlier stages in becoming a world power[2].

Western Imperialism and the Decline of China

The British and Western imperial conquest of the East, was based on the militaristic nature of the imperial state, its non-reciprocal economic relations with overseas trading countries and the Western imperial ideology which motivated and justified overseas conquest.

Unlike China , Britain ’s industrial revolution and overseas expansion was driven by a military policy.  According to Hobson, during the period from 1688-1815 Great Britain was engaged in wars 52% of the time[3].  Whereas the Chinese relied on their open markets and their superior production and sophisticated commercial and banking skills, the British relied on tariff protection, military conquest, the systematic destruction of competitive overseas enterprises as well as the appropriation and plunder of local resources.  China ’s global predominance was based on ‘reciprocal benefits’ with its trading partners, while Britain relied on mercenary armies of occupation, savage repression and a ‘divide and conquer’ policy to foment local rivalries.  In the face of native resistance, the British (as well as other Western imperial powers) did not hesitate to exterminate entire communities[4].

Unable to take over the Chinese market through greater economic competitiveness, Britain relied on brute military power.  It mobilized, armed and led mercenaries, drawn from its colonies in India and elsewhere to force its exports on China and impose unequal treaties to lower tariffs.  As a result China was flooded with British opium produced on its plantations in India – despite Chinese laws forbidding or regulating the importation and sale of the narcotic.  China ’s rulers, long accustomed to its trade and manufacturing superiority, were unprepared for the ‘new imperial rules’ for global power.  The West’s willingness to use military power  to win colonies, pillage resources and recruit huge mercenary armies commanded by European officers spelt the end for China as a world power.

China had based its economic predominance on ‘non-interference in the internal affairs of its trading partners’.  In contrast, British imperialists intervened violently in Asia , reorganizing local economies to suit the needs of the empire (eliminating economic competitors including more efficient Indian cotton manufacturers) and seized control of local political, economic and administrative apparatus to establish the colonial state.

Britain ’s empire was built with resources seized from the colonies and through the massive militarization of its economy[5].  It was thus able to secure military supremacy over China .  China ’s foreign policy was hampered by its ruling elite’s excessive reliance on trade relations.  Chinese officials and merchant elites sought to appease the British and convinced the emperor to grant devastating extra-territorial concessions opening markets to the detriment of Chinese manufacturers while surrendering local sovereignty.  As always, the British precipitated internal rivalries and revolts further destabilizing the country.

Western and British penetration and colonization of China ’s market created an entire new class:  The wealthy Chinese ‘compradores’ imported British goods and facilitated the takeover of local markets and resources.  Imperialist pillage forced greater exploitation and taxation of the great mass of Chinese peasants and workers.  China ’s rulers were obliged to pay the war debts and finance trade deficits imposed by the Western imperial powers by squeezing its peasantry.  This drove the peasants to starvation and revolt.

By the early 20th century (less than a century after the Opium Wars), China had descended from world economic power to a broken semi-colonial country with a huge destitute population.  The principle ports were controlled by Western imperial officials and the countryside was subject to the rule by corrupt and brutal warlords.  British opium enslaved millions.

British Academics:  Eloquent Apologists for Imperial Conquest

The entire Western academic profession – first and foremost British  imperial historians – attributed British imperial dominance of Asia to English ‘technological superiority’ and China’s misery and colonial status to ‘oriental backwardness’, omitting any mention of the millennium of Chinese commercial and technical progress and superiority up to the dawn of the 19th century.  By the end of the 1920’s, with the Japanese imperial invasion, China ceased to exist as a unified country.  Under the aegis of imperial rule, hundreds of millions of Chinese had starved or were dispossessed or slaughtered, as the Western powers and Japan plundered its economy.  The entire Chinese ‘collaborator’ comprador elite were discredited before the Chinese people.

What did remain in the collective memory of the great mass of the Chinese people – and what was totally absent in the accounts of prestigious US and British academics – was the sense of China once having been a prosperous, dynamic and leading world power.  Western commentators dismissed this collective memory of China ’s ascendancy as the foolish pretensions of nostalgic lords and royalty – empty Han arrogance.


http://https://www.globalresearch.ca/china-rise-fall-and-re-emergence-as-a-global-power/29644" rel="nofollow - http://https://www.globalresearch.ca/china-rise-fall-and-re-emergence-as-a-global-power/29644


what goes around comes around Smile




-------------
Victor Orban 1.74 m, Michael Bloomberg 1.73 m, Emmanual Macron 1.77 m, George Soros 1.8 m


Posted By: max manewer
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2018 at 10:29am
Then there is India, it too emerging from its period of European "disruption". The future ain't what it used to be.


Posted By: Carioca
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2018 at 10:37am
Originally posted by max manewer max manewer wrote:

Then there is India, it too emerging from its period of European "disruption". The future ain't what it used to be.


Quote= "The future ain't what it used to be", gotta luv it, ya made my day max,


Posted By: Passing Through
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2018 at 11:54am
China must be bad, Donald's new Trump National Security Strategy announced last week mentioned China 24 times and all 24 mentions were bad, Donald wouldn't lie Shocked

-------------
''I don't hold a hose mate''


Posted By: Whale
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2018 at 11:47am
Isaac hasn't posted here again, I guess he didn't get the reaction he wanted to his pathological hatred of China


-------------
Victor Orban 1.74 m, Michael Bloomberg 1.73 m, Emmanual Macron 1.77 m, George Soros 1.8 m


Posted By: maccamax
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2018 at 2:50pm
Good to see Donald has taken a stand . We are in good hands.
   He will match China's moves while he has the Worlds Super Power, Australia, on his side.


Posted By: Whale
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2018 at 3:13pm
Trump is an impotent over NK , China , his empty posturing is meaningless.  China will return to its former glory as the no 1 global power, inevitable


-------------
Victor Orban 1.74 m, Michael Bloomberg 1.73 m, Emmanual Macron 1.77 m, George Soros 1.8 m


Posted By: maccamax
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2018 at 3:32pm
Originally posted by Whale Whale wrote:

Trump is an impotent over NK , China , his empty posturing is meaningless.  China will return to its former glory as the no 1 global power, inevitable


The USA may not be posturing.     . More guess work. The Allies may well be preparing for an inevitable showdown.
It would be unlikely that forum TBV would be privy to what goes on behind the "green door" .

   Wasn't China rescued from the Japanese By the USA in 1945 ?

C/P =Did the US save China? Yes, it did, in much the same way you “help” a man by no longer holding his head underwater.


Posted By: max manewer
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2018 at 3:37pm
Originally posted by maccamax maccamax wrote:

Originally posted by Whale Whale wrote:

Trump is an impotent over NK , China , his empty posturing is meaningless.  China will return to its former glory as the no 1 global power, inevitable


The USA may not be posturing.     . More guess work. The Allies may well be preparing for an inevitable showdown.
It would be unlikely that forum TBV would be privy to what goes on behind the "green door" .

   Wasn't China rescued from the Japanese By the USA in 1945 ?

C/P =Did the US save China? Yes, it did, in much the same way you “help” a man by no longer holding his head underwater.

The Chinese had been fighting the Japanese for 14 years when the war ended, they probably did the West a favour by keeping half the Japanese army tied down there, rather than fighting in the Pacific theatre.


Posted By: Isaac soloman
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2018 at 3:46pm
Originally posted by Whale Whale wrote:

Isaac hasn't posted here again, I guess he didn't get the reaction he wanted to his pathological hatred of China

ahh whale/dick, i took your stupid advice and started a china thread.

for intelligent debate not your mindless answers.

my alleged pathological hate is matched by yours for america, macca, trump anyone who doesnt agree with you etc

healthy debate; if this thread goes for as long as the trump one it will be worth while.

as i said, the chatter re chinas strive for dominance is growing.

if that is what you like, then so be it little china boy...


Posted By: Isaac soloman
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2018 at 4:00pm
is this ok here whale/dick or should i put in climate thread, or maybe super thread, so you go charging of to your stock broker! you might actually learn something instead of being abusive.

Big guns set export records

  • The West Australian
  • Stuart McKinnon

A record 80 million tonnes of iron ore was shipped from Pilbara ports in December, as Rio Tinto and BHP ramped up output to take advantage of the healthy premium paid for their high-grade product in China.

The figure eclipsed the previous record of 73Mt set in September and included a 24-hour record of 2.18Mt shipped from Port Hedland on December 14.

BHP shipped 25.7Mt from Port Hedland last month, up from 23.4Mt in November while Rio exported 33.5Mt from Dampier and Cape Lambert in December, up from 28Mt the previous month.

The figures, from an industry source, came as Bloomberg Intelligence predicted the global iron ore market would be oversupplied this year on slower China demand while mines elsewhere lifted output.

“Iron ore sitting at China ports is at a record high, as traders and steel mills slow raw materials purchase and cut inventory,” the analyst said in a note on Friday.

“Strict supply-side reforms and an environmental protection push in China, the producer of 50 per cent of the world’s steel, will limit additional output from domestic steel mills.”

Goldman Sachs said last month iron ore prices above $US70/t were not sustainable in the new year. The investment bank predicted prices for the raw material would drop to $US60/t in three months and average $US55/t over 2018.

The spot iron ore price was $US72.42 on Friday.

The Goldman Sachs forecast followed comments from Rio chief Jean-Sebastien Jacques last month that the Chinese economy could slow over the next six months, particularly in the construction, infrastructure and automotive sectors.

The iron ore market in 2017 was characterised by a widening divide in prices between high and low grade material driven by the Chinese government’s domestic policies.

Last year the government moved to cut overcapacity in the steel industry and curb air pollution by shuttering dirty, inefficient mills.

