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Forum Name: Stallions
Forum Description: Stallion appraisals and trends
URL: https://forum.thoroughbredvillage.com.au/forum_posts.asp?TID=60405 Printed Date: 30 Mar 2024 at 1:04am Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 12.05 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Cable BayPosted By: djebel
Subject: Cable Bay
Date Posted: 12 Jun 2017 at 10:00pm
CABLE BAY (IRE)
Bay colt 2011
Invincible Spirit Bay 1997
Green Desert Bay 1983
Danzig Bay 1977
Northern Dancer Bay 1961
Nearctic Natalma
1954 1957
14-c 2-d
Pas de Nom Bay or brown 1968
Admiral's Voyage Petitioner
1959 1952
4-n 7-a
Foreign Courier Bay 1979
Sir Ivor Bay 1965
Sir Gaylord Attica
1959 1953
2-s 8-g
Courtly Dee Bay or brown 1968
Never Bend Tulle
1960 1950
19-b A4
Rafha Bay 1987
Kris Chestnut 1976
Sharpen Up Chestnut 1969
Atan Rocchetta
1961 1961
2-f 5-i
Doubly Sure Bay 1971
Reliance Soft Angels
1962 1963
16-g 2-o
Eljazzi Bay 1981
Artaius Bay 1974
Round Table Stylish Pattern
1954 1961
2-f 14-c
Border Bounty Bay 1965
Bounteous B Flat
1958 1958
14-f 7-a
Rose de France Bay 2005
Diktat Brown 1995
Warning Bay 1985
Known Fact Bay or brown 1977
In Reality Tamerett
1964 1962
21-a 2-f
Slightly Dangerous Bay 1979
Roberto Where You Lead
1969 1970
12-c 14-f
Arvola Bay or brown 1990
Sadler's Wells Bay 1981
Northern Dancer Fairy Bridge
1961 1975
2-d 5-h
Park Appeal Bay or brown 1982
Ahonoora Balidaress
1975 1973
1-m 14-c
Cherokee Rose Bay 1991
Dancing Brave Bay 1983
Lyphard Bay 1969
Northern Dancer Goofed
1961 1960
2-d 17-b
Navajo Princess Bay 1974
Drone Olmec
1966 1966
1-l 3-d
Celtic Assembly Bay 1981
Secretariat Chestnut 1970
Bold Ruler Somethingroyal
1954 1952
8-d 2-s
Welsh Garden Bay 1973
Welsh Saint Garden of Eden
1966 1967
9-h 10-c
Ancestor duplications:
Northern Dancer
4m x 5m,5m
Black Caviar breeder confident of pulling off Cable Bay challenge
Martin Stevens speaks to Rick Jamieson about his ambitious plan
When it was announced that Cable Bay, coming to the end of covering his second book of mares at Highclere Stud, would shuttle to Australia from this year it might have been assumed that the identity of his sire, Invincible Spirit, was the overriding reason he was in demand down under. Another son, I Am Invincible, ranks as one of the most exciting young stallions there, after all.
Or perhaps it was the fact his granddam, Haydock Sprint Cup heroine Cherokee Rose, was a half-sister to Volksraad, a multiple champion sire in New Zealand; or his good looks, which have enticed breeders to send him 152 mares in his first British book and around 130 in his second; or even his admirable race record, which included a runner-up effort in the Dewhurst Stakes at two and a victory in the Challenge Stakes on his final start at four.
All of those factors may have contributed to the cause of https://www.racingpost.com/profile/horse/837155/cable-bay" rel="nofollow - Cable Bay 's working holiday at Woodside Park Stud in Victoria, but the main motivation for Rick Jamieson orchestrating the deal to secure the stallion's southern hemisphere breeding rights was in fact deeply hidden elements of his pedigree that the breeder of unbeaten sprint queen Black Caviar has pinpointed.
For Jamieson is an avid analyst of thoroughbred families and, by choosing matings seemingly - the word seemingly is used because the exact details of his method are not disclosed - based on determining influential ancestors and matching them between the sire and dam, he managed to breed five Group 1 winners from only around 54 foals to have raced in the space of six years.
And what makes the achievement all the more impressive is that the sires he has chosen are not necessarily the most fashionable or expensive. Black Caviar's sire Bel Esprit is a solid source of talent but has never reached the heights of a Redoute's Choice or Encosta De Lago, while this season's Caulfield Cup heroine Jameka, one of the latest star graduates of Jamieson's Gilgai Farm, was bred from the unpretentious Myboycharlie.
“Look, I know there's a lot of luck involved, I'm not stupid, but those winners were from modestly bred mares and I was not afraid to go to less commercial stallions as long as they fitted my matrix,” Jamieson said at last week's Magic Millions National Broodmare Sale on the Gold Coast, where he and his agents were busy sourcing mares for Cable Bay. “Breeding and planning matings is my hobby, and it's worked out extraordinarily well.”
Now Jamieson has set himself the reverse challenge of finding his own stallion and testing whether an impressive strike-rate of winners to runners can be achieved if correctly matched mares are sent to him.
“I wondered for some time whether the same theories I used for mating my mares could apply to a sire,” he said. “My friend Peter Anastasiou [the breeder of Cloth Of Stars] pushed me into turning it into reality. He looked for a stallion, starting in Australia then stretching out and looking in the UK.
“Peter suggested some stallions to see if they had what I looked for and one of them was Cable Bay. The more I peeled back the pedigree, the more comfort I took that we could match mares to this horse.
“So we got him out here and the mission is to turn him into a stallion with double-digit stakes winners to runners. A good horse in Australia might get six to seven per cent; to get over ten per cent is exceptional, then you've got a serious horse.
“It's a bit of a personal challenge, to correctly mate mares to him. I'm pretty confident I'll do it.”
The team that joined Jamieson to import Cable Bay to Australia includes Woodside Park Stud, Grand Lodge and B2B Bloodstock. The partners will be sending around 50 mares who correctly match with the sire, and 12 lots were purchased at Magic Millions by Dermot Farrington and Damon Gabbedy's Belmont Bloodstock for that purpose. They included Miss Cover Girl, a Group 1-winning daughter of Monashee Mountain, for A$500,000 (£296,000/€337,000).
Jamieson did not reveal what criteria those mares filled, saying only his method was “too difficult to explain” but that he looks for “a lot of things – synergies and multiples”.
He dropped one clue by adding that Dancing Brave is “dynamite” in a pedigree due to the influence of that brilliant horse's sire Lyphard and damsire Drone. Dancing Brave was the sire of Cherokee Rose who, remember, is the maternal granddam of Cable Bay.
So there you have it: the key selling point for Jamieson in the acquisition of southern-hemisphere breeding rights in Cable Bay was not necessarily his sire-line, his racing performance or quality of his first foals, as strong as any of those claims may be. Rather, it appears it might have been ancestors in his third and fourth generations and deeper pedigree analysis that clinched the deal.
Cynics would do well to remember the breeder of Black Caviar's phenomenal strike-rate of nine per cent Group 1 winners to runners.
He might just know what he's talking about.
