Ace High
Printed From: Thoroughbred Village
Category: Horse Racing - Public Forums
Forum Name: Racing Forum
Forum Description: General discussion about thoroughbred horse racing
URL: https://forum.thoroughbredvillage.com.au/forum_posts.asp?TID=61128
Printed Date: 18 Apr 2024 at 9:17pm
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 12.05 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Ace High
Posted By: djebel
Subject: Ace High
Date Posted: 07 Oct 2017 at 11:10pm
------------- reductio ad absurdum |
Replies:
Posted By: Sunline
Date Posted: 07 Oct 2017 at 11:19pm
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As he passed the post, once I was done doing cartwheels, I wonder if he'd run out 2500m. Then you look at his pedigree and you have to think he will. Payne was adamant the Derby will be his chance to take a sit and he has no doubt that with a sit he will stay. I guess it becomes barrier draw pending like it always is in the Victoria Derby. Anyone else have an opinion? ------------- Sunline...simply supreme |
Posted By: Red Hare
Date Posted: 07 Oct 2017 at 11:42pm
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Similar story, once I had completed a second lap of high fives around the table, I declared the Derby his - if the connections can be bothered with one extra run. However, the rider had to go over the allowed number of strikes to get him home today. Tempo notwithstanding, that was enough for a heat check from a betting perspective. Agree though, the pedigree almost demands 2500m. Interesting that his Derby price hasn't changed too much after today's win.
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Posted By: JudgeHolden
Date Posted: 07 Oct 2017 at 11:47pm
| Thought he was more impressive over 1800. Sully the one I'd want to be on from a Derby perspective out of that race. |
Posted By: VPI
Date Posted: 07 Oct 2017 at 11:52pm
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Happy to be on him today, unlikely to back up on him in the Derby. ------------- @value_punter |
Posted By: scamanda
Date Posted: 08 Oct 2017 at 1:38am
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What a good horse Ace High turned out to be. And a Group One winner. In his last 2 runs he was challenged, looked gone, and kicked back to win. It's like he just digs in when challenged. Octagonal used to do that. Not that Ace High is in Occy's class. Not yet anyway. ------------- I started with nothing and still have most of it left |
Posted By: TJMitchell
Date Posted: 08 Oct 2017 at 1:17pm
| Jockey hit him 8/9 times between the 400-100m and he wins by a half head. Not taking anything away from the win just saying why have a rule if it's never followed. |
Posted By: furious
Date Posted: 08 Oct 2017 at 1:27pm
| Hope Tangled can run a distance. He has a very stout female line and what a bonus for Snitzel to get one over a distance. They can't keep out of each others way over 1200m. |
Posted By: JoanFerguson
Date Posted: 04 Nov 2017 at 3:56pm
| And to think Payne asked the owners for permission to geld |
Posted By: scamanda
Date Posted: 04 Nov 2017 at 4:04pm
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He's now getting to a point where he has to be looked at as a champion 3YO. This prep he's won the Gloaming, Spring Champion Stakes, and Derby. What other 3YO has surpassed that? They'd need 2 Grp 1s to start with. I said before he wasn't in Occy's class yet. But he just might well be considered that one day. ------------- I started with nothing and still have most of it left |
Posted By: furious
Date Posted: 04 Nov 2017 at 4:05pm
| He's running pretty good as a colt. Decends from Natalma dam of Northern Dancer why. He's got speed he's not a slow stayer. |
Posted By: Sunline
Date Posted: 04 Nov 2017 at 4:08pm
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What a horse. He's a star! How on earth Angland ended up in the position he did I'll never know. I was going berserk in the run. Then in the blinking of an eye the race was over anyway. He was soft on the line. That's a serious animal. ------------- Sunline...simply supreme |
Posted By: Afros
Date Posted: 04 Nov 2017 at 4:10pm
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Monaco Consul won the 2 G1s but didn't run in the Gloaming, Dundeel won the first 2 legs but failed in the Derby, great achievement no doubt. Also a tick to High Chap as a sire of early maturing stayers! |
Posted By: Sunline
Date Posted: 04 Nov 2017 at 4:11pm
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Great sire and hats off to the trainer. He was deserted by owners many years ago now and has trained more G1 winners than I've had hot dinners. Ace High's owner is virtually his only owner of any note. ------------- Sunline...simply supreme |
Posted By: djebel
Date Posted: 04 Nov 2017 at 4:18pm
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That was simply outstanding. How did the ride compare with Bowmans last week ? 🤠 ------------- reductio ad absurdum |
Posted By: Sir Gov
Date Posted: 04 Nov 2017 at 4:30pm
nice work Sunny
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Sunline wrote:Posted By: djebel
Date Posted: 04 Nov 2017 at 6:33pm
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The last Victoria Derby winner to win the Melbourne Cup was winning the Melbourne Cup at his 13th start having won the Derby at his 6th. Ace High was having his 12th start today, Shocking was having his 8th start when he won his Queensland Derby before winning his Cup at his 15th start. Subzero was having his 20th start when he won his South Australian Derby before winning his Cup at his 28th start. ------------- reductio ad absurdum |
Posted By: Second Chance
Date Posted: 04 Nov 2017 at 7:09pm
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Thanks. I think.