The drive to clean up the industry has seen remaining mills lift capacity to meet the shortfall and move towards higher grade ore, which produces more steel with less energy and emissions.

Compounding the trend, higher steel prices in China have delivered higher operating margins for mills, allowing them to afford the higher premiums.



Posted By: Whale
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2018 at 4:03pm
That's okay I have BHP shares. What is your point ?


-------------
Victor Orban 1.74 m, Michael Bloomberg 1.73 m, Emmanual Macron 1.77 m, George Soros 1.8 m


Posted By: max manewer
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2018 at 4:18pm
Not sure what Isaac's point here, should the Chinese be "grateful" we sell iron ore to them ? I'd have thought it a commercial transaction, pure and simple. But I wonder how much ore we will have left to sell, at the staggering amounts quoted.


Posted By: max manewer
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2018 at 4:24pm
Funny the way what you eat your dinner off, is named after a country (China). Q. Which country is named after a gemstone ?


Posted By: maccamax
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2018 at 4:48pm
Originally posted by max manewer max manewer wrote:

Funny the way what you eat your dinner off, is named after a country (China). Q. Which country is named after a gemstone ?


TANZANIA so google says .
Do I get a prize.


Posted By: max manewer
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2018 at 4:51pm
Sorry, Tanzania is a composite name, after the amalgamation of Tanganyika and Zanzibar, back in the 60's. The country I have in mind, does not sound at all like an inanimate thing.


Posted By: Passing Through
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2018 at 5:06pm
Brazil?

-------------
''I don't hold a hose mate''


Posted By: max manewer
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2018 at 5:08pm
Originally posted by Passing Through Passing Through wrote:

Brazil?

No, but that is not a nutty idea !


Posted By: Isaac soloman
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2018 at 6:28pm
Originally posted by max manewer max manewer wrote:

Then there is India, it too emerging from its period of European "disruption". The future ain't what it used to be.

is already worried about automation, and how this will affect their young job seekers.


Mechatronics challenge India's government as a million people look for work each month

By South Asia correspondent  http://www.abc.net.au/news/james-bennett/5693616" rel="nofollow - James Bennett

Posted about 10 hours ago

"This is the robotic hand, which is actually controlled by me through these sensors, they're called flex sensors," mechatronics student Subhankar Singh explains proudly.

Key points:

  • India's government believes students could innovate if they were taught more practical skills
  • A million people in India are looking for work each month
  • Automation is eating into factory jobs

'Mechatronics' is a combination of mechanical and electronic engineering, and Mr Singh, together with classmate Narendra Kandori, are tinkering with a robotic hand, controlled by sensors wired into a glove so it moves as they flex their fingers.

"This can be used in the future for bionic arms, so in the medical industry, or the entertainment industry," he said.

"Even for industrial automation."

These students are the future hope for an economy that India's government is desperate to steer away from bureaucracy, and into the innovation business.

"I see 800 million entrepreneurs, who can work towards making the world a better place," India's Prime Minister Narendra Modi said last month, referring to the staggering number of Indians 35 or under.

He has been exhorting foreign companies to "make in India" and encouraging Indian entrepreneurs to start businesses at home instead of travelling abroad to make their fortunes.

The stakes for India are high.Around 2022, the country is set to eclipse China as the world's most populous nation.

Government figures suggest a million people a month join the workforce.

They should be what's called a "demographic dividend" — a boost to the country's productive capacity.

But while India has ample labour supply, demand is another question.

Frederico Gil-Sander, an economist with the World Bank, says unless there are businesses willing to employ them, the young people who should power India's future could instead weigh on the economy.

"They (unemployed people) place a huge burden on the state — it has to spend huge resources on redistribution," Mr Gil-Sander said.

The prospect of this is real, because India's workers face two critical problems.

Manufacturing jobs are drying up, and this country lacks the means to skill them otherwise.

One World Bank study warned two-thirds of the jobs in India today were already under threat from automation.

"Automation in manufacturing in particular and even services, it's a force, it's a wave to be ridden, not something to be fought," Mr Gil-Sander said.

And finding alternative fields?

"That is the the trillion dollar question," he said.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-01-02/indian-workers-and-rise-of-machines/9265200
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-01-02/mechatronics-students-narendra-kandori-and-subhankar-singh/9265254" rel="nofollow -
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-01-02/mechatronics-students/9265246" rel="nofollow -


Posted By: Isaac soloman
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2018 at 6:30pm
whale /dick  etc get blind sided by trump.

china loves that.


Posted By: Isaac soloman
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2018 at 6:31pm
Bigoted' Australia faces trade war over South China Sea, paper warns


Posted By: Passing Through
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2018 at 7:12pm
Trump winning bigly. Japan have dropped them like a hot turd and are signing the biggest trade deal in history with Europe. China are creating their own economic zone extending into Europe. 


http://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2017/12/09/national/politics-diplomacy/japan-eu-reach-final-accord-trade-pact-eye-implementation-early-2019/#.Wks9nWiWbDc" rel="nofollow - http://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2017/12/09/national/politics-diplomacy/japan-eu-reach-final-accord-trade-pact-eye-implementation-early-2019/#.Wks9nWiWbDc

Japan and EU hail creation of a ‘gigantic economic zone’ as trade talks conclude

Implementation eyed for early 2019

AFP-JIJI, KYODO, AP

Japan and the European Union have concluded negotiations on a giant free trade deal that they said was reached while “fighting the temptation of protectionism” — a message apparently directed at U.S. President Donald Trump.

The deal, which the EU called its biggest ever, must be signed and ratified by both sides. The broad outlines of the deal were agreed to in July. Once completed, it will forge an economic zone of 600 million people worth 30 percent of global GDP.

After the announcement was made late Friday, Prime Minister Shinzo Abe hailed the imminent birth of what he called a “gigantic economic zone” as he confirmed that the negotiations had been concluded.

“Japan and the EU will join hands and build an economic zone based on free and fair rules,” Abe told reporters in Tokyo Friday.

Abe and European Commission chief Jean-Claude Juncker said earlier that the agreement, which was four years in the making, had “strategic importance” beyond its economic value.

“It sends a clear signal to the world that the EU and Japan are committed to keeping the world economy working on the basis of free, open and fair markets with clear and transparent rules fully respecting and enhancing our values, fighting the temptation of protectionism,” the pair said in a statement released in Brussels.

Through the deal, the EU hopes to get better access to one of the world’s richest markets, while Japan hopes to jump-start an economy that has struggled to find solid growth for more than a decade.

Japan is also hoping to seize an opportunity to offset the failure of the 12-nation Trans-Pacific Partnership, a massive free trade deal that was torpedoed by Trump in January.

The deal will open up the EU market to Japanese cars and auto parts and the Japanese market to European dairy and agricultural products.

Japan will eliminate tariffs on 94 percent of all imports from the bloc, including 82 percent on farm and fishery products. The reduction will likely result in lower prices for European cheese, pork and wine in Japan — although domestic farmers are wary of being flooded by competitive products.

In return, the EU will abolish tariffs on 99 percent of imports from Japan. The EU will eliminate tariffs on Japanese autos in the eighth year after the pact is implemented and abolish taxes on sake and green tea. Japan’s exports will likely get a boost in a market comprising over 500 million people.

The two sides were aiming to finalize the specifics in the hope of signing the deal next summer and putting it into effect in 2019, negotiation sources said.

EU officials insist the deal will be a major boon to European farmers who would gain access to a huge market that appreciates European products.

Hailing the opportunity at a news conference, EU Trade Commissioner Cecilia Malmstroem said, “This is actually the biggest trade deal we have ever negotiated from the European Union”.

The BusinessEurope lobby hailed the agreement as “very good news” for both companies and citizens on both sides and predicted it will lead to “global standards” in new business areas.

“The agreement should remove long standing tariff and nontariff barriers to trade,” BusinessEurope’s director-general Markus Beyrer said in a statement. “It should generate new business opportunities and closer economic ties between two like-minded economies and is of high strategic importance.”

But anti-trade activists who say such deals favor multinational firms at the expense of democracy and the environment might influence events when the deal comes up for ratification in the bloc’s more than 30 regional and national parliaments.

Last year, the EU’s CETA trade deal with Canada nearly sank on such concerns when the small Belgian region of Wallonia threatened to veto it, before eventually relenting.

In reaching the deal, the sides have decided not to include a system to settle investment disputes and will continue negotiations over the issue, a senior Japanese official said.



-------------
''I don't hold a hose mate''


Posted By: max manewer
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2018 at 10:09pm
Originally posted by Isaac soloman Isaac soloman wrote:

Bigoted' Australia faces trade war over South China Sea, paper warns

Australia would face an economic collapse if the Chinese were to stop trading with us. My bet is they won't !


Posted By: Isaac soloman
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2018 at 10:31pm
Originally posted by max manewer max manewer wrote:

[QUOTE=Isaac soloman] Bigoted' Australia faces trade war over South China Sea, paper warns

Australia would face an economic collapse if the Chinese were to stop trading with us. My bet is they won't ! [/QUOTE
 
no they wont stop trading with us.
we have a good product they want.
we are a safe country.
we are a clean country.
and we are compliant.Wink


Posted By: Isaac soloman
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2018 at 10:32pm
http://www.news.com.au/finance/work/leaders/chinese-newspaper-publishes-disturbing-warning-to-australia-over-south-china-sea-dispute/news-story/32b418a040c706b1cd84138ec0d276ab

the commentary on there is more interesting than here.Wink


Posted By: Isaac soloman
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2018 at 10:33pm
and china wants to take taiwan over.


