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Inbreeding to dominant racemares

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furious View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote furious Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Sep 2017 at 7:43am
Special being the dam of Nureyev?  Or the Special that was an Australian G1 winner?

It the first you can find plenty of Fairy Bridge/Nureyev crosses as above Dundeel being one of them.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote kavg Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Sep 2017 at 11:58am
Originally posted by Majestic Majestic wrote:

Can someone give me an idea re doubling, tripling up on Special. Unfortunately, War is not an option with my partner in the HC mare.

Majestic,
if you have a HC mare then you don't want to go to another sadlers wells stallion. You may as well try Testa Rossa-apparently those that saw him at stallion parade on this forum reported he looked like a youngster.

To get the cross of Special then any thing with Fairy Bridge which includes Perugino Sadlers and Fairy King. But you also get it via Nureyev, so any stallion with Zabeel, Stravinsky etc will give you a cross. 

For what it is worth my suggestion would be Hallowed Crown. Showed good qualities as a racehorse;has stree6t cry which I feel will work well with HC; has danehill which works well with sadlers and is from the female family of Zabeel (ie his dam Lady Giselle is great granddam of Hallowed) and HC and Zabeel works very well and it gives you a doubling of Special.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Muddy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Dec 2017 at 8:14am
Originally posted by furious furious wrote:

Would of been nice if Meurice hadn't of died to see if he would of crossed with mares with Rubiton or Euclase in the pedigree.  Breeding back to Ruby.<div id="UMS_TOOLTIP" style=": ; cursor: pointer; : 2147483647; : transparent; top: -100000px; left: -100000px;">


Agree 100%. He was a highly spruiked horse with freakish ability. I am thinking along the same lines and tempted to send a Rubiton mare to Ready For Victory to duplicate Ruby. She is one of the most influential mares of more a colonial line. I think Stewart Ramsey’s breeding formula is based on something like we are discussing. He’s been very successful
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote linghi11 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Dec 2017 at 5:37pm
Does anyone have a list of these influential broodmares? Of care to make one up :)
to the victor
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Breeder Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Dec 2017 at 6:26pm
Try Googling Blue Hen mares.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shrunk in the Wash Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Dec 2017 at 8:48am
Originally posted by linghi11 linghi11 wrote:

Does anyone have a list of these influential broodmares? Of care to make one up :)

Im no expert but I'll throw up a few
Four Carat
Shanthas Choice
Hot Rhythm
Circles of Gold

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote goldey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Dec 2017 at 8:57am
Thong seems to be going well in our conditions.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Glencoe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Dec 2017 at 5:54pm
Colin Hayes always looked for Aurora
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote furious Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Dec 2017 at 5:58pm
Some of the best Luskin Star's had double cross to Aurora
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Dec 2017 at 6:20pm

Book Shop

Inbreeding to Superior Females $250


STRIKE WHILST THE IRON IS HOT

reductio ad absurdum

The richest man is not he who has the most, but he who needs the least.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Dec 2017 at 6:21pm
How on earth do they justify that price ?

I have the book, It was given to me for nothing.

It is like reading a kindergarten book. 


STRIKE WHILST THE IRON IS HOT

reductio ad absurdum

The richest man is not he who has the most, but he who needs the least.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote linghi11 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Dec 2017 at 8:17am
Originally posted by djebel djebel wrote:

How on earth do they justify that price ?

I have the book, It was given to me for nothing.

It is like reading a kindergarten book. 