Group 1 winners bred by Rick Jamieson
Black Caviar Bel Esprit-Helsinge (Desert Sun) The sprint queen, a daughter of inexpensive sire Bel Esprit, retired undefeated in 25 starts, 15 of them at the highest level including a memorable raid on Royal Ascot that just came off when jockey Luke Nolen stopped riding near the finish of the Diamond Jubilee Stakes.
All Too Hard Casino Prince-Helsinge (Desert Sun) By some margin the best horse by his sire, this half-brother to Black Caviar was beaten by Pierro in Group 1 company at two but gained revenge at three when he defeated his old foe to win the Caulfield Guineas before also taking the Orr Stakes, Futurity Stakes and All Aged Stakes.
Jameka Myboycharlie-Mine Game (General Nediym) The filly by Myboycharlie - a sire who punches well above his lowly covering fee - is rated comfortably within the top 20 of the Longines World's Best Racehorse Rankings after taking this season's Caulfield Cup and BMW by wide margins.
The Quarterback Street Boss-Soorena (Encosta De Lago) Jamieson took the punt on US Grade 1 winner Street Boss in the first season he shuttled to Australia, at a fee of just A$16,500 – around £9,700 or €11,000 – and was rewarded by breeding The Quarterback, who sprang a surprise by winning the prestigious Newmarket Handicap last year.
Lucky Bubbles Sebring-Bubble Below (Hussonet) Jamieson paid a snip more for the nomination to Sebring – A$49,500 (£29,000/€33,000) – but at least he caught the sire on the way up, as he eventually stood for as much as A$77,000. The result was Lucky Bubbles, a new star in Hong Kong sprinting and winner of the Chairman's Sprint Prize last month.
------------- reductio ad absurdum
Replies: Posted By: Gay3
Date Posted: 21 Jun 2017 at 3:13pm
http://inglis.com.au/sales/info/2017+Great+Southern+Sale/catalogue/779" rel="nofollow - 779
Ch
Mare
http://inglis.com.au/sales/info/2017+Great+Southern+Sale/catalogue/779" rel="nofollow - Very Choosy
http://www.bloodstock.com.au/bloodstock/stallion/choisir-3" rel="nofollow - Choisir
Pedantic
Owners
Cable Bay Syndicate VIC
$75,000
Duplication of Sharpen Up here, thru' son & daughter with a 3rd strain of his dam Mixed Marriage thru' daughter Tamerett.
Sireline of both is Danzig.
------------- Wisdom has been chasing me but I've always outrun it!
Posted By: djebel
Date Posted: 21 Jun 2017 at 3:17pm
Unnamed
Cable Bay (IRE) Bay 2011
Invincible Spirit Bay 1997
Green Desert Bay 1983
Danzig Bay 1977
Northern Dancer Pas de Nom
1961 1968
2-d 7-a
Foreign Courier Bay 1979
Sir Ivor Courtly Dee
1965 1968
8-g A4
Rafha Bay 1987
Kris Chestnut 1976
Sharpen Up Doubly Sure
1969 1971
5-i 2-o
Eljazzi Bay 1981
Artaius Border Bounty
1974 1965
14-c 7-a
Rose de France Bay 2005
Diktat Brown 1995
Warning Bay 1985
Known Fact Slightly Dangerous
1977 1979
2-f 14-f
Arvola Bay or brown 1990
Sadler's Wells Park Appeal
1981 1982
5-h 14-c
Cherokee Rose Bay 1991
Dancing Brave Bay 1983
Lyphard Navajo Princess
1969 1974
17-b 3-d
Celtic Assembly Bay 1981
Secretariat Welsh Garden
1970 1973
2-s 10-c
Very Choosy (AUS) Chestnut 2012
Choisir Chestnut 1999
Danehill Dancer Bay 1993
Danehill Bay 1986
Danzig Razyana
1977 1981
7-a 2-d
Mira Adonde Bay or brown 1986
Sharpen Up Lettre d'Amour
1969 1979
5-i 22-b
Great Selection Chestnut 1990
Lunchtime Chestnut 1970
Silly Season Great Occasion
1962 1965
1-g 7-f
Pensive Mood Chestnut 1983
Biscay Staid
1965 1968
2-o 8-f
Pedantic Chestnut 2002
Peintre Celebre Chestnut 1994
Nureyev Bay 1977
Northern Dancer Special
1961 1969
2-d 5-h
Peinture Bleue Chestnut 1987
Alydar Petroleuse
1975 1978
9-c 9>
Charming Charge Bay 1995
Rory's Jester Chestnut 1982
Crown Jester Rory's Rocket
1978 1973
13-e 1-m
Captivation Bay 1978
Vain Mere
1966 1965
A10 1-s
Ancestor duplications:
Northern Dancer
5m x 5m
Danzig
4m x 5m
Sharpen Up
5m x 5f
------------- reductio ad absurdum
Posted By: tillyras
Date Posted: 21 Jun 2017 at 3:39pm
Scarlet Billows sold yesterday and will be going to this stallion
Posted By: djebel
Date Posted: 21 Jun 2017 at 4:07pm
Unnamed
Cable Bay (IRE) Bay 2011
Invincible Spirit Bay 1997
Green Desert Bay 1983
Danzig Bay 1977
Northern Dancer Pas de Nom
1961 1968
2-d 7-a
Foreign Courier Bay 1979
Sir Ivor Courtly Dee
1965 1968
8-g A4
Rafha Bay 1987
Kris Chestnut 1976
Sharpen Up Doubly Sure
1969 1971
5-i 2-o
Eljazzi Bay 1981
Artaius Border Bounty
1974 1965
14-c 7-a
Rose de France Bay 2005
Diktat Brown 1995
Warning Bay 1985
Known Fact Slightly Dangerous
1977 1979
2-f 14-f
Arvola Bay or brown 1990
Sadler's Wells Park Appeal
1981 1982
5-h 14-c
Cherokee Rose Bay 1991
Dancing Brave Bay 1983
Lyphard Navajo Princess
1969 1974
17-b 3-d
Celtic Assembly Bay 1981
Secretariat Welsh Garden
1970 1973
2-s 10-c
Scarlet Billows (AUS) Chestnut 2010
Street Boss Chestnut 2004
Street Cry Bay or brown 1998
Machiavellian Bay or brown 1987
Mr Prospector Coup de Folie
1970 1982
13-c 2-d
Helen Street Bay 1982
Troy Waterway
1976 1976
1-b 1-l
Blushing Ogygian Chestnut 1994
Ogygian Bay 1983
Damascus Gonfalon
1964 1975
8-h 16-a
Fruhlingshochzeit Bay or brown 1984
Blushing Groom Fruhlingstag
1974 1975
22-d 1-e
Hushabye Baby Grey 2004
Hussonet Chestnut 1991
Mr Prospector Bay 1970
Raise a Native Gold Digger
1961 1962
8-f 13-c
Sacahuista Bay 1984
Raja Baba Nalees Flying Flag
1968 1975
3-l 9-f
Smytzer's Rivalry Grey 1996
Made of Gold Chestnut 1989
Green Forest Vindaria
1979 1974
8-c 21-a
Contest Grey 1987
Alibhai Blue Waltz
1980 1980
13-a 27>
Ancestor duplications:
Mr Prospector
x 5m,4m
------------- reductio ad absurdum
Posted By: djebel
Date Posted: 21 Jun 2017 at 4:16pm
Unnamed
Cable Bay (IRE) Bay 2011