Posted By: max manewer
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2018 at 10:42pm
Originally posted by Isaac soloman Isaac soloman wrote:

and china wants to take taiwan over.
And that is news, Isaac ? Tell us something we don't know.


Posted By: Passing Through
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 7:54am
Originally posted by max manewer max manewer wrote:

Originally posted by Isaac soloman Isaac soloman wrote:

Bigoted' Australia faces trade war over South China Sea, paper warns

Australia would face an economic collapse if the Chinese were to stop trading with us. My bet is they won't !

The choice will soon be Australia's to make


-------------
''I don't hold a hose mate''


Posted By: Isaac soloman
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 10:07am
Originally posted by max manewer max manewer wrote:

Originally posted by Isaac soloman Isaac soloman wrote:

and china wants to take taiwan over.
And that is news, Isaac ? Tell us something we don't know.

so you know m, im  repeating the news. and it was repeated mainstream in the last few days. must be something in it.

where did you let me know? or other tbv forum users.




Posted By: max manewer
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 10:10am
It has been the clear policy of China to re-absorb Taiwan since before I was born, they consider it part of China, and made that explicit all along.


Posted By: max manewer
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 10:11am
Originally posted by Passing Through Passing Through wrote:

Originally posted by max manewer max manewer wrote:

Originally posted by Isaac soloman Isaac soloman wrote:

Bigoted' Australia faces trade war over South China Sea, paper warns

Australia would face an economic collapse if the Chinese were to stop trading with us. My bet is they won't !


The choice will soon be Australia's to make

Well, if so, this will be an unprecedented national crisis.


Posted By: max manewer
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 10:23am
Turnbull's recent bagging of China, calls into question his fitness to be PM, in my opinion. Why antagonize the main trading partner ? Not for some petty domestic political game, (think Dastyari) ? In any case, total hypocrisy, given the coalition's Chinese connections. There is no gain for Australia in what Turnbull has been saying. Frankly don't think this bloke is worth a cracker to us, and if there was anyone of any calibre in his party, would have been out the door before now.


Posted By: Whale
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 10:30am
Turnbull is in an invidious position of having to reassure the child Potus while keeping our no 1 trading partner onside


-------------
Victor Orban 1.74 m, Michael Bloomberg 1.73 m, Emmanual Macron 1.77 m, George Soros 1.8 m


Posted By: Passing Through
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 11:12am
Australia isn't on China's BRI map. Indonesia, even PNG are, but not us. 

-------------
''I don't hold a hose mate''


Posted By: Shrunk in the Wash
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2018 at 11:19am
Originally posted by Isaac soloman Isaac soloman wrote:


Australia would face an economic collapse if the Chinese were to stop trading with us.


It might be the best thing toi happen to us. Make us wake up and fix the joint


Posted By: Passing Through
Date Posted: 09 Jan 2018 at 8:34am

Macron urges Europe to join China's Silk Road revival plan

French president Emmanuel Macron also called on Europe and China to come together and curb climate change as the US flagged plans to withdraw from the Paris agreement.

UpdatedUpdated 10 hours ago

French president Emmanuel Macron urged Europe on Monday to take part in China's Silk Road revival plan, despite some European misgivings about the massive project as he began a state visit.

Mr Macron also called on Europe and China to team up on curbing climate change, in the face of US plans to withdraw from the Paris accord.

"Our destinies are linked," he said in a keynote speech on the future of Sino-French relations during a visit to the northern city of Xian, the starting point of the ancient Silk Road.

"The future needs France, Europe and China," Mr Macron said, adding he would travel to China "at least once a year".

RELATED READING
French President Emmanuel Macron arrives in Brussels for the European Council summit on 14 December 2017.

https://www.sbs.com.au/news/macron-warns-of-australian-free-trade-stampede-sources" rel="nofollow - Macron warns of Australian 'free trade stampede': sources

Mr Macron began his three-day visit in Xian as a gesture to Chinese President Xi Jinping's huge New Silk Road project, an initiative to connect Asia and Europe by road, rail and sea.

The $1 trillion infrastructure programme is billed as a modern revival of the ancient Silk Road that once carried fabrics, spices and a wealth of other goods in both directions.

Known in China as "One Belt, One Road", the plan will see gleaming new road and rail networks built through Central Asia and beyond, and new maritime routes stretching through the Indian Ocean and Red Sea.

The project has elicited both interest and anxiety, with some in Europe seeing it as Chinese expansionism.

While France had been cautious about the plan, Mr Macron heartily endorsed the initiative.

"It represents a real opportunity to create bridges, through exchange, between countries and civilisations, just as the ancient silk routes once did," he said in an interview with the Chinese website China.org.cn.

"I think it's very important that Europe and China strengthen their collaboration on the initiative. France is ready to play a leading role in this."

But Mr Macron warned it should be carried out "within the framework of a balanced partnership" - a reference to concerns about China's trade surpluses. France has a $45.9 billion trade deficit with China.

Climate battle

Mr Macron's first official visit to Asia marks a new stage for his diplomacy, which has so far been concentrated on Europe and Africa.

He plans to seek a "strategic partnership" with Beijing on issues including terrorism.

In a French version of panda diplomacy, Mr Macron will give Mr Xi a horse as a gift - a retired Republican Guard horse that is currently in quarantine. 

On climate change, Mr Macron said he would talk to Mr Xi about "relaunching the climate battle" by preparing an increase in their engagements to combat global warming at the COP 24 talks in Poland later this year.

He praised China, the world's top polluter, for committing to the Paris accord after US President Donald Trump notified that America would pull out of the pact.

"China kept its word," he said.

"You demonstrate your immense sense of responsibility."

Cooperation will "show the world that the French and Chinese are capable of making our planet great and beautiful again", he said in Chinese.

After Xian, Mr Macron will head to Beijing along with his delegation which includes some 60 business executives and representatives of institutions.

Mr Macron and his wife, Brigitte, will meet Mr Xi and his wife, Peng Liyuan, on Monday night.

On Tuesday he will visit the Forbidden City, meet top Chinese officials and oversee the signing of business deals.

Human Rights Watch has urged Mr Macron to call publicly for human rights improvements in China during his meeting with Xi, but the French president's office said the matter would be addressed privately.

Along with his wife, Mr Macron visited the famous terracotta warriors in Xian, as well as a centuries-old Big Wild Goose Pagoda - a Buddhist site - and the city's mosque.

The 8000-man clay army, crafted around 250 BC for the tomb of China's first emperor Qin Shihuang, is a symbol of ancient artistic and military sophistication in a country that proclaims itself a 5,000-year-old civilisation.

http://www.sbs.com.au/news/macron-urges-europe-to-join-china-s-silk-road-revival-plan" rel="nofollow - http://www.sbs.com.au/news/macron-urges-europe-to-join-china-s-silk-road-revival-plan



-------------
''I don't hold a hose mate''


Posted By: Whale
Date Posted: 09 Jan 2018 at 11:18am
Trump is simply hastening China's inevitable ascension to no 1 economic power with his isolationist, combative, poorly thought out " policies "

Good one Donny Embarrassed


-------------
Victor Orban 1.74 m, Michael Bloomberg 1.73 m, Emmanual Macron 1.77 m, George Soros 1.8 m


Posted By: Passing Through
Date Posted: 09 Jan 2018 at 11:19am
He is the best thing that could have happened for China/Russia

-------------
''I don't hold a hose mate''


Posted By: maccamax
Date Posted: 09 Jan 2018 at 12:38pm
Originally posted by Passing Through Passing Through wrote:

He is the best thing that could have happened for China/Russia


How come America isn't aware of all this.

The costly delusion is bringing others to their knees
America has a brain of it's own .

Difference is, the USA is using theirs.

-------------



Posted By: max manewer
Date Posted: 09 Jan 2018 at 12:45pm
I posit that what has happened in the US is a variation of the "trickle down-effect", now we have the "wicking-up" of dumbness, a population that has been dumbed-down for decades, radiating its dumbness into every corner of society by osmosis. Someone should write their thesis on it. How is the Great Wall of Mexico any smarter than re-building the Chinese Great Wall to keep out undesirables ?


Posted By: Passing Through
Date Posted: 09 Jan 2018 at 12:47pm
68% of Americans are aware. The rest are deluded Trumpers waiting for the Telah spaceship to pick them up

-------------
''I don't hold a hose mate''


Posted By: Dr E
Date Posted: 09 Jan 2018 at 8:23pm
It's amazing CNNPT, two victims of pedophilia, you vilify and discredit what Milo says, yet praise Macron ...

-------------
In reference to every post in the Trump thread ... "There may have been a tiny bit of license taken there" ... Ok, Thanks for the "heads up" PT!


Posted By: Passing Through
Date Posted: 09 Jan 2018 at 8:26pm
I dont think either were victims

-------------
''I don't hold a hose mate''


Posted By: Isaac soloman
Date Posted: 09 Jan 2018 at 9:08pm
" a population that has been dumbed-down for decades, "who you talking about? America? china has been doing that for centuries! what do you think they will have in store for the world?

would america run down its own population with tanks? what is your opinion of human rights isues in china? 

take that china bot....


Posted By: stayer
Date Posted: 09 Jan 2018 at 9:12pm
Originally posted by Passing Through Passing Through wrote:

I dont think either were victims

Pay that.

-------------
"She's going through a growth phase." - GW


Posted By: Dr E
Date Posted: 09 Jan 2018 at 11:26pm
Naturally you discredit Milo who says he was, and not Macron, who lied about it ... 

-------------
In reference to every post in the Trump thread ... "There may have been a tiny bit of license taken there" ... Ok, Thanks for the "heads up" PT!


Posted By: VOYAGER
Date Posted: 09 Jan 2018 at 11:35pm
Whale, your second post in this thread is one of the best posts I have ever read in the village.