Thoroughbred stuff has a wedding-like mark up for everything!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote linghi11 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Dec 2017 at 8:19am
From what I hear, the genetics study is finding that outcrossing thoroughbreds is more successful than inbreeding them, so one must have to find some very particular lines for it to work well.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote furious Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Dec 2017 at 8:33am
linghi often the outcrossing is really finding the lines like Bletchingly and Danzig which don't cross till Lady Susan (GB) 1893.  So no close inbreeding but there is no doubt that those two - from the same female line liked each other very much.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote Mr Prospector Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Dec 2017 at 11:17am

The thoroughbred broodmare book

Author:Clive Harper
Publisher:Derby, KS : Matter of Record, ©2003.
Edition/Format:  Print book : English
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The Thoroughbred Broodmare Book by Clive Harper 

If you can get a copy of this its worth a read , he discusses the pedigree paterns in detail of top Broodmares that have produced multiple G1 winners in various regions of the world . 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Breeder Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Dec 2017 at 12:25pm
Agree on the Clive Harper book. I have it and it's strength is it gives all the points that are common with the mare's successful offspring allowing you to form your own conclusions even if you don't agree with author.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Mr Prospector Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Dec 2017 at 12:37pm
Its not overly verbose as some of the breeding books can be and very easy to follow his explanations with the pedigrees laid out beside his ideas . 

Its the only one of the Harper books I have but would love a copy of his last book . Patterns of patterns I think its called . 
 Have you read it Breeder  and if so is it worth chasing a copy ? 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Breeder Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Dec 2017 at 3:49pm
Yes i have read it Mr Prosoector ( I think have all of Clive's books) It is of the same quality as the others so well worth getting if you can find a copy.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Paul Hogan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Dec 2017 at 4:19pm
Fake News!

Get a broodmare cross her with a basic well known cross i.e. Lonhro x Danehill etc, etc and hope for the best.

It's a DNA lottery.
Jim
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote furious Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Mar 2018 at 1:01pm
Would love to see Bella Martini visit Written By when they both go to stud.  Both decend from Humour dam of four stakes winners of 18 races inc Marceau (Rawson S (twice), Doomben Cup etc), Zasu (Queensland Oaks, Champagne S, SAJC Sires' Prod), Runyon (Perth Cup) and Joy Love (Expressway S).  So you can also see the distances which her stakes winning progeny won over was from 1000 to 3200m.  She was a great mare and it is lovely to see her line still firing.

I've been following Bella Martini's dam Silverbeat's foals out of the yearling sales for years and she also has four stakes winners including one in Macau (a MacG1 which isn't listed on the Australian Stud book site).  Bella Martini could be her best and yes I marked her to follow although she was withdrawn!  The others two I had in Volcanic Ash (Volcanic General in Australia) and Alpha Beat were both geldings and I wanted a filly to follow.

This is also the family of Pins who was out of a daughter of Humour who also produced 4 stakes winners.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote furious Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Mar 2018 at 1:15pm
Volcanic Ash was a MalG1 winner twice not Macau.  Got the wrong country!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Breeder Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jun 2018 at 8:12am
The Derby result overnight was a good result for who following line breeding to top mares.
Masar is line bred to Urban Sea
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote furious Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jun 2018 at 8:18am
You can't get a much better mare than that one breeder.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ticino Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jun 2018 at 8:33am
Hello,
Masar, the winner of the English Derby is another success of the Family of Alveole, which has produced 0714 (!) German Derbywinners since 1914 (Ariel) and in 2007 Adlerflug (4x4 Mill Reef, Granddam Alya FS of Allegretta)
 
Of course I noted the the inbreeding to Urban Sea 3x4 and Ahonoora 3x4, something you don't see
so often. Btw, there is one more 'hidden' German Sire in his ped, Selkirk-Nebbiolo-Birkhahn (he carries Spion Kop via Cappiello)-Alchimist.
 
regards, Ticino
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lulu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jun 2018 at 11:47am
Hi Ticino,

I would be interested on your opinion of a mating of Churchill over a Kings Best mare. Doubling up on Allegretta. A lovely mare from your neck of the woods.

Cheers
You're either Einstein or Frankenstein in this game.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Isaac soloman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Jun 2018 at 10:18am
Originally posted by Breeder Breeder wrote:

The Derby result overnight was a good result for who following line breeding to top mares.
Masar is line bred to Urban Sea
 

Naval Warfare may get a reprieve.
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