Invincible Spirit Bay 1997
Green Desert Bay 1983
Danzig Bay 1977
Northern Dancer Pas de Nom
1961 1968
2-d 7-a
Foreign Courier Bay 1979
Sir Ivor Courtly Dee
1965 1968
8-g A4
Rafha Bay 1987
Kris Chestnut 1976
Sharpen Up Doubly Sure
1969 1971
5-i 2-o
Eljazzi Bay 1981
Artaius Border Bounty
1974 1965
14-c 7-a
Rose de France Bay 2005
Diktat Brown 1995
Warning Bay 1985
Known Fact Slightly Dangerous
1977 1979
2-f 14-f
Arvola Bay or brown 1990
Sadler's Wells Park Appeal
1981 1982
5-h 14-c
Cherokee Rose Bay 1991
Dancing Brave Bay 1983
Lyphard Navajo Princess
1969 1974
17-b 3-d
Celtic Assembly Bay 1981
Secretariat Welsh Garden
1970 1973
2-s 10-c
Anaphora (AUS) Chestnut 2011
Dylan Thomas Bay 2003
Danehill Bay 1986
Danzig Bay 1977
Northern Dancer Pas de Nom
1961 1968
2-d 7-a
Razyana Bay 1981
His Majesty Spring Adieu
1968 1974
4-d 2-d
Lagrion Chestnut 1989
Diesis Chestnut 1980
Sharpen Up Doubly Sure
1969 1971
5-i 2-o
Wrap It Up Chestnut 1979
Mount Hagen Doc Nan
1971 1963
1-p 9-c
Power of Love Chestnut 2002
Bahhare Bay 1994
Woodman Chestnut 1983
Mr Prospector Playmate
1970 1975
13-c 1-s
Wasnah Bay 1987
Nijinsky Highest Trump
1967 1972
8-f 13-c
Calm Lover Grey 1993
Spectacular Love Chestnut 1982
Spectacular Bid Gallamar
1976 1967
2-d 8-c
Sooth Grey 1980
Three Legs Tara
1972 1975
13-a 7-d
Ancestor duplications:
Danzig
4m x 4m
Sharpen Up
5m x 5m
Doubly Sure
5m x 5m
------------- reductio ad absurdum
Posted By: djebel
Date Posted: 21 Jun 2017 at 4:21pm
Unnamed
Cable Bay (IRE) Bay 2011
Invincible Spirit Bay 1997
Green Desert Bay 1983
Danzig Bay 1977
Northern Dancer Pas de Nom
1961 1968
2-d 7-a
Foreign Courier Bay 1979
Sir Ivor Courtly Dee
1965 1968
8-g A4
Rafha Bay 1987
Kris Chestnut 1976
Sharpen Up Doubly Sure
1969 1971
5-i 2-o
Eljazzi Bay 1981
Artaius Border Bounty
1974 1965
14-c 7-a
Rose de France Bay 2005
Diktat Brown 1995
Warning Bay 1985
Known Fact Slightly Dangerous
1977 1979
2-f 14-f
Arvola Bay or brown 1990
Sadler's Wells Park Appeal
1981 1982
5-h 14-c
Cherokee Rose Bay 1991
Dancing Brave Bay 1983
Lyphard Navajo Princess
1969 1974
17-b 3-d
Celtic Assembly Bay 1981
Secretariat Welsh Garden
1970 1973
2-s 10-c
Goldsmobile (AUS) Chestnut 2004
Promontory Gold Chestnut 1997
Gone West Bay 1984
Mr Prospector Bay 1970
Raise a Native Gold Digger
1961 1962
8-f 13-c
Secrettame Chestnut 1978
Secretariat Tamerett
1970 1962
2-s 2-f
Possibly Perfect Bay 1990
Northern Baby Bay 1976
Northern Dancer Two Rings
1961 1970
2-d 17-b
Avasand Chestnut 1985
Avatar Sandy Blue
1972 1970
5-g 3-n
Nomadic Bay 1991
Hula Chief Bay 1982
Marceau Bay 1974
Kaoru Star Humour
1965 1962
31> 16-g
Hula Bend Bay 1965
Never Bend Hula Hula
1960 1952
19-b 1-s
Mauritania Bay 1974
The Brianstan Bay 1967
King's Leap Sissi
1959 1953
2-u 13-a
Maurine Bay 1955
Worden Muscida
1949 1938
13-c 1-u
Ancestor duplications:
Northern Dancer
5m x 5m
Secretariat
5f x 5f
------------- reductio ad absurdum
Posted By: Ticino
Date Posted: 21 Jun 2017 at 9:19pm
Hello,
the yet unnamed 'Cable Bay' offspring had an interesting connection. Mauritania, the third dam, her Sire is 'The Brianstan', it sounds a bit far fetch, but he traces via 'Fair Emigrant' (reimported to Europe) to the wellknown Australian Taprootmare Juliet.
regards, Ticino
Posted By: Glencoe
Date Posted: 21 Sep 2018 at 12:08am
From perusing the stud book Cable Bay now has near 30 foals on the ground in Oz
Posted By: Glencoe
Date Posted: 21 Sep 2018 at 12:11am
Fat Finger next post
The 4 photos on Breednet look quite good & there are reports of 2 exceptional types on Merrivale farm at Gooram
Can anyone contribute more information
Posted By: gorrod
Date Posted: 21 Sep 2018 at 6:19pm
Sending two to him this year Flowing Habit and Qalanjo
My reasoning for Flowing Habit
Signs of Blessing(Group 1 winner) in her direct family
Moonlight Cloud (Group 1 winner) Rainbow Quest and Nijinsky in the female family as does Flowing Habit
Yosei (Group1 winner) Sunday Silence and Rainbow Quest in female family as does Flowing Habit.
All are by Invincible Spirit
Qalanjo by Xaar meets a recommended breeding template for Cable Bay.
Can anyone find merit in these selections
Posted By: Glencoe
Date Posted: 23 Sep 2018 at 12:41pm
I find it fascinating that all the people who have opinions on this site don't seem to have an opinion on Cable Bay. WHY???
Posted By: Second Chance
Date Posted: 23 Sep 2018 at 1:29pm
Rick sorted all applications and for the most part only accepted mares that he considered matched well with the sire. Didn't think ours matched and that was confirmed following a chat with him. Mind you he declined to explain his actual reasoning
So only owners who passed his rule of thumb would have foals on the ground, which may have precluded most or all on here.
Posted By: linghi11
Date Posted: 24 Sep 2018 at 1:25am
Second Chance wrote:
Rick sorted all applications and for the most part only accepted mares that he considered matched well with the sire. Didn't think ours matched and that was confirmed following a chat with him. Mind you he declined to explain his actual reasoning
So only owners who passed his rule of thumb would have foals on the ground, which may have precluded most or all on here.
Are they still doing that this year? Picking the mares? What sort of mare did you nominate?
------------- to the victor
Posted By: Second Chance
Date Posted: 24 Sep 2018 at 9:43am
Mare was a city wining stakes-producer. However I didn't think she matched welland basically only put her up to see if Rick was fair dinkum about knocking back mares he didn't think were suitable for Cable Bay.