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Posted By: Shawy38
Date Posted: 01 Mar 2018 at 9:51am
| Bump |
Posted By: Cheeky
Date Posted: 01 Mar 2018 at 10:07am
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Very keen on this horse for the remainder of the Autumn, I would love to see him take on Winx in QE, but doubt this will happen as he will probably follow the Derby path (and probably should). ------------- Good Horse Good Jockey Good Bet Pittsburgh Phil |
Posted By: djebel
Date Posted: 01 Mar 2018 at 10:44am
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I do not see him winning another race. ------------- reductio ad absurdum |
Posted By: furious
Date Posted: 01 Mar 2018 at 10:52am
| Bit harsh there Djebel. A VRC second placegetter from a few years ago just won the Launceston Cup so these horses can and do go on. |
Posted By: Shawy38
Date Posted: 01 Mar 2018 at 11:08am
Bondeiger didn’t place in the VRC Derby. He was disqualified for testing positive to cobalt |
Posted By: furious
Date Posted: 01 Mar 2018 at 1:34pm
| Well he originally placed! |
Posted By: Gay3
Date Posted: 01 Mar 2018 at 1:37pm
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Fwiw I backed him last Sat. & reckon I was one run early, it was a super staying type effort, he just kept coming on so Randwick & 200m should see him go close barring any soundness or medical issues. ------------- Wisdom has been chasing me but I've always outrun it! |
Posted By: 3blindmice
Date Posted: 01 Mar 2018 at 1:52pm
The rules are there but there's no convincing evidence that cobalt enhances horse performance
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Posted By: 3blindmice
Date Posted: 01 Mar 2018 at 1:57pm
| Be very surprised if he isn't figuring in some big races this autumn. Funny thing is I had a liking for him when he was running good fifths and sixths over shorter distances (only ever backed him once in the Stan Fox iirc) then didn't follow up even when he struck form. Eeejut |
Posted By: Nick
Date Posted: 01 Mar 2018 at 10:24pm
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Derby winner |
Posted By: Straight Connector
Date Posted: 02 Mar 2018 at 8:29am
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And after he wins the Derby, what price Caulfield Cup? I see $31 available now. You'd nearly half it. At a guess he'd carry about 55kg? Same as Mongolian Khan.. |
Posted By: Sunline
Date Posted: 02 Mar 2018 at 9:27am
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Derby winners have a poor record in the Cups, and their odds never match that probability, or the weight disadvantage, in futures markets. ------------- Sunline...simply supreme |
Posted By: furious
Date Posted: 02 Mar 2018 at 9:32am
| Yes Sunline. No one ever takes into account that any stakes winner at two or three is then penalized when it gets to open class as a four year old. Weight can stop 9 of the 10 as the late maturing ones have caught up. Often therefore it is the one which finished just behind the placegetters who comes out flying as an older horse. Not crucified with the weight of expectations. |
Posted By: djebel
Date Posted: 02 Mar 2018 at 9:57am
99.999999% of horses have a poor record in the cups, no hold on make that 99.9999999% of horses. ------------- reductio ad absurdum |
Posted By: Sunline
Date Posted: 02 Mar 2018 at 10:29am
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That only furthers my point, djebel. It tells you that taking any horse that is firm in a Cups futures market is madness. And that's what they do with Derby winners year after year, despite no evidence to suggest they have any better chance than anything else. ------------- Sunline...simply supreme |
Posted By: djebel
Date Posted: 02 Mar 2018 at 10:45am
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If you were to do a comprehensive study of the formlines of Cup winners, Both Caulfield and Melbourne I suspect Derby winners probably do have a good record over most other formlines. ------------- reductio ad absurdum |
Posted By: Sunline
Date Posted: 02 Mar 2018 at 10:48am