A great piece of clinical, objective analysis of the international impact on China's evolution, and it's role in the progress of Europe.

By the way Taiwan is a part of China, even the US governments policy is a one national China.

-------------
Remember, it might take intelligence to be smart , but it takes experience to be wise


Posted By: Isaac soloman
Date Posted: 09 Jan 2018 at 11:58pm
i think my Taiwanese friend would disagree. with you voyager. 

Say Goodbye to Taiwan

Time is running out for the little island coveted by its gigantic, growing neighbor.

http://nationalinterest.org/profile/john-j-mearsheimer" rel="nofollow - John J. Mearsheimer
http://twitter.com/share?url=http%3A%2F%2Fnationalinterest.org%2Farticle%2Fsay-goodbye-taiwan-9931&text=Say%20Goodbye%20to%20Taiwan" rel="nofollow - http://nationalinterest.org/print/article/say-goodbye-taiwan-9931" rel="nofollow">Printer-friendly version
http://nationalinterest.org/issue/march-april-2014" rel="nofollow - March-April 2014
< ="http:/ationalinterest.org/s/s/Taipei_101_from_afar_1.jpg" name="my" scrolling="no" border="1" marginheight="0px" marginwidth="0px" height="600px" width="800px" id="my" style="-sizing: border-;">

WHAT ARE the implications for Taiwan of China’s continued rise? Not today. Not next year. No, the real dilemma Taiwan will confront looms in the decades ahead, when China, whose continued economic growth seems likely although not a sure thing, is far more powerful than it is today.

Contemporary China does not possess significant military power; its military forces are inferior, and not by a small margin, to those of the United States. Beijing would be making a huge mistake to pick a fight with the American military nowadays. China, in other words, is constrained by the present global balance of power, which is clearly stacked in America’s favor.

But power is rarely static. The real question that is often overlooked is what happens in a future world in which the balance of power has shifted sharply against Taiwan and the United States, in which China controls much more relative power than it does today, and in which China is in roughly the same economic and military league as the United States. In essence: a world in which China is much less constrained than it is today. That world may seem forbidding, even ominous, but it is one that may be coming.

It is my firm conviction that the continuing rise of China will have huge consequences for Taiwan, almost all of which will be bad. Not only will China be much more powerful than it is today, but it will also remain deeply committed to making Taiwan part of China. Moreover, China will try to dominate Asia the way the United States dominates the Western Hemisphere, which means it will seek to reduce, if not eliminate, the American military presence in Asia. The United States, of course, will resist mightily, and go to great lengths to contain China’s growing power. The ensuing security competition will not be good for Taiwan, no matter how it turns out in the end. Time is not on Taiwan’s side. Herewith, a guide to what is likely to ensue between the United States, China and Taiwan.

IN AN ideal world, most Taiwanese would like their country to gain de jure independence and become a legitimate sovereign state in the international system. This outcome is especially attractive because a strong Taiwanese identity—separate from a Chinese identity—has blossomed in Taiwan over the past sixty-five years. Many of those people who identify themselves as Taiwanese would like their own nation-state, and they have little interest in being a province of mainland China.

According to National Chengchi University’s Election Study Center, in 1992, 17.6 percent of the people living in Taiwan identified as Taiwanese only. By June 2013, that number was 57.5 percent, a clear majority. Only 3.6 percent of those surveyed identified as Chinese only. Furthermore, the 2011 Taiwan National Security Survey found that if one assumes China would not attack Taiwan if it declared its independence, 80.2 percent of Taiwanese would in fact opt for independence. Another recent poll found that about 80 percent of Taiwanese view Taiwan and China as different countries.

However, Taiwan is not going to gain formal independence in the foreseeable future, mainly because China would not tolerate that outcome. In fact, China has made it clear that it would go to war against Taiwan if the island declares its independence. The antisecession law, which China passed in 2005, says explicitly that “the state shall employ nonpeaceful means and other necessary measures” if Taiwan moves toward de jure independence. It is also worth noting that the United States does not recognize Taiwan as a sovereign country, and according to President Obama, Washington “fully supports a one-China policy.”

Thus, the best situation Taiwan can hope for in the foreseeable future is maintenance of the status quo, which means de facto independence. In fact, over 90 percent of the Taiwanese surveyed this past June by the Election Study Center favored maintaining the status quo indefinitely or until some later date.

The worst possible outcome is unification with China under terms dictated by Beijing. Of course, unification could happen in a variety of ways, some of which are better than others. Probably the least bad outcome would be one in which Taiwan ended up with considerable autonomy, much like Hong Kong enjoys today. Chinese leaders refer to this solution as “one country, two systems.” Still, it has little appeal to most Taiwanese. As Yuan-kang Wang reports: “An overwhelming majority of Taiwan’s public opposes unification, even under favorable circumstances. If anything, longitudinal data reveal a decline in public support of unification.”

In short, for Taiwan, de facto independence is much preferable to becoming part of China, regardless of what the final political arrangements look like. The critical question for Taiwan, however, is whether it can avoid unification and maintain de facto independence in the face of a rising China.

WHAT ABOUT China? How does it think about Taiwan? Two different logics, one revolving around nationalism and the other around security, shape its views concerning Taiwan. Both logics, however, lead to the same endgame: the unification of China and Taiwan.




Posted By: Isaac soloman
Date Posted: 12 Jan 2018 at 8:50pm

China hopes to have its way without firing a shot

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/opinion/china-hopes-to-have-its-way-without-firing-a-shot/news-story/b0bf11ba347f3460a42601f1b670b190" rel="nofollow - http://www.theaustralian.com.au/opinion/china-hopes-to-have-its-way-without-firing-a-shot/news-story/b0bf11ba347f3460a42601f1b670b190

Although Basil Liddell Hart and John Boyd may be considered two of the most brilliant military strategists of the modern era, the father of pure grand strategy is Greek military commander Epaminondas (418-362BC).

A year after the Battle of Leuctra, Epaminondas marched across the Peloponnesian peninsula in Sparta. The Spartans refused to be engaged in the open, so Epaminondas elected to pursue what Liddell Hart called “true grand strategy”. In the middle of Sparta Epaminondas founded a new city at Mount Ithome in Messenia state, then another, Megalopolis, in Arcadia.

Across time this resulted in an infiltration of Sparta’s population, the creation of an insurgency and the loss of most of its workers. Significantly, it established influence over more than half of Sparta’s territory, controlling trade and economic routes. No battle was fought, not an arrow was fired nor a spear thrown.

Similarly, by penetrating the integrated systems and networks of government, business information, media, resources and strategic energy and maritime assets, China has sought to weave together an impressive influence within Australia and many other parts of the world. China’s pure grand strategy presents a significant geopolitical risk for us, particularly for investors, where these crucial areas of business, government and politics intersect.

When crossing the river on the border of Cote d’Ivoire and Mali with the Dozos (traditional hunters who act as a kind of village neighbourhood watch), you can see them ride their motorbikes on to a canoe and remain in the seat until they cross to the other side, where they ride off into the Mali savanna. No one told them they couldn’t do that, so they adapted.

No one told China it couldn’t build new islands on partly submerged reefs and claim them as Chinese territory with an exclusive zone of influence. No one said it couldn’t then place missiles, airstrips, helipads and satellite infrastructure on those islands. Throughout the history of China’s claim for the South China Sea, nothing was done to contain its application of grand strategy, except an appeal to a toothless international tribunal whose decision no one is willing or able to enforce.

The geopolitical risks built around this form of pure grand strategy are borderless and their effects can emerge in ways that may seem incongruent. When former US president Barack Obama failed to enforce his “red line” against Syrian President Bashar al-Assad’s use of chemical weapons against civilians, this sent the message to other nations that they could expand regional hegemonic claims without repercussions.

Indeed, whenever concern is expressed over the militarisation of the South China Sea islands, China plays the Obi-Wan Kenobi Jedi mind trick by claiming “there is nothing to see here”.

China’s use of pure grand strategy through the indirect approach was revealed three years before the September 11, 2001, terrorist attacks in the US, when two senior serving officers in the People’s Liberation Army, colonels Qiao Liang and Wang Xiangsui, wrote Unrestricted Warfare. In this slim volume the PLA officers advocate the use of non-military methods of waging war to defeat technologically superior opponents, such as the US.

The suggested methods include disrupting the networks of trade, telecommunications and transportation on which the West depends, as well as electricity grids and avenues of information technology (for instance through incessant hacking) including mass media, plus financial and economic manipulation.

This indirect approach is a clever means of gaining geopolitical advantage while avoiding direct military conflict.

China’s investment in a range of strategically located foreign ports around the world is more than smart supply-chain management. These investments create enormous leverage for China in the domestic and foreign policy interests of the countries that sold these ports to China. The effect of this positioning can be subtly played out in votes at the UN, the Association of Southeast Asian Nations, the Asia-Pacific Economic Co-operation forum, the World Trade Organisation and a range of other multilateral bodies.

Not surprisingly, the authors also advocate manipulating the West’s commitment to international rules and conventions, such as the Law of Armed Conflict. Liang and Xangsui believe in fully exploiting the way the West imposes political and moral restraints on how its military forces can fight.

China has one of the largest seaborne guerilla fleets in the world. Under the cover of fishing, the on-water militia acts as a proxy force to extend and enforce China’s maritime interests. If it is attacked or threatened, China can claim its civilians are being unfairly targeted and generate strong nationalistic sentiment among mainland Chinese and those living abroad.

China shares a border with more countries than any other state. Since 1949, it has had border disputes with every one of its neighbours. Yet China also has resolved its border disputes with most of them, including Myanmar, Nepal, North Korea, Mongolia, Pakistan and Laos. It even has managed to reach territorial settlements with former enemies, notably Vietnam and Russia.