Posted By: linghi11
Date Posted: 24 Sep 2018 at 11:29am
Thanks SC!
------------- to the victor
Posted By: goldey
Date Posted: 24 Sep 2018 at 11:03pm
By the looks of the mares he had accepted he has certainly done some home work.
Posted By: Glencoe
Date Posted: 25 Sep 2018 at 12:18am
So that still leaves 2 lines of questioning:
1) What lines/nicks is Rick J looking for
and of more interest
2) What lines/nicks do our forumites think will work
e.g. am I right in thinking that mares by Mr P sire sons have worked in Europe
Posted By: Second Chance
Date Posted: 25 Sep 2018 at 9:55am
Just looking at a couple of males.
Invincible Spirit: clearly Mr P, also Sir Gaylord, Lalun, Sadlers, Nijinsky. Two Gp 1 winning sons, from different female families, have siblings Kris and Diesis in the 3rd remove.
I Am Invincible: notably Zabeel/Sir T, clearly Danehill (surprise, surprise), Mr p again, Marscay, Century, Nureyev.
Don't know if that helps all that much.
Posted By: goldey
Date Posted: 25 Sep 2018 at 1:13pm
Yeah second chance is right, and he also is duplicating 7 family via Danzig,Bletchingly and Rockefella via Danehill Dancer in Sharpen Up who also brings in the female line of Mixed Marriage.
Posted By: Glencoe
Date Posted: 26 Sep 2018 at 12:39am
The interesting challenge with this stallion is 3fold
* what do we think Rick J is looking for
* what do we think might work
LOTS of opinions would make for a good discussion
* and then to look back in 2-3 years to see if anything worked
as an aside it will be interesting to see how his yearlings are received at the UK sales over the next few weeks
Posted By: Glencoe
Date Posted: 26 Sep 2018 at 12:45am
My contribution is this:
He has a real chance of succeeding because his pedigree is "balanced', with lots of siblings out to 8 generations so he has a wide range of conquests
Posted By: Second Chance
Date Posted: 04 Oct 2018 at 5:34pm
[QUOTE=Glencoe]
The interesting challenge with this stallion is 3fold
* what do we think Rick J is looking for
* what do we think might work
LOTS of opinions would make for a good discussion
* and then to look back in 2-3 years to see if anything worked
as an aside it will be interesting to see how his yearlings are received at the UK sales over the next few weeks /QUOTE]
Agree Cable Bay has a nicely balanced pedigree.
I reckon Rick's looking to duplicate certain as yet undefined influences. If he sticks to what's worked for Invincible Spirit then Sharpen Up, Sir Gaylord, Sadler's/Fairy King (read Encosta in particular) come into play. If it's nicks then perhaps Mr P and Lalun.
If he's taking I Am Invincible into account then he'd surely be looking for the Sir Tristram/Zabeel nick, daughters of Danehill Dancer, Encosta again, and daughters or grand-daughters of Hussonet.
Mind you that might be well off the mark, however fwiw that's the way I'd tend to be thinking.
9read Encosta in particular)
Posted By: Gay3
Date Posted: 04 Oct 2018 at 6:00pm
I've just watched the racing.com promo on him & to say I'm majorly impressed is an understatement
He's a most magnificent, well balanced, refined stallion with a head to die for & if the foal examples shown, are anything to go by, whatever Rick's doing is working
------------- Wisdom has been chasing me but I've always outrun it!
Posted By: Carioca
Date Posted: 04 Oct 2018 at 8:18pm
Had the mares and foals on Bred to Win the other night, they look strong and healthy with some of them having unusual markings around the muzzle area, a good watch fwiw.
Posted By: kavg
Date Posted: 04 Oct 2018 at 9:01pm
He is related to Volksraad via sire line and tail female line. Volksraad didn't set the world on fire but did OK and seems to be doing Ok as a broodmare sire.
With the relation to Volksraad I wonder what lessons could be learned to improve the stats of Cable Bay.
------------- Prejudice is an emotional attachment to ignorance. DiEM25 for the world.
Posted By: gorrod
Date Posted: 13 Apr 2019 at 2:00pm
2 winners and a 2nd placegetter from first three to race uk and europe
Posted By: Vivarchi
Date Posted: 09 Jun 2019 at 1:53pm
Cable Bay is off to a flyer in Europe. He had his first stakeswinner overnight in England with the filly Liberty Beach staying unbeaten and winning comfortably.
Overall he has now had 7 or 8 2yo winners which is most from any other first season sire. An interesting coincidence is that all winners so far are fillies.
Being by Invincible Spirit augers well for him to go well down here as well.
Posted By: Glencoe
Date Posted: 09 Jun 2019 at 7:01pm
Sorry to possibly disappoint you but Racing Post lists the race as a C2 Conditions Stakes, therefore probably not a Listed. The Filly was a 16GBP buyback by her breeder at Tatts
Having sent a mare to him I have watched his progress closely. Lots of runners, 7 or 8 winners Yes, but fairly low class events.
When the carnivals start June thru to Oct we'll get more of an idea. Winners are one thing. Class is another. Time will tell
Posted By: Second Chance
Date Posted: 09 Jun 2019 at 7:24pm
Spoke to Rick Jamieson a while back, after he'd said he'd only accept mares that "suited his stallion" during its first season. Almost needless to say Rick wouldn't disclose the criteria.
Had a well bred and performed mare that I thought was unsuited to Cable Bay, asked for his opinion, and to his credit he agreed. Looking at mares he's certainly accepted more than a couple who on face value had little going for them, however maybe they ticked one or more of his boxes.
Suspect a Green Desert cross (hopefully not too prominent in the mare) thus Danzig, and particularly Zabeel feature among his desired influences, though I could well be wrong.
All of which doesn't really suggest whether this fellow will succeed or otherwise down-under.
Posted By: Vivarchi
Date Posted: 09 Jun 2019 at 11:28pm
Glencoe wrote:
Sorry to possibly disappoint you but Racing Post lists the race as a C2 Conditions Stakes, therefore probably not a Listed. The Filly was a 16GBP buyback by her breeder at Tatts
Having sent a mare to him I have watched his progress closely. Lots of runners, 7 or 8 winners Yes, but fairly low class events.
When the carnivals start June thru to Oct we'll get more of an idea. Winners are one thing. Class is another. Time will tell
Yeah you're right. Apparently not a Stakes race. I'm sure Arion had it as a Listed race pre-race but they've just put the results up as a non stakes result.
Ah well, regardless , it does seem like it was a regarded race and it did carry early stakeslike prizemoney of 40k pounds.
Like you i have a mare in foal to Cable Bay and am following him with interest. They have passed the initial hurdle of being good runners. Now to see how much class they carry.
Here;s a small article and a video of the race saying they are looking to take that filly to Ascot.
Posted By: Glencoe
Date Posted: 10 Jun 2019 at 3:24pm
interestingly the second dam is by Elusive quality. Rick regards E.Q. as a huge plus in a Cable Bay mating
Posted By: gorrod
Date Posted: 12 Jun 2019 at 6:23pm
The Queen has a Cable Bay running at Yarmouth tonight Otago the name and in the betting
Posted By: Second Chance
Date Posted: 12 Jun 2019 at 6:57pm
Presumably Otago as in NZ.
