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Estijaab |
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Lordy
Champion Joined: 22 May 2010 Location: Sunshine State Status: Offline Points: 13887 |
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Slipper winners don't have a great record in that regard.
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marble
Champion Joined: 12 Jan 2008 Location: Brisbane Status: Offline Points: 6165 |
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i think it might be different with this one - she has been handled well and not overaced. No seven day back ups or magic million runs.
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JudgeHolden
Champion Joined: 16 Apr 2011 Status: Offline Points: 11716 |
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Have to agree with Lordy here. More dominant 2yos than her have gone on to do nothing. 2yo racing is a shallow talent pool. She's been handled beautifully but I vey much doubt that was a high rating race yesterday.
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Shawy38
Champion Joined: 13 Jun 2015 Status: Offline Points: 17253 |
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The slipper campaign cooks a lot of horses.
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Shawy38
Champion Joined: 13 Jun 2015 Status: Offline Points: 17253 |
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That is the exact reason why the breeding industry in this country has got it wrong
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JudgeHolden
Champion Joined: 16 Apr 2011 Status: Offline Points: 11716 |
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I certainly don't think she's been cooked. It's just that more and more horses start into contention. A lot of very good horses aren't up and running by Slipper time. As Spring 3yos it gets tougher, then much tougher in the Autumn. Exponentially harder as an older horse. If she keeps improving, she can go on with it, but that's a big if.
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furious
Champion Joined: 19 Feb 2007 Status: Offline Points: 25066 |
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I'm with Judge. Plenty of Slipper starters are still running as six and seven year olds (the geldings). Or look at some of the form in past years of slipper runners after they ran in the slipper
Dance Hero three G1's Alinghi three G1's Charge Forward G1 Fastnet Rock dual G1 Fashions Afield dual G1 Mnemosyne dual G1 Snitzel G1 Miss Finland four G1's inc Oaks Empires Choice G1 Derby Gold Edition (17 wins) two G1's Forensics dual G1 All American G1 More Joyous (21 wins) eight G1 Melito dual G1 Manhattan Rain G1 Sepoy dual G1 Mosheen three G1's inc Oaks Foxwedge G1 Hot Snitzel G1 Pierro (11 wins) four G1 Snitzerland (8 wins) G1 Samaready G1 Driefontein G1 Sweet Idea (8 wins) G1 Guelph four G1 Criterion three G1 English G1 Single Gaze G1 Exosphere G1 Yankee Rose G1 Flying Artie G1 She Will Reign G1 Trapeze Artist G1 Lots of these didnt' race past there three year old career but you can't blame the Slipper for that. They were colts and eagerly put to stud. Now if Spirit of Boom can back up Lonhro maybe we'll get a few colts running further into there careers. But they have to have a very laid back attitude to do it and so many colts just loose interest. |
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Nick
Champion Joined: 21 Mar 2009 Status: Offline Points: 3442 |
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Good post Furious!!
I love E, but I don't think she will have a long career. |
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scamanda
Champion Joined: 11 Oct 2008 Location: The Manor Status: Offline Points: 16246 |
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I think Occy raced in a Slipper too Furious.
Single Gaze did and then raced in a Melb Cup. I don't expect Estijaab to do what they did though. Good 3YO then off to the breeding barn.
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I started with nothing and still have most of it left
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Carioca
Champion Joined: 13 Nov 2015 Status: Offline Points: 21698 |
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Yep, backed him, was o/s at the time left money with a mate of mine to back it , got beat by a small margin, Flying Spur. 1995.
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correctweight
Champion Joined: 20 May 2010 Location: Melbourne Status: Offline Points: 2560 |
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Criterion ran 6th in a Slipper then won the Derby and was an unlucky 3rd in the PoP Melb Cup after an overseas campaign.