One of the best questions to ask an Australian prime minister is: how does Australia position itself between the US, our most important ally, and China, our most significant trading partner and increasingly the major owner of strategic assets in Australia and throughout our region?

One thing is for sure: given that the consequences of military conflict between leading powers threaten greater harm than perhaps at any time in history because of the complex and deeply integrated nature of economies and populations, now that these strategic locations and assets are lost, China’s ability to influence our ­national interests is likely only to grow.

Jason Thomas teaches risk management at Swinburne University and specialises in field-based assessments of complex project environments in countries such as Afghanistan, Iraq, Syria and Pakistan.



Posted By: SHOVHOG
Date Posted: 19 Jan 2018 at 4:19pm
These threads are all cute... do you know what agenda 21 is and why china has bought so much agricultural land ? Do a bit of research and by the way Rothschild basically owns china and Russia. The zionists control the world now and the USA didn't invade Iraq for oil either another made up deception. Saddam found some important historical artifacts just like Hitler who searched under the sea. People are so busy they can't see that the politicians are actors and people like Kanye west & Jim carrey are telling a story that people think is crazy but it's big picture stuff.

Pink Floyd sang about all this crap years ago but people don't comprehend the meaning of the lyrics.

-------------
" In gambling the many must lose in order for the few to win"


Posted By: Isaac soloman
Date Posted: 21 Jan 2018 at 9:35pm

Horrific moment a lion and tiger both mauled circus horse - which miraculously SURVIVED

defenceless http://www.mirror.co.uk/all-about/horses" rel="nofollow - horse  was brutally mauled in the middle of a circus ring by a captive lion AND tiger.

The show horse was performing inside the ring when, out of nowhere, the two big  http://www.mirror.co.uk/all-about/tigers" rel="nofollow - beasts pounced.

Circus bosses said they had a daring plan for the  http://www.mirror.co.uk/all-about/animals" rel="nofollow - big cats  to ride on the back of the horse and were rehearsing the risky trick when the two animals attacked.

The horrific incident happened inside a tent belonging to the Chinese "Taiyang"  http://www.mirror.co.uk/all-about/circuses" rel="nofollow - circus .

According to a Taiyang Circus spokesman surnamed Xu, it happened "half a month ago".

  • Credits: AsiaWire
  • Credits: AsiaWire
  • Credits: AsiaWire
  • a blurry image of a cat: Credits: AsiaWire
Credits: AsiaWire
< ="leftarrow" ="-1" title="Previous Slide" -m=""n":"previousSlideArrow","y":12,"i":113,"o":3,"p":"55"" -id="113" style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px; font-size: 0px; line-height: 0; font-family: a; : rgba0, 0, 0, 0.5; border-width: 0px; border-style: initial; border-color: initial; cursor: pointer; border-radius: 0px; -webkit-appearance: none; -webkit-user-drag: none; user-: none; left: 0px; transition: 0.22s; height: 7.2rem; outline: 0px; : ; width: 3.2rem; : 2; top: 150.5px;">Previous Slide< ="rightarrow" ="-1" title="Next Slide" -m=""n":"nextSlideArrow","y":12,"i":114,"o":4,"p":"55"" -id="114" style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px; font-size: 0px; line-height: 0; font-family: a; : rgba0, 0, 0, 0.5; border-width: 0px; border-style: initial; border-color: initial; cursor: pointer; border-radius: 0px; -webkit-appearance: none; -webkit-user-drag: none; user-: none; right: 0px; transition: 0.22s; height: 7.2rem; outline: 0px; : ; width: 3.2rem; : 2; top: 150.5px;">Next Slide

The horse was prancing round the outside of the ring, wearing a small saddle, when the terrifying incident took place.

A circus spokesman said: "The animals didn't cooperate too well. The horse kicked the lion, which began biting it in return."

To make matters worse, the tiger which was also in the ring at the time joined the attack, gnawing at the animal's legs as it tried to gallop away.

The distressing footage shows the horse desperately going in circles around the caged ring as both the  http://www.mirror.co.uk/all-about/lions" rel="nofollow - lion  and the tiger cling to its body.

Circus staff used whips to drive the two big cats away, the video shows, with the panicking horse left bleeding and injured at the end of the ordeal.

Xu said the horse was "fine" and that it was "normal" for similar incidents to occur during rehearsals.

Their shows continued as planned. It is believed the circus is not currently being investigated by authorities.

https://www.msn.com/en-au/news/world/horrific-moment-a-lion-and-tiger-both-mauled-circus-horse-which-miraculously-survived/ar-AAuPKGL#image=AAuPKGL_1|3



Posted By: JudgeHolden
Date Posted: 21 Jan 2018 at 10:53pm
Take that!!! ...I'm not sure who or what.....


Posted By: Passing Through
Date Posted: 22 Jan 2018 at 6:44pm
Wow, 6:43 PM and there are 10 Chinese bots reading.

Careful what you say Isaac Shocked


-------------
''I don't hold a hose mate''


Posted By: Isaac soloman
Date Posted: 22 Jan 2018 at 8:45pm
LOLi wouldnt roll over like you pt....


Posted By: Passing Through
Date Posted: 22 Jan 2018 at 8:48pm
Here is a nice follow up to your post last week

http://nypost.com/2018/01/20/thai-police-arrest-suspected-wildlife-trafficking-boss/" rel="nofollow - http://nypost.com/2018/01/20/thai-police-arrest-suspected-wildlife-trafficking-boss/


-------------
''I don't hold a hose mate''


Posted By: Passing Through
Date Posted: 25 Jan 2018 at 8:30pm
Maybe Mr Xi could fix Mr Turnbull's crappy 3rd rate NBN


Jan 24, 2018 10:31 PM
https://www.caixinglobal.com/topics-news/?t=101010306" rel="nofollow - BUSINESS & TECH


China Woos Guinea with Satellite-TV DealPeople watch a television broadcast of the results of presidential elections in Nairobi, Kenya, on Oct. 30. Kenya is one of 25 African nations where the Chinese government is attempting to help more locals access satellite TV. Photo: IC

People watch a television broadcast of the results of presidential elections in Nairobi, Kenya, on Oct. 30. Kenya is one of 25 African nations where the Chinese government is attempting to help more locals access satellite TV. Photo: IC

China has signed an agreement with the oil-rich West African nation of Guinea to bring satellite-TV services to more than 300 villages, reflecting Beijing’s ongoing soft-power push in the continent.

The agreement is part of China’s ambitious plan to provide such services to 10,000 villages in 25 African countries by the end of 2018. The plan builds on a concept introduced by President Xi Jinping in 2015 at the sixth Forum on China-Africa Cooperation, held in Johannesburg.

China’s Ministry of Commerce on Tuesday announced the deal, which was signed last month. Beijing-based StarTimes Group, which offers direct-to-home pay-TV services, will carry out the project, according to the Chinese Embassy in Guinea.

StarTimes will provide satellite dishes for free and is expected to charge the equivalent of a $1 subscription fee per month, StarTimes Vice President Guo Ziqi said.

“Before we entered this market, the average fee for a cable or satellite TV package for a family was about $40 dollars per month,” Guo said. The company, with nearly 10 million subscribers in 30 African countries, said they aim to introduce more Chinese TV series that “combine both African and Chinese cultural elements” and “become a channel for cultural exchange.”

Its packages currently include several local African channels and a wide selection of Chinese news, entertainment and sports programming.

Beijing has rolled out similar trials projects in villages in Tanzania, Mozambique, Kenya and Uganda.

“The pay-TV operator is playing a vital role to further China’s soft-power diplomacy agenda in Africa,” Dani Madrid-Morales, a doctoral fellow at the City University of Hong Kong, told news site China Africa Project. “It’s a huge effort to get Africans to understand China.”

Contact reporter Mo Yelin (yelinmo@caixin.com) 

http://www.caixinglobal.com/2018-01-24/china-woos-guinea-with-satellite-tv-deal-101202396.html" rel="nofollow - http://www.caixinglobal.com/2018-01-24/china-woos-guinea-with-satellite-tv-deal-101202396.html
By Mo Yelin



-------------
''I don't hold a hose mate''


Posted By: Isaac soloman
Date Posted: 26 Jan 2018 at 9:05am
does the TPP affect chinas new silk road project?


Posted By: Passing Through
Date Posted: 26 Jan 2018 at 9:14am
The TPP was always designed to counter the OBOR. but America dropping out set it back, With it now back on albeit with the biggest economy (about 25% of the world) it will try to get back on track. They will now try to get the US involved again. I wouldn't be surprised if it actually happens under Trump, but if not it will happen under the next resident

OBOR is targeting emerging economies with the plan to grow them quickly. What the percentages look like now or in 5 years will be nothing like they will be in 10-20 years with OBOR being maybe 75% or more of the worlds economy


-------------
''I don't hold a hose mate''


Posted By: Passing Through
Date Posted: 26 Jan 2018 at 9:15am
*without the biggest economy

-------------
''I don't hold a hose mate''


Posted By: Isaac soloman
Date Posted: 26 Jan 2018 at 12:23pm
ANUARY 25 2018 - 9:01PM

Australia takes over Solomon Islands internet cable amid spies' concerns about China

Australia's spy agencies were so concerned about the security and strategic risks posed by a plan for Chinese firm Huawei to build an internet cable linking the Solomon Islands to Sydney that the Turnbull government will now largely pay for the project itself.

The Department of Foreign Affairs has confirmed it has taken responsibility for the undersea fibreoptic cable, including paying for the bulk of the project – which will cost tens of millions of dollars – through the overseas aid program.