If the colt wins there'll presumably be sauvignon blank with the Royal monkfish with herb and garlic butter that evening.
Posted By: Glencoe
Date Posted: 13 Jun 2019 at 10:48pm
Has 2 noms in the Coventry Stks Ascot tuesday
Posted By: Glencoe
Date Posted: 19 Jun 2019 at 7:37pm
Very good run by the 100/1 shot Ropey Guest .Ran sixth ,should have finished 4th. Seems to be Listed class at least.
will be interesting to see how the 2 fillies who are much more fancied go tonite.
Posted By: gonski gonski
Date Posted: 20 Jun 2019 at 12:12am
How did they go?
Posted By: Vivarchi
Date Posted: 20 Jun 2019 at 1:44am
Vivarchi wrote:
Glencoe wrote:
Sorry to possibly disappoint you but Racing Post lists the race as a C2 Conditions Stakes, therefore probably not a Listed. The Filly was a 16GBP buyback by her breeder at Tatts
Having sent a mare to him I have watched his progress closely. Lots of runners, 7 or 8 winners Yes, but fairly low class events.
When the carnivals start June thru to Oct we'll get more of an idea. Winners are one thing. Class is another. Time will tell
Yeah you're right. Apparently not a Stakes race. I'm sure Arion had it as a Listed race pre-race but they've just put the results up as a non stakes result.
Ah well, regardless , it does seem like it was a regarded race and it did carry early stakeslike prizemoney of 40k pounds.
Like you i have a mare in foal to Cable Bay and am following him with interest. They have passed the initial hurdle of being good runners. Now to see how much class they carry.
Here;s a small article and a video of the race saying they are looking to take that filly to Ascot.
A shame this filly drew the wrong side of the straight track in the Gr2 Queen Mary just now. Ran 4th, clearly winning the flat division with the placegetters and the bulk of the field coming down the grandstand side.
Was fancied in the betting too. 33's into 16's at the jump.
That's a terrific close 6th coming from last of 17 in the Coventry and a very stiff 4th of 23 in the Queen Mary for Cable Bay fillies.
He may be the real deal.
Posted By: Glencoe
Date Posted: 20 Jun 2019 at 12:05pm
3 runners last night. A very impressive 4th. a fair 7th & a disappointing 18th.
So we can deduce that Cable Bay has 2 runners who should at a minimum win a listed event. One more runner on Friday in the Jersey stakes. The Curragh carnival will tell us more
Interestingly only covered 56 mares in UK in 2018. Figures not out yet for 2019 season but doubt it will improve based on his European sales results.
Of course all of the above will have no impact on the outcomes in OZ..It is merely an indicator. With a selective mating program a bright future may await
Posted By: Vivarchi
Date Posted: 23 Jun 2019 at 2:23am
An interesting thing about Cable Bay is that both he and Kingman are by Invincible Spirit and both have Dancing Brave as the sire of their grand dam.
Kingman is hot hot hot in Europe, taking all before him in his 2nd year.
I remember hearing Rick Jamieson being asked why it was that he was so keen on Cable Bay, and he said while he would rather keep that to himself, the key was Dancing Brave.
Posted By: Ticino
Date Posted: 23 Jun 2019 at 12:10pm
Hello,
sometimes it's a small world.
Cable Bay has a 2 year old filliy running in Italy (bred in England), her name is Visayas (Cable Bay-Palais Polaire by Polar Falcon), she ran a 3. 'Premio Alessandro Perrone', Listed Race and won 2 smaller races.).
Regards, Ticino
Posted By: Second Chance
Date Posted: 23 Jun 2019 at 12:16pm
Thanks Ticino. Just looked her up.
4 Starts. 2-1-1 $AUS28,596 in Italy.
Placing
Date
Course
Race
Name
1 of 6
12-Apr-2019
Roma
Premio
Amur
1 of 6
10-May-2019
Roma
Premio
Polar Prince
3 of 10
19-May-2019
Roma
Premio
Alessandro Perrone [Listed]
2 of 6
29-May-2019
Milano
Premio
Dell'Avvenire
Posted By: Ticino
Date Posted: 24 Jun 2019 at 9:54am
Hello, Second Chance,
thanks for the "update". I got the info about Visaya I read in our Racing Paper "Sportwelt".
Just to make things even more stunning, her HB Power Jack won his "maiden race" in Germany (Düsseldorf, 15.6.19, Handicap Class D, 1400 meter). His Sire is Sepoy, another familiar Name in AUS.
regards, Ticino
Posted By: Vivarchi
Date Posted: 06 Jul 2019 at 1:31am
Liberty Beach, the Cable Bay filly that could have won the Queen Mary at Ascot last month just blew them away in a Listed race at the big Sandown meeting.
3 wins from 4 starts for her. She savages the line.
Posted By: Glencoe
Date Posted: 06 Jul 2019 at 12:02pm
Impressive to watch. Not a strong field but she may be up to Gr3 class
Posted By: oldflight
Date Posted: 06 Jul 2019 at 6:26pm
Will be interesting to see his fertility stats in the Stud Book at end of reporting season.
I am not suggesting anything untoward just that I will be interested thats all
Posted By: oldflight
Date Posted: 29 Jul 2019 at 1:51pm
The Plot thickens
The availability of shuttle stallion Cable Bay in Australia this coming stud season is in dispute.
The eight-year-old was scheduled to fly to Australia to prepare for
the 2019 Australian stud season at Woodside Park Stud in Victoria where
he is advertised at $13,200.
However, Highclere Stud in the UK successfully obtained an injunction
from the British High Court last week preventing Cable Bay from
leaving, citing an injury concern whilst in quarantine.
The court order will be reviewed on August 8 which, if overturned,
will allow the stallion to be on a flight on August 17 with the
Australian stud season commencing September 1.
Cable Bay stands at Highclere Stud in the UK and has shuttled to
Woodside Park Stud for the past two years where he has covered 219 mares
with 63 live foals.
From his first crop runners in Europe Cable Bay has sired 13 winners to date, headed by the Listed winning filly Liberty Beach.
Posted By: Vivarchi
Date Posted: 08 Aug 2019 at 7:16pm
Cable Bay is now returning this year to Australia. Good news.
His filly Liberty Beach was again super impressive the other night. She is apparently going to the Gp1 Prix Morny next start and the trainer then wants to go to The Breeders Cup juvenile after that. The owner however isn't so sure and may prefer coming back after France to the Gp1 Cheveley back in England.
Cable Bay will be on the Aug 15 flight to Oz with whatever the issue actually was now resolved.
Posted By: Glencoe
Date Posted: 08 Aug 2019 at 11:06pm
But will leave on Nov 13
Posted By: djebel
Date Posted: 08 Aug 2019 at 11:10pm
What is the reasoning behind that ?
------------- reductio ad absurdum
Posted By: Majestic
Date Posted: 08 Aug 2019 at 11:20pm
Compromise????????
Posted By: Red Hare
Date Posted: 09 Aug 2019 at 12:26pm
Probably only took 50-odd bookings.... or selected that many suitable entries from the hundreds that applied, as the story is more likely to be told.