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The race has changed dramatically. You'd only want to look over the last 15-20 years max for any worthwhile guide to the future. ------------- Sunline...simply supreme |
Posted By: Straight Connector
Date Posted: 02 Mar 2018 at 10:59am
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Having said all that, he has not yet won the Derby & is currently $31 (I haven't shopped, there is probably better out there). So what price if he wins the Derby & therefore does it make current odds more attractive? |
Posted By: 3blindmice
Date Posted: 02 Mar 2018 at 10:59am
| Given they're G1 distance winners albeit against their own ages I think you'll find their winning records are very disappointing if you're punting. I did a table on another forum some time back of derby and oaks winners V CC and MC iirc. I'll post here - if I can find it. It's only an indicator but if you're betting a long way out it's worth knowing. |
Posted By: Carioca
Date Posted: 02 Mar 2018 at 11:47am
Pretty close to the mark there furious, been borne out over the years and they pay the price, could well be the reason the early successful colts are snapped up for duty before the other promising types catch up. |
Posted By: Red Hare
Date Posted: 02 Mar 2018 at 12:50pm
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He'd have to be 50/50 to run as a 4yo, in this country at least. |
Posted By: Lord Hybrow
Date Posted: 01 Sep 2018 at 7:57pm
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Good to see this guy put in a nice effort today in the Chelmsford Stks. Right on track for the Spring Cups and I imagine he’ll run in something like the Hill Stakes next up before heading South to Melb |
Posted By: Lord Hybrow
Date Posted: 14 Sep 2018 at 12:05am
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Really liked his last run at 1600m & had expected to see him step up to 1900m or 2000m at his next outing. A little concerned to see him going around again at 1600m in the George Main Stks. Anyone know what path D.Payne has mapped out en route to the Melb Cup? Love to see an Aussie bred stayer fighting out the finish of the big race and he’s probably our best chance. Just hope he’s not over cooked come Cup day. |
Posted By: Shawy38
Date Posted: 29 Sep 2018 at 4:24pm
| Good win |
Posted By: djebel
Date Posted: 29 Sep 2018 at 11:11pm
And I have yet to see todays 😆 ------------- reductio ad absurdum |
Posted By: AdaHunta
Date Posted: 30 Sep 2018 at 2:37am
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Hes a good horse take nothing away from his win today But IMO TSTB set the race up for him turned it into a grind taking Egg Tarts sprint away Suited this guys racing style more
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Posted By: Prince of Penzance
Date Posted: 20 Oct 2018 at 3:58pm
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Sweated up badly and is calling out in the tie ups. Never a good sign |
Posted By: VOYAGER
Date Posted: 20 Oct 2018 at 4:03pm
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Thanks POP, my $15 overs all in bet, looks like toilet paper now! ------------- Remember, it might take intelligence to be smart , but it takes experience to be wise |
Posted By: Prince of Penzance
Date Posted: 20 Oct 2018 at 4:11pm
| David Payne has asked for Caulfield cup hope ace high to moved as he was stabled next to a stack of fillies. “He is still a bull likes the girls too much.” |
Posted By: Lord Hybrow
Date Posted: 19 Jun 2019 at 10:56pm
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Retired to Rich Hill Stud in NZ @ $10k + GST. Never quite realised his 3yo potential into open age races. But good to see him find a home at a quality establishment like Rich Hill. |
Posted By: djebel
Date Posted: 19 Jun 2019 at 11:17pm
Superb pedigree. ------------- reductio ad absurdum |
Posted By: Xavier
Date Posted: 20 Jun 2019 at 12:32pm
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Realistic price range, I like it. Good luck to all involved. Hope he does well ------------- Karl and Susan Kennedy are my heroes |