The cable will provide fast and reliable internet to the small Pacific island nation, which now relies on satellites.

The step is highly significant as it shows the lengths to which the Turnbull government was willing to go to ensure the cable project could go ahead without Huawei's involvement.

he Solomon Islands under former prime minister Manasseh Sogavare signed up Huawei Marine to lay the cable connecting to Sydney. But Australia made it clear to Honiara that it had security concerns about the Chinese telco plugging into Australia's internet backbone, with Nick Warner, the head of spy agency ASIS, personally warning Mr Sogavare last June.

Huawei has previously been banned on the advice of security agency ASIO from being involved in the National Broadband Network.

Mr Sogavare was replaced as prime minister in November by Rick Hou, a former senior World Bank adviser who is well respected in Australia. Mr Hou had been highly critical of the circumstances in which Huawei Marine was awarded the contract under his predecessor.

A spokeswoman for the Department of Foreign Affairs told Fairfax Media the government has entered a contract with the Australian telecommunications firm Vocus to carry out the initial work.

"They will undertake a scoping study and identify potential solutions to bring high-speed telecommunications to Solomon Islands," she said.

"The bulk of the funding for this project will come from Australia's Official Development Assistance program."

She said the Solomons project would be consolidated with a project to lay a new cable connecting Papua New Guinea with Australia, creating "significant efficiencies on cost". The cost of the Solomons project alone has previously been estimated at $86 million.

According to the federal government's AusTender website, Vocus is being paid $2.8 million for the scoping study for both the Solomon Islands and PNG. The department spokeswoman said that this study would define the final cost.

Fairfax Media understands Australia was concerned about the security implications of Huawei being involved in connecting to Australia's critical infrastructure, but also more broadly about a Chinese firm – even a private sector one – extending Chinese influence into the Pacific through the cable project.

The Solomons originally identified a British-American company to do the work and had secured backing from the Asian Development Bank. But the previous government abruptly switched to Huawei, prompting the ADB to pull out, saying that the "Huawei contract was developed outside of ADB procurement processes".

A Huawei spokesman said: "We've been advised by the Solomon Islands Submarine Cable Company that Vocus has been contracted to undertake a scoping study but that's all they have said to us."

Jonathan Pryke, a Pacific islands expert at the Lowy Institute, applauded Australia's move, saying that it made strategic and security sense while also providing much-needed development.

"There's clearly a strategic objective to this project. It's to make sure there's no opportunity for third players like China or a Chinese company like Huawei to swoop in and provide a cable to PNG or the Solomons that could affect strategic interests and compromise Australia's security."

He said Chinese development would be welcome in the Pacific if it were more transparent and added there had been concerns in the Solomon Islands about the opaqueness of the Sogavare government's deal with Huawei Marine.

The cable company's CEO, Keir Preedy, was not available for comment. Mr Hou's office did not respond to email requests for comment.

http://www.watoday.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/australia-takes-over-solomon-islands-internet-cable-amid-spies-concerns-about-china-20180125-h0o7yq.html



Posted By: Passing Through
Date Posted: 26 Jan 2018 at 12:30pm
Should I get rid of my Huawei mobile phone Isaac? Do you think they are listening in?

-------------
''I don't hold a hose mate''


Posted By: acacia alba
Date Posted: 26 Jan 2018 at 12:40pm
Probably Thumbs Up  Listening in, I mean.


-------------
animals before people.


Posted By: Passing Through
Date Posted: 26 Jan 2018 at 12:46pm
I would be shocked if they weren't listening in where they could AA, just as we listen in on anyone we can or the US or Russia Britain, or anyone does. 

-------------
''I don't hold a hose mate''


Posted By: Isaac soloman
Date Posted: 26 Jan 2018 at 1:18pm
and what would you have to hide pt? nothing as you are their friend.
Image result for how high to jump


Posted By: Passing Through
Date Posted: 26 Jan 2018 at 1:27pm
Kiwis are listening too, as are Nth Koreans. Nothing to hide here Isaac. Anyone who wants to can listen to me

What are you hiding, and from whom?


-------------
''I don't hold a hose mate''


Posted By: Isaac soloman
Date Posted: 26 Jan 2018 at 1:56pm
hiding?LOL

just keeping  a finger on the china pulse, as you do in the potus thread.

but i suppose im more interested in the interests of aus, than you are.

and keeping those unheard readers of tbv informed.

a matter of balance, i believe.


Posted By: Isaac soloman
Date Posted: 26 Jan 2018 at 2:04pm

Prime Malcolm Turnbull at odds with New Zealand counterpart Jacinda Ardern over refugee offer


Staff writers, News Corp Australia Network
PRIME Minister Malcolm Turnbull and his New Zealand counterpart Jacinda Ardern are at odds over claims Australia’s neighbour is encouraging people smuggling.


According to a report yesterday  http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/national/new-zealand-offer-to-house-manus-island-asylum-seekers-fuels-smuggle-trade-intelligence-sources/news-story/c1980409bc0c79a1eb178f719f03aa95" rel="nofollow - people smugglers have been taking advantage of New Zealand’s offer to take in refugees .

The Australian Prime Minister backed those claims and moved to inform New Zealand they were benefiting from his country’s border protection policy.

Mr Turnbull said a number of people-smuggling boats had recently been intercepted by Australian authorities, with their crews suggesting they were planning to go to New Zealand.

“The people smugglers are absolutely ruthless,” Mr Turnbull said.

“They use all of the social media we use and they use it very skilfully and market any scrap of information that they can and so they were very busy marketing and promoting New Zealand as a destination recently.”

However  https://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/new-zealand-pm-jacinda-ardern-defiant-on-asylumseeker-offer/news-story/1637ac65bf82346611ec22f986b35fca" rel="nofollow - The Australian  reports Prime Minister Ardern moved to defend her offer to resettle refugees from Manus Island and Naura, claiming it was “not new” and had been made as far back as 2013 under former Prime minister John Key.

“Chatter among people-smugglers has ebbed and flowed for many, many years … keeping in mind of course that Tampa was over 15 years ago, so that’s not a new issue.”

The Australian has also reported that a boat was intercepted by Australian authorities just prior to Christmas, and that smugglers on board the vessel had said New Zealand was their destination.

Sri Lankan police had also reportedly stopped two other vessels who said they were attempting to get to New Zealand.

Intelligence officials also said that increased “chatter” in the past few months had put New Zealand as a prime destination for asylum seekers.

An intelligence source reportedly said that the rise in people-smuggling was down to the fact that the Ardern government’s proposal to take refugees from offshore detention centres.

/www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/national/prime-malcolm-turnbull-at-odds-with-new-zealand-counterpart-jacinda-ardern-over-refugee-offer/news-story/4f2fa33cb6157f6ef3b1cf353db34719

wonderful ally nz.....



Posted By: Passing Through
Date Posted: 26 Jan 2018 at 2:05pm
I am very interested in Australia and the post WW11 world order remaining in place. Pointing out the bleeding obvious Chinese global activity isn't supporting them. 

You on the other hand claim to be anti China, yet support Trump who is doing his best to make China/Russia great again, handing the world order to them and building real and economic walls to isolate themselves from China 


-------------
''I don't hold a hose mate''


Posted By: maccamax
Date Posted: 26 Jan 2018 at 2:05pm
No need for anyone to listen in to much .
With the UK falling behind in
the highest migrant slots to Australia we are now being populated by China & India in the main.

Our people with ancestry from those Areas appear to integrate very well and are a bonus to our Growing Nation.

I can't comment on how many from there,    wear Burkas ( for obvious reasons )      " Yoke Yoyce "


Posted By: Passing Through
Date Posted: 26 Jan 2018 at 2:07pm
What does NZ have to do with China? Confused

-------------
''I don't hold a hose mate''


Posted By: Carioca
Date Posted: 26 Jan 2018 at 2:32pm
Originally posted by Passing Through Passing Through wrote:

What does NZ have to do with China? Confused

Well for a start I think their real estate values ( as in principle) differ.


Posted By: Passing Through
Date Posted: 26 Jan 2018 at 2:39pm
I dont think Isaac's article had anything to do with real estate values unless he thinks that a heap of asylum seekers moving into neighborhoods would draw down his Chinese friends investment property values LOL

-------------
''I don't hold a hose mate''


Posted By: Passing Through
Date Posted: 26 Jan 2018 at 4:59pm
$3.90 ... nice Thumbs Up




-------------
''I don't hold a hose mate''


Posted By: Carioca
Date Posted: 26 Jan 2018 at 5:19pm
I'm glad you backed a winner PT, but for future reference the 4th horse was a little stiff, The Gavel , fwiw.


Posted By: Isaac soloman
Date Posted: 26 Jan 2018 at 10:26pm
you brought nz into it pt by suggesting nz were listening in to.

took the opportunity to  expand the topic.LOL careful what you wish for.....


Posted By: Isaac soloman
Date Posted: 27 Jan 2018 at 10:34am

China tells world: It’s us or the United States ahead of President Trump’s Davos speech

BEIJING’S message to world leaders was loud and clear and comes as US President is set to take the world stage with his own message.

http://www.news.com.au/the-team/debra-killalea" rel="nofollow">
http://www.news.com.au/the-team/debra-killalea" rel="nofollow - Debra Killalea http://twitter.com/DebKillalea" rel="nofollow - @DebKillalea CHINA has given the world a blunt choice by asking global leaders to choose between Xi Jinping’s global outlook and that of US President Donald Trump.

In a strongly worded editorial by the state’s news agency, Beijing said the world needed to choose between “two fundamentally different outlooks” which included the Chinese President’s shared future and Mr Trump’s America First policy.