Might also be the case that early foals are better for the business of marketing a stallion with zero runners on track, so Nov/Dec covers are akin to a pump & dump.
Posted By: gonski gonski
Date Posted: 10 Aug 2019 at 11:17pm
Crazy theory.
Posted By: Vivarchi
Date Posted: 11 Aug 2019 at 3:38am
A nice colt Tomfre just brought up his hat trick at Newmarket to make it 3 wins from 4.
Cable Bay is making his mark over there and his progeny should suit out here too i would think. Precocious, speedy, strong, honest and decent amount of class.
Posted By: Ticino
Date Posted: 14 Aug 2019 at 9:26pm
Hello,
maybe you are interested to read. In the lastest German Thoroughbredbreedersmagazine "Vollblut" are several Stallion statistics. According their listings "Cable Bay" (Current Season, in Europe in order of Prizemoney. These statistics relate to Flat racing in Great Britain & Ireland, France, Germany and Italy) is thirdplaced in the catagory "Leading Sires of First Crop" with 36 runners, 13 winners, 19 races won, 1 stakes winner, Engl. Pound 196.013 Money won.
Best regards, Ticino
Posted By: oldflight
Date Posted: 15 Aug 2019 at 6:44pm
My guess is as already mentioned above, compromise and management of Fertility.
Missing a whole season can stall a stallions progression greatly.
Posted By: acacia alba
Date Posted: 16 Aug 2019 at 12:51pm
219 covered and 63 live foals ? Risky for the mare owner ?
------------- animals before people.
Posted By: VSP.
Date Posted: 16 Aug 2019 at 1:47pm
acacia alba wrote:
219 covered and 63 live foals ? Risky for the mare owner ?
There are another 97 mare returns yet to come in for this foaling season - the majority of which should result in foals as most empty mares are already returned by now. So that should end up approx 75% fertility which is probably the low end of normal.
------------- www.snowshoecats.webs.com
Posted By: Glencoe
Date Posted: 17 Aug 2019 at 9:53pm
In Oz 63 live foals from 100 mares covered in 2017. Reasonable to expect approx. 75+ live foals to arrive in 2019 in Oz from 119 2018 covers.
Posted By: Glencoe
Date Posted: 29 Aug 2019 at 11:54am
Have British breeders missed the boat.
Cable Bay covered only 56 mares in U.K. in 2018 and an unbelievably low 30 in 2019. Admittedly it was easy to run scared based on the sales results of his second crop yearling sales.
Now that he has runners and is leading first season sire lists in Europe things have changed
At the Goffs Premier sale over the past 2 days 5 colts & fillies have an average & median of approx. $150K Aus. It will be interesting to see how the 3 entries in the silver sale fare tonight
By the way it appears some of Rick Jamiesons patterns work. Now the question remains. Will those same patterns work in Australia? The outcome will be interesting & also interesting to see as it evolves
Posted By: Ticino
Date Posted: 01 Sep 2019 at 12:20am
Hello,
maybe it's old News for you.
According your racing paper "Sportwelt" (Issue Tuesday, 27.8.19)
Liberty Beach (Cable Bay-Flirtatinaskirt by Avonbridge) ran second in the "Sky Bet Lowther Stakes,
1200 meter, Group 2, York, 22.8.19. Breeder: Philipp Wilkins, Trainer: J. Ouinn, Jockey: J. Hart
Ropey Guest (Cable Bay-Hadeeya by Oratorio) ran third in the "Tattersalls Acomb Stakes",
1400 meter, Group 3, York, 21.8.19. Breeder: Mrs. S. Hamilton & Kirtlington Stud Ltd, Trainer:
G. Margarson, Jockey: T. Queally
regards, Ticino
Posted By: Vivarchi
Date Posted: 14 Sep 2019 at 5:55pm
Cable Bay looks a near certainty to be the champion 1st season sire in Europe now. His colt King's Lynn just won a 300K Pound sales race on Thursday at the Doncaster Carnival. Terrific performance by Cable Bay as he served a low grade book of mares. Shades of I Am Invincible maybe. Invincible Spirit has now got I Am Invincible and Kingman who are out and out gun sires. And now Cable Bay looking the goods.
It was a very nice win from King's Lynn in a field of 20 at only his 2nd start. There were some nice stakes performers behind him.
Posted By: Second Chance
Date Posted: 14 Sep 2019 at 6:28pm
Interestingly Night Of Thunder will almost certainly finish 2nd on the UK first season sire list.
He stood just one season in Oz and wasn't really wanted.
Posted By: Progold
Date Posted: 14 Sep 2019 at 7:25pm
Statistics may suggest that first season success in the UK are not a great indicator of likely success here.
Posted By: Second Chance
Date Posted: 14 Sep 2019 at 7:36pm
Thanks for telling us something most around here are well aware of.
Though the I Am invincible/Invincible Spirit success down-under does provide some justification for optimism regarding Cable Bay.
ps just threw the Dubawi fellow in for interest.
Posted By: Glencoe
Date Posted: 14 Sep 2019 at 8:48pm
Two comments:
He is upgrading mares
The better runners have identified breeding patterns
Those two things alone are good signs. Does it cross hemispheres? time will tell
Posted By: Vivarchi
Date Posted: 25 Sep 2019 at 5:03pm
Cable Bay train keeps choofing along. 4 wins and a 2nd from last seven runners.
He's not only a clear leader on the European first season sire list, he is a clear leader on the overall UK leading 2yo sire list. All from a very average broodmare band and not many in the better stables.
Posted By: linghi11
Date Posted: 03 Oct 2019 at 2:41pm
Glencoe wrote:
Two comments:He is upgrading mares The better runners have identified breeding patterns Those two things alone are good signs. Does it cross hemispheres? time will tell
Could you please elaborate on the patterns? I don’t closely follow the racing over there
linghi I've posed the question on each of the queried stallions' threads
------------- to the victor
Posted By: Ticino
Date Posted: 16 Oct 2019 at 11:38pm
Hello,
'Cable Bay' hat some more placed offspring in Europe
Ropey Guest (Cable Bay-Hadeeya by Oratorio) ran third in the "Dubai Autumn Stakes",
1600 meter, Group 3, Newmarket, 12.10.19. Breeder: Mrs. S. Hamilton & Kirtlington Stud Ltd, Trainer: G. Margarson, Jockey: S. Kelly
Jouska (Cable Bay-Quiet Protest by Kingmambo) ran third in the "Cornwallis Stakes",
1000 meter, Group 3, Newmarket, 11.10.19, Breeder: Equity Growth Partners Ltd, Trainer: H. Candy, Jockey: S. Foley
regards, Ticino
Posted By: Vivarchi
Date Posted: 17 Jun 2020 at 3:37am
Vivarchi wrote:
Liberty Beach, the Cable Bay filly that could have won the Queen Mary at Ascot last month just blew them away in a Listed race at the big Sandown meeting.
3 wins from 4 starts for her. She savages the line.
This 3yo filly just ran a super 3rd in the Gp1 Kings Stand against the older sprinters at Ascot. She chased in vain Battaash all the way and got pipped by a late finisher on the line for 2nd. She's a ripper.
For perspective, Battaash is apparently the highest rated horse in the world at 136.
Liberty Beach is a great banner horse for Cable Bay. A lowly priced filly and matching it with the best in her short career. Great to see her improving from a top class 2yo into a better 3yo.
Posted By: Gay3
Date Posted: 12 Jul 2020 at 1:13pm
G1 July Cup Winner Features Familiar Bloodlines
Tara Madgwick - Saturday July 11
The
Group I Darley July Cup (5f) was run overnight at Newmarket with the
winner Oxsted giving another sire son of Invincible Spirit in Mayson his
first Group I winner, whilst also highlighting the merit of his dam
sire Choisir.
A progressive four year-old gelding trained by Roger Teal, Oxsted won
the Group III Abernant Stakes over the same course and distance in early
June with connections electing to bypass Royal Ascot and focus on this
race with happy results.
Ridden by Cieren Fallon, Oxsted relished the drying conditions to forge
clear and win by a length and a quarter clocking a time just 0.28sec
outside the course record.
He gave both his trainer and jockey their first Group I winner.
It's unbelievable. Harry [Teal's son] has done a fantastic job - he
said last week that Oxsted would win the July Cup. We believed, although
we knew what we were up against. Cieren rode a peach, he's such a cool
little dude, said Roger Teal.
Retained to race by his breeders, Oxsted has the overall record of four
wins and two placings from nine starts and is the first Group I winner
for his sire Mayson, who won the July Cup in 2012.
Mayson is the sire of Oxsted
Mayson stands at Cheveley Park at a fee of 5,000 pounds.
Oxtsed is the best of two winners from the handy four time winning
Choisir mare Charlotte Rosina, whose immediate family is barren of Black
Type.
Interestingly for Australian breeders, Choisir mares have a good record
with sons of Invincible Spirit, that nick producing 14 winners from 20
runners including four stakes-winners with Oxsted the first Group I
winner and Australian bred Eckstein, a Group III winner that was second
in the Group I VRC Myer Classic.
Thats certainly food for thought this season given the plentiful supply
of Choisir mares and the choice of no fewer than seven sons of
Invincible Spirit at stud here this spring.
------------- Wisdom has been chasing me but I've always outrun it!
Posted By: furious
Date Posted: 12 Jul 2020 at 6:14pm
Choisir and Redoute's have a similar mix of blood and both lines go well with Invincible Spirit. Also while the female line has been quiet it does go back to Hyperion's 3rd dam Gondolette herself the dam of two classic winners as well as a winner of the Dewhurst S. So you couldn't see a family like that not crossing to something like Choisir with all his lines of Selene. And then shock horror the stallion Mayson is also of that female line. It doesn't always work but if it does you usually get a very good one. He just push the anti up again.
So the way I look at this horse Oxted is the female line and the male line and the damsire where a very good mix. But first and foremost it was that female line finding what it needed. So while I'd say Choisir and Invincible Spirit blood probably mixes well don't overlook the female line in the mating.
On a side line I've sometimes found horses winning by Australian breed sires and have checked the mares other produce. Often just to see what class of mare our stallions a serving in Europe. The number of mares with say four foals and the Aussie stallion has produced the only winner is quite strong. It's almost like they are sending all the also rans to see if they can introduce a bit of speed into the mix.
Posted By: Mr Prospector
Date Posted: 13 Jul 2020 at 9:48am
Invincible Spirit is standing at the Irish national stud at a quoted fee of 100k .
Mayson , the sire of Oxted is standing Cheveley Park Stud (UK) at a fee of 5k . That looks like incredible value for a good sprinting son of Invincible Spirit with the 5k = to about $9k aud .
------------- There are three types of lies - Lies ,Damn Lies and Statistics
Posted By: kavg
Date Posted: 13 Jul 2020 at 4:09pm
You are almost certainly 100% correct Furious.
Whilst there seems to be a valid reason that Inv Spirit crosses well with Choisir such as Inv Sp and Danehill Dancer both being Danzig/Sharpen Up, there may be something else at play.
You pointed out Oxted lines of Selene. If we look at best stakeswinner from I Am Invincible/Choisir being Eckstein you see Eckstein tail female is Jesmond Lass who is dam of IAI damsire Canny Lad. And also the great grand dam sire of Eckstein is Sir Tristram who of course hails from Selene family.
------------- Prejudice is an emotional attachment to ignorance. DiEM25 for the world.
Posted By: Glencoe
Date Posted: 15 Jul 2020 at 12:00am
I'm not sure that Cable Bay has had a 2YO wnr in Europe this year
Posted By: Grey Affair
Date Posted: 15 Jul 2020 at 12:30am
Live On Stage in Italy
Posted By: Glencoe
Date Posted: 15 Jul 2020 at 8:26pm
Is that really all? If so very different to last year
Posted By: Second Chance
Date Posted: 15 Jul 2020 at 8:31pm
One winner from seven or so starters. But early doors.
Posted By: Glencoe
Date Posted: 17 Jul 2020 at 12:48am
Jouska & Tomfre in Gr3 races Sun night at York
Posted By: Vivarchi
Date Posted: 04 Aug 2020 at 9:38pm
He had his first 2nd crop 2yo winner last night. Minor race but won very impressively by 4L.
Atalis Bay i think was the name. Looks a nice colt.
Posted By: Grey Affair
Date Posted: 11 Oct 2020 at 3:24am
Jouska (3f Cable Bay x Quiet Protest, by Kingmambo) has won the LR Boadicea Stakes over 6 furlongs at Newmarket.
Posted By: Ticino
Date Posted: 17 Mar 2021 at 9:37pm
Hello,
maybe youlike to read, Cable Bay has a 2021 foal in Germany.
A Filly Cable Bay - Dyveke by Lando - Daytona Beach, foaled 08.03.21, bred by "Wiesengrund Stud".