The commentary, by  http://www.xinhuanet.com/english/2018-01/24/c_136921547.htm" rel="nofollow - Xinhua , comes as global leaders and policy makers gather in the Swiss town of Davos for the World Economic Forum which draws to a close on Friday.

Mr Trump has already attended a gala reception and dinner with European business chiefs.

The US President is due to address the forum on its closing day at the end of a week that saw his administration announce a new package of trade tariffs targeting China and South Korea, and spark upheaval on the currency markets.

The glitzy annual gathering at a Swiss Alpine resort has drawn politicians, CEOs and celebrities to ponder public policy and global co-operation for more than 50 years.

Mr Xi last year delivered the first address by a Chinese leader at the forum where he took up the torch of global trade to the delight of the well-heeled audience then anxious about Mr Trump’s inauguration.

He was absent from this year’s forum, but that didn’t stop China from delivering its own message to the world.

Xinhua said the world can either choose between China’s vision or Mr Trump’s “self-centred America First policy (which) has led his country away from multiple multilateral pacts and infused anxiety into both allies and the broader world”.

“Although what he is about to say at the globalist brainstorming feast on Friday remains guesswork, few believe this particular pulpit would be able to make him turn his back on the poster boy of a rising isolationist tendency that many fear is fragmenting the world,” the editorial reads.

It goes on to say the “Xi-style collaborative approach” is the only way forward because of “the interests of different countries have become so closely intertwined that mankind has no future but a shared one”.

China and the US have had a testing relationship in recent months with tensions increasing over Mr Trump’s push for China to do more over North Korea.

During the US election campaign, Mr Trump was outspoken about his opposition to Beijing’s global trade policy.

In 2016 he told a rally in Indiana the country was responsible for “the greatest trade theft in the history of the world”.

“We can’t continue to allow China to rape our country, and that’s what we’re doing,” he told the crowd.

Beijing has made no secret of its ambitious plans for global growth in the past.

In a 3 ½ hour speech given while opening a five-yearly national congress in October last year, Mr Xi set out his country’s ambitious  http://www.news.com.au/finance/work/leaders/chinas-30year-deadline-to-rule-the-world/news-story/70f62a5bc0e4580b83d5ca89a2479e94" rel="nofollow - plans to become the world’s biggest superpower within the next 30 years .

The Chinese President spelt out his time frame for the country to become a “global leader” with international influence and said “it was time for his nation to transform itself into a mighty force” that could lead the entire world on political, economic, military and environmental issues.

US OPEN FOR BUSINESS

Earlier this week White House officials said the President was going to the World Economic Forum to promote his economic policies.

Top Trump economic adviser Gary Cohn said the President was going to Davos to “tell the world that America is open for business”.

Administration aides say he will use his maiden appearance to play salesman-in-chief, making the case for investment in a revitalised America.

“(This trip) is about an America First agenda but America First does mean working with the rest of the world,” US Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin said.

“It just means that President Trump is looking out for American interests, no different than other leaders look out for their own.”

Mr Trump’s business-friendly tax cuts and a record-breaking bull run on Wall Street have wowed many in the Davos crowd.

But the decision by Mr Trump — the self-styled anti-globalist president — to attend the world’s most notable gathering of globalists, and at an exclusive Swiss ski resort no less, has left some scratching their heads.

Mr Trump has criticised global pacts, withdrawing from the Trans-Pacific Partnership (TPP) on trade, demanding changes to the North American Free Trade Agreement and announcing his intent to exit the Paris climate accord.

However, in a an interview with CNBC to be broadcast in full on Friday US time, Mr Trump suggested he was open to the United States joining the TPP, which he had rejected only a year ago.

China’s stinging editorial also comes after Mr Trump imposed tariffs on imported solar-energy components and large washing machines last week in a blow to China’s export market.

Commerce Secretary Wilbur Ross conceded that China could slap retaliatory tariffs on US products following the decision this week to impose tariffs on imported solar-energy components and large washing machines.

Mr Ross said there’s “always potential for retribution and retaliation and that’s up to the Chinese to decide”.

China’s stinging editorial also comes after Mr Trump imposed tariffs on imported solar-energy components and large washing machines last week in a blow to China’s export market.

Commerce Secretary Wilbur Ross conceded that China could slap retaliatory tariffs on US products following the decision this week to impose tariffs on imported solar-energy components and large washing machines.

Mr Ross said there’s “always potential for retribution and retaliation and that’s up to the Chinese to decide”.

http://www.news.com.au/finance/work/leaders/china-tells-world-its-us-or-the-united-states-ahead-of-president-trumps-davos-speech/news-story/b8cf52702b85dd66a68c0acdd6bd2bbf
http://www.news.com.au/" rel="nofollow - news.com.au JANUARY 27, 20186:29A








Posted By: Passing Through
Date Posted: 27 Jan 2018 at 11:58am


-------------
''I don't hold a hose mate''


Posted By: Passing Through
Date Posted: 27 Jan 2018 at 11:59am


-------------
''I don't hold a hose mate''


Posted By: Passing Through
Date Posted: 27 Jan 2018 at 12:00pm
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-katanga-mng-stocks/glencores-katanga-mining-soars-on-dizzying-cobalt-rally-idUSKBN1E62N9" rel="nofollow - http://www.reuters.com/article/us-katanga-mng-stocks/glencores-katanga-mining-soars-on-dizzying-cobalt-rally-idUSKBN1E62N9

DECEMBER 13, 2017 / 6:11 AM / A MONTH AGO

Glencore's Katanga Mining soars on dizzying cobalt rally



-------------
''I don't hold a hose mate''


Posted By: Passing Through
Date Posted: 27 Jan 2018 at 12:06pm
Democratic Republic Congo is producing >60% of global cobalt, soon will be lithium from AVZ's Manono,

-------------
''I don't hold a hose mate''


Posted By: Passing Through
Date Posted: 28 Jan 2018 at 12:18pm

'This is different rich...It's crazy': the Chinese riding the spending boom

It's Friday night at Chadstone shopping centre in south-east Melbourne, and a queue has formed outside the Chanel boutique. A sign at the store's entrance says it's full: "Due to safety reasons, we are unable to let any more clients in at this time." A dark-suited staff member stands near the sign, as if to deter anyone so desperate to spend $7000 on a handbag that they are thinking of forcing their way inside.

Chadstone is Australia's largest shopping mall, with more international designer-label boutiques than anywhere else in the country. Dior, Balenciaga, Saint Laurent, Prada, Armani, Burberry, Givenchy, Valentino, Fendi – they're all here, under the soaring roof of the centre's high-fashion precinct. And Chanel isn't the only one making prospective customers wait for admission. As I join the throng on an indoor boulevard, I see lines snaking out the doors of Dolce & Gabbana, Gucci and Louis Vuitton. In the air, there is barely contained retail mania. And the sound of people speaking Mandarin.

Just 2.2 per cent of the Australian popul more.....


http://www.msn.com/en-au/money/personalfinance/this-is-different-richits-crazy-the-chinese-riding-the-spending-boom/ar-BBIhFAv?li=AAgfYrC&ocid=mailsignout" rel="nofollow - http://www.msn.com/en-au/money/personalfinance/this-is-different-richits-crazy-the-chinese-riding-the-spending-boom/ar-BBIhFAv?li=AAgfYrC&ocid=mailsignout


-------------
''I don't hold a hose mate''


Posted By: Isaac soloman
Date Posted: 30 Jan 2018 at 3:51pm
Anson Chan [ Iron butterfly] was the first woman and Chinese

appointed to the role of Chief Secretary of Hong Kong when the

city was under British rule. She was seen as a symbol of stability

when China kept her on as HKs top civil servant after taking over

twenty one years ago.

Her warning for Australia at the National Press Club...

'I don't think any country dealing with China should be under any

illusion as to the objectives of the communist party leadership.

You are dealing with a country that does not share Australia's

core values. So these must be a concern in terms of looking at

Australia's own security interests,moral interests and moral

concerns. Australia should stay firm on its values and principles,

that is the basis developing its relationship with China, because

the line between state ownership and private ownership in China

is a "very blurred and movable line."


"Obfuscation and corruption are standard fare for totalitarian regimes and hence Chinese business.  In the longer term interests of Australians, the WA government must not capitulate to Chinese demands and insist that the Chinese demonstrate that they have met the initially agreed terms of the lease in full before any variation or extension will be considered.


Under no circumstances should Chinese interests be granted freehold ownership of any Australian territory.  China's activities and attitude, whether globally or locally, demonstrate that China has no respect for the rights and sovereignty of other nations; and that makes China untrustworthy.  We also need to be mindful that, despite appearances of private ownership, communism means that everything is ultimately owned by the state; so any Chinese freehold land ownership would in reality be owned by the Chinese government and hence communist party."




Posted By: Isaac soloman
Date Posted: 30 Jan 2018 at 3:54pm
"I learnt a very good lesson 10-15 years ago when I negotiated a contract with a large Chinese organisation.   after 3 months of sometimes heated negotiation a contract was signed and things started to move.



one time , about 3 months later, I arrived at their offices for a high level meeting to arrange the next phases to be implemented.   The contract was on the desk and after some cool greetings my counterpart looked me straight in the eye and said, as he picked up the contract, "we wont be needing this anymore".  he placed it in his bottom drawer and then started to discuss how he and his company would now be implementing the project with no reference to the contract at all.



Contracts mean little to Chinese companies, particularly in China.  they simply do business on their terms only."



Posted By: Isaac soloman
Date Posted: 05 Feb 2018 at 11:14pm
EXCLUSIVE

Controversial China book may get parliamentary protection

Key members of Federal Parliament’s national security committee are backing a move to use the committee’s powers to publish an explosive book on Chinese Communist Party influence in Australia.