regards, Ticino
Posted By: djebel
Date Posted: 03 May 2021 at 7:56pm
Cable Bay's Dragon Symbol A New Rising Star
Sunday, May 2, 2021 at 3:37 pm | Back to: https://www.thoroughbreddailynews.com/category/europe/" rel="nofollow - Europe , https://www.thoroughbreddailynews.com/category/shared-news-europe/" rel="nofollow - Shared News Europe
Updated: May 2, 2021 at 6:51 pm
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Cable Bay | Asuncion Pineyrua
By Tom Frary
Unbeaten on the all-weather with three wins at Wolverhampton, Newcastle and Kempton coming by a combined margin of 12 1/2 lengths since the start of March, Yoshiro Kubota's Dragon Symbol (GB) (Cable Bay {GB}) made his first turf start an impressive one to earn TDN Rising Star status at Hamilton on Sunday. Sent off the 11-8 favourite to transform that prowess to the grass in the valuable MansionBet Best Odds Guaranteed EBF Tangerine Trees Conditions S., the Archie Watson-trained grey raced keenly tracking the early pace dropping back to five furlongs for the first time. In front passing the two-furlong pole, the grey did his familiar thing and went clear from there to register a 3 1/4-length verdict over the solid yardstick Significantly (GB) (Garswood {GB}). Jockey Adam McNamara was impressed. He travelled really well considering five is probably a bit sharp for him, he said of sire Cable Bay's first 'TDN Rising Star'. I don't think he's ever galloped on grass at home, but Archie's horses are so straightforward it doesn't matter. He's in the [June 15] G1 King's Stand [at Royal Ascot] and I'm not sure where he'll go, but I'd hazard a guess and say he's more likely to go to the [G1] Commonwealth [Cup at Royal Ascot June 18]. He keeps improving somehow and is a very good one. I got a lead, as he was a little bit keen in front for Oisin [Murphy] the last day and he travelled beautifully. I galloped him a couple of months ago and said to Archie he could be an 85 horse, but he keeps finding and he looks a very good one. He's going to win a big one very soon, hopefully. It's not every day you get to ride one like that. The winner is the first foal out of a half-sister to the listed-winning duo Smart Enough (GB) (Cadeaux Genereux {GB}) and Oasis Dancer (GB) ( https://bit.ly/2Yiu7qQ" rel="nofollow - Oasis Dream {GB}) whose dam is the G1 Prix Saint-Alary third Good Enough (Fr) (Mukaddamah). She is also the second dam of the recent Listed Sean Barrett Bloodstock S. winner Laugh a Minute (GB) (Mayson {GB}), who was also placed in the G3 Prix de Meautry and G3 Chipchase S., and this stable's Endless Joy (GB) (Showcasing {GB}) who was third in the G3 Firth of Clyde S. The dam, who also hails from the family of the G1 Cheveley Park S. heroine Seazun (Ire) (Zieten), has a 2-year-old filly by Postponed (Ire) and a yearling colt by Adaay (Ire).
3rd-Hamilton, 35,000, Cond, 5-2, 3yo, 5f 7yT, :59.04, g/f. DRAGON SYMBOL (GB), c, 3, by Cable Bay (Ire) 1st Dam: Arcamist (GB), by Arcano (Ire) 2nd Dam: Good Enough (Fr), by Mukaddamah 3rd Dam: Viceroy Princess (GB), by Godswalk Sales history: 67,000gns Ylg '19 TAOCT. Lifetime Record: 4-4-0-0, $40,456. O-Yoshiro Kubota; B-Whitsbury Manor Stud (GB); T-Archie Watson. Click for the https://www.racingpost.com/results/22/hamilton/2021-05-02/781407" rel="nofollow - Racing Post result or the http://www.equineline.com/tdn/pedigree.cfm?tk=HAM&cy=ENG&rd=05/02/2021&rn=3&de=D&ref=10480118&pid=4134" rel="nofollow - free Equineline.com catalogue-style pedigree .
------------- reductio ad absurdum
Posted By: Grey Affair
Date Posted: 13 Aug 2022 at 6:02pm
Cable Bay looks to have sired a good one in Uncommon James (4g Cable Bay x Pickabee, by Jet Spur). He just won the Listed Regal Roller Stakes at Caulfield in an impressive manner.
Posted By: Second Chance
Date Posted: 13 Aug 2022 at 6:24pm
Too little too late unfortunately GA. He's clearly doing better in the NH than here.
Posted By: oldflight
Date Posted: 02 Mar 2023 at 2:14pm
Well Uncommon James wins a Gr1 and India goes crazy,
Cable Bay now standing at Kehar Singh Stud Farm in Punjab
Now that the dust has settled and the horse has been Relocated does the Group here have any opinions either way on the way the Horse was marketed, I mean via the if your mare fits our Breeding Plan / Formula you can come to this stallion.
I know he covered 100/120 mares and in 2020 had the COV19 drop to 80 and they would have got out square or a bit in front.
But from my experience many of a Stallions early crop winners come from many and varied bloodlines and families that you would never expect.
When I was much younger, working on a Farm in WA we had a
cracking Mill Reef Stallion called Marooned, his first good horse was a filly
called Prime Again, She was by Sanhedrin Bread and Butter sire in WA (placed in
Seattle Slews Kentucky Derby) who was by
Good Counsel.
Prime Again’s Dam was by the champ NZ sire So Big and the second
Dam was by the unbelievable Faux Tirage. Nobody was saying this was going to
work to a Mill reef horse.
The farm thought so little of the mare that after foaling
down Prime Again and she was a scruffy foal they sold the mare on.
So what in a round about way I am trying to show, is why
knock back people with good mares that may or may not be the making of your
stallion, you can also never underestimate the environmental factors and
feeding in-uterine that can assist in establishing a good athlete, as said by
people much smarter than me, they can come from anywhere.
As we know people love there mares and being told your mare is not good enough, was a bit rich for some people who are of a thinner skin than mine, I really think this has made it hard for Woodside to get some of the mares in that Bracket back to their Farm.
I know Dod's is doing his best but it is a struggle. And yes I know the horse only stood there on agreement.
I did not mean for it to go longer than Diatribes Caufield Cup.
But thats my take on it
Ciao For Now Old Flight
Posted By: Carioca
Date Posted: 02 Mar 2023 at 2:39pm
I'll never forget Barts saying Oldflight , " half the breeding , is in the feeding " . makes sense , but a wise old owl was he .
Posted By: Second Chance
Date Posted: 02 Mar 2023 at 2:50pm
Jamieson took a risk knocking back mares because they didn't fit his breeding theories and the horse failed. Whether he would haver failed irrespective is a moot point, however common sense suggests if you give a stallion more opportunity....
Posted By: ribot90
Date Posted: 30 Apr 2023 at 8:56pm
well I have a lovely filly yearling by Cable Bay out of a Sea The Moon mare also a colt foal also great.
you are right good food - a then a trainer which is key - I remember a relative of mine who was good friends with Frank Butters and he said 'anyone can train horses less than 10% know what they are doing' that is probably true. The word 'great' trainers is often misused.
------------- all horses can win
Posted By: Gay3
Date Posted: 30 Apr 2023 at 9:22pm
Let's not forgot the breaker/starter who can literally make or break them. There are still far too many 'cowboys' being given the job because they're cheap or just down the road, by unknowledgeable, cheapskate owners Best of luck with your 2 Ribot, I've noticed a few more winners popping up for him here
------------- Wisdom has been chasing me but I've always outrun it!
Posted By: oldflight
Date Posted: 01 May 2023 at 2:17pm
Hi All,
Just to be clear I was not knocking the Horse's ability to generate winners just that the way the horse was marketed in Australia narrowed his chances.
Ribot90 I wish you all the luck in the world please keep us posted on the progress of your two.
Ciao for Now Oldflight
Posted By: ribot90
Date Posted: 01 May 2023 at 9:10pm
hello Oldflight I think you are right about marketing - I think he has done ok down in Australia and typical as they sell him to stand in India he gets group 1 winner. The number of horses this happens to is alot - from Hornbeam to Duke of Marmalade.
Just looking around at trainers for her - her mum was trained by Charlie Fellowes so will have a chat with him, the grand dam I who is by Dansili I had with Henry Cecil and I still have the great grand dam by Shareef Dancer out of Troy mare 28 and still the boss
Ribot90 aka Paul
------------- all horses can win
Posted By: ribot90
Date Posted: 01 May 2023 at 9:13pm
thanks Gay3
I think I could write a book on some of the trainers haha - her mum was trained by Charlie Fellowes and he was good so will talk to him.. i've keep you posted