Committee chair and Liberal MP Andrew Hastie and deputy chair Anthony Byrne, a Labor MP, are among those supporting the move despite the potential for diplomatic fall-out, according to multiple sources.Fairfax Media has also confirmed that the office of Prime Minister Malcolm Turnbull has been briefed on the deliberations of the committee and has no objection to it publishing  the manuscript.

Two major publishers ditched the manuscript, by a professor of public ethics at Charles Sturt University, Professor Clive Hamilton, citing fears Beijing or its proxies would launch legal action.

he publishing of the manuscript by the Joint Parliamentary Committee on Intelligence and Security would further jolt relations between Canberra and Beijing, as the book exhaustively details clandestine efforts by the Chinese government to co-opt and influence Australian politicians, universities, think tanks and the media.

It may also anger several influential ex-politicians, including former foreign minister Bob Carr and former trade minister Andrew Robb. The book is highly critical of the pair’s dealings with billionaire businessmen closely aligned to the Chinese Communist Party.In discussions last week, the committee shelved plans to publish the book as an addendum to Dr Hamilton's far shorter submission to its inquiry into the Turnbull government’s proposed laws to counter foreign interference.But by receiving the manuscript of Silent Invasion: How China Is Turning Australia into a Puppet State as an exhibit, the committee has retained a power to publish it.

One of the concerns raised last week inside the committee about publishing the book was the appropriateness of granting it the parliamentary power of qualified privileged - which prevents the authors of submissions from being sued, and protects others such as journalists who re-publish the contents of the book.

Three committee members were understood to have been concerned that tabling the manuscript would enable a commercial publisher who otherwise wouldn’t print the book to do so.

But that concern has been made redundant this week, with Fairfax Media on Monday confirming that publisher Hardie Grant has already sent the book to the presses and would release it in March.

The debate inside the committee about publishing the book will likely move this week to a weighing up of the desire to promote free speech and debate versus the potential blow-back from Beijing or those adversely named.

Earlier this year, Melbourne University Press become the second leading publisher after Allen and Unwin to ditch plans to publish the book over concerns the Chinese government or its proxies would launch legal action.

Allen and Unwin’s decision to ditch the book in November due to "potential threats to the book and the company from possible action by Beijing"  http://www.theage.com.au/national/free-speech-fears-after-book-critical-of-china-is-pulled-from-publication-20171112-gzjiyr.html" rel="nofollow - caused international headlines .

It’s understood that at least one senior Melbourne University official raised concerns about Beijing’s ability to dissuade students from attending the university if MUP published the book.

However, MUP chief executive Louise Adler said this did not influence her board’s decision. Ms Adler said she welcomed Hardie Grant's decision to publish the book.

The manuscript has been sent to the committee’s secretariat along with its two most senior members, Mr Hastie and Mr Byrne. Both declined to comment on Monday.

Last night, a spokesman for Mr Hastie said: “The internal deliberations of the [committee] are confidential. The deputy chair and I are in strict agreement on this point.”

But last week, while Mr Hastie questioned Dr Hamilton in the committee about publishers ditching his book, the Liberal MP said: “What's really at stake here is not just sovereignty, national security and our long-term economic prosperity but our democratic tradition, including free speech, free press and free thought.”

Mr Byrne asked Dr Hamilton: “You have the manuscript of a book but you are saying to this committee 'you can't publish this book because of the influence of a foreign power'?”

Dr Hamilton’s manuscript is the most detailed examination conducted outside of government of clandestine foreign interference activities in Australia involving Chinese Communist Party operatives and proxies.

The Chinese government has dismissed as unfounded, biased or racist previous reports about such activity, including  http://www.watoday.com.au/interactive/2017/chinas-operation-australia/" rel="nofollow - a landmark Fairfax Media-But the government in December introduced new laws aimed at countering foreign interference by China and other states.

The controversy around Dr Hamilton’s book and the decision by Hardie Grant to publish has a precedent. As a barrister in the 1980s, Mr Turnbull successfully opposed the British government’s attempts to ban the book Spy Catcher by one of its former intelligence operatives.

That book was published by Sandy Grant, the owner of Hardie Grant, who has also agreed to publisher Dr Hamilton’s book.



Posted By: stayer
Date Posted: 09 Feb 2018 at 5:36pm
Probably nobody here interested but big news for catholics the past week or so is that pope frankie and the fruitloops running the vatican these days have sold out to China.

Firstly they have said that the communist govt can appoint their own bishops (puppets of the communist Patriotic Catholics Association, who have no standing in the catholic church), and have asked several genuine, authorised bishops to step down. This is an almost unbelievable move, considering the suffering and persecution (jailings, disappearances, torture) of the true "underground" catholics. It is a heartbreaking and shocking betrayal for the faithful catholic chinese.

Secondly, they have said that China is showing "global moral leadership" in tbeir practice of principles of catholic social doctrine. Why? Because they show us how to "subordinate things to the general good."

You won't read about this stuff in the media. Thought I'd share. It's obviously not just about religious hypocrisy and power play - it's indicative of the shifting sands of global politics these days.

-------------
"She's going through a growth phase." - GW


Posted By: Passing Through
Date Posted: 09 Feb 2018 at 5:59pm
I read about this a couple of years ago and hadn't read any more till just recently. I thought the Vatican has a say in the nomination process. Wouldn't this be just an innitial step towards bringing the Vatican-Catholics into the open with a view to some sort of pathway to ammalgamation with the State controlled Catholics at some point in the future? 

-------------
''I don't hold a hose mate''


Posted By: stayer
Date Posted: 09 Feb 2018 at 6:20pm
Originally posted by Passing Through Passing Through wrote:

I read about this a couple of years ago and hadn't read any more till just recently. I thought the Vatican has a say in the nomination process. Wouldn't this be just an innitial step towards bringing the Vatican-Catholics into the open with a view to some sort of pathway to ammalgamation with the State controlled Catholics at some point in the future? 

Yes that's the line being sold (somewhat desperately by the few progressive streams struggling to rationalize such idiocy and betrayal.) Equating it to John Paul 2's dealings with commie governments. Total BS. The current pope is hopelessly naive and controlled by the very types of people he publicly condemns. He has had experience with south american forms of communism/socialism, but has no idea about the reality of what goes on in China. I could go on about vatican stuff in recent years, but my point on this thread is just that China is getting pretty powerful in global politics.

-------------
"She's going through a growth phase." - GW


Posted By: stayer
Date Posted: 09 Feb 2018 at 6:22pm
You have to understand what the false govt catholic body is really about (basically keeping eyes and notes on people who threaten the status quo) to appreciate how bad this is.

-------------
"She's going through a growth phase." - GW


Posted By: Passing Through
Date Posted: 09 Feb 2018 at 6:27pm
I thought the Chinese made the approach to the Vatican requesting Papal ''pardons'' for Chinese Bishops to legitimise them in the Catholic Church and in return the Vatican Catholics would be brought into the structure of the Chinese church albeit in lesser roles. 

That sounds like the Chinese reaching out  making moves they need not make. What is it to China if the Catholic church prospers or even survives in China? With a population estimated at 12 million in a country of 1.4 billion they must be little more than an annoyance.


-------------
''I don't hold a hose mate''


Posted By: stayer
Date Posted: 09 Feb 2018 at 6:33pm
True. But they must be pretty annoying (!) for the govt to "reach out"!
Any way if you're genuinely interested in knowing about it all I can post some links. Eg the previous pope benedict wrote some very carefully worded stuff about it all. And no, the communist bishops weren't approved by the vatican. Avenues of dialogue were opened and invitations made, but of course the chinese govt didn't want to play on anyone else's terms. They just wanted to look nice.

-------------
"She's going through a growth phase." - GW


Posted By: Passing Through
Date Posted: 09 Feb 2018 at 6:41pm
Sure thanks. Thumbs Up

China today is different to China just a few years ago. Their belt and road project extends throughout Europe who with 600 million people and high GDP they are the biggest part of the trade pact. Relations with and cultural concessions with European countries is just part and parcel of their project I believe.

Same in Africa, which is another huge potential market, they are having cultural hurdles there and are actually engaging Indian and Japanese companies to joint ventures because of their longer exposure to Africa. 

They are going out of their way to make this work with a charm offensive as well as lots of cash in the form of infrastructure investment low interest loans


-------------
''I don't hold a hose mate''


Posted By: stayer
Date Posted: 09 Feb 2018 at 6:48pm
I believe you but I don't have an economic bone in my body so can't respond. I'm ok with big picture cultural/ philosophical type stuff and I can see that China might be finally about to go global. It's a bit of a worry if they want to shut down personal life etc and "subordinate things to the general good." Ugh.

-------------
"She's going through a growth phase." - GW


Posted By: Isaac soloman
Date Posted: 09 Feb 2018 at 6:49pm
i try my best to point stuff out but apathy is a big winner.... wonder what the Dalai lama would have to say?

and pt shuts it/shoots it down quickly....


Posted By: stayer
Date Posted: 09 Feb 2018 at 6:56pm
Yep apathy about big issues is a symptom of the media feed of sensational ones. Funny how the more connected we are by the internet the more we become a bunch of gossiping old women.

-------------
"She's going through a growth phase." - GW


Posted By: Passing Through
Date Posted: 09 Feb 2018 at 7:03pm
Isn't that democracy in action? Globally interconnected and anyone able to get an opinion out there to anyone in the world with a computer and a connection

-------------
''I don't hold a hose mate''



Print Page | Close Window

Forum Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 11.10 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Copyright ©2001-2017 Web Wiz Ltd. - https://www.webwiz.net