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furious
Champion Joined: 19 Feb 2007 Status: Offline Points: 25066 |
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Didn't go back to Occy's years just from Dance Hero's and forward as if you go back too far people complain racing was different back then! Just listed there best win or wins with multiple G1's etc and yes some like Criterion and Occy ran on well into there forth or fifth year. And a few Melbourne Cup runners from the race. Too many people lampoon the Slipper as everything that is wrong in Australian racing. It is the exact opposite. You need a mature two year old to get into the Slipper and they can usually run on if not weighted out of everything. Many go on to win over far longer distances also. In fact I'd love to see She Will Reign over 1600m. Just because you are brilliant doesn't mean you can't go further. Gee fancy if they'd kept the King to only 1000m or 1200m just because he was brilliant enough to win stakes at that level.
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furious
Champion Joined: 19 Feb 2007 Status: Offline Points: 25066 |
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Or hadn't tried Miss Finland over the Oaks trip. We'd miss out on so much racing history.
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furious
Champion Joined: 19 Feb 2007 Status: Offline Points: 25066 |
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Come to think of it Sky High, Skyline and Bounding Away are other Derby and Oaks winners who won the Slipper also.
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Lordy
Champion Joined: 22 May 2010 Location: Sunshine State Status: Offline Points: 13887 |
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If you go back through the slipper fields through the years you often see future superstars back in the pack somewhere. Plenty of good horses come through the race but for whatever reason the winners often don't live up to expectations as older horses.
Bottom line, form of the race is a poor guide to future prospects. You really have to wait and see how they come back as 3yos before you know. |
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correctweight
Champion Joined: 20 May 2010 Location: Melbourne Status: Offline Points: 2560 |
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You are right. Majority do not fire afterwards. In recent years Capatalist, Vancouver, Mossfun, Overreach and Crystal Lily (RIP, to be fair she was very very competitive in Open G1's without winning). Did not win another race after their Golden Slipper win. Phelan Ready just before that took another 5 years to win a race. From the ones that won the Slipper in the past 10 runnings only Pierro and to some extent Sepoy (more for his 2yo deeds, still won as a 3yo though) can be considered out and out champions. |
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Tlazolteotl
Champion Joined: 02 Oct 2012 Location: Elephant Butte Status: Offline Points: 31290 |
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Sire and dam didn't win their G1s until 3 and 4, so maybe.
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Balciano
Champion Joined: 09 Nov 2016 Status: Offline Points: 860 |
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Out until the Autumn after a setback.
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Shrunk in the Wash
Champion Joined: 25 Mar 2016 Status: Offline Points: 9890 |
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Was the setback a very average trial?
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Gay3
Moderator Group Joined: 19 Feb 2007 Location: Miners Rest Status: Offline Points: 51818 |
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One would expect the average trial to be the result of a setback
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Wisdom has been chasing me but I've always outrun it!
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Shrunk in the Wash
Champion Joined: 25 Mar 2016 Status: Offline Points: 9890 |
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Or not wanting to expose a valuable filly who hasn’t come back
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Underground
Champion Joined: 18 Aug 2012 Location: Sydn Status: Offline Points: 683 |
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Vancouveritis?
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Sunline
Champion Joined: 01 Jul 2008 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 22302 |
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Same thing Overreach. Spelled after trials. Happened to Mossfun maybe as well although less certain about her.
Slipper winners are usually worth avoiding in the spring! Same as bloody Magic Millions winners as we found out the other day. |
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Sunline...simply supreme
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crooked_gambler
Champion Joined: 27 Jan 2015 Status: Offline Points: 4675 |
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2 year olds who have a very taxing first campaign often need 12 months to recover.
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VOYAGER
Champion Joined: 04 Aug 2007 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 18695 |
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Am watching the NSW racing Night of Champions and the two year old category had Seabrook and Oohood as nominees.
How is that possible? They are owned in Victoria aren't they? If the criteria is horses who have raced in NSW then the awards are illogical! |
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Remember, it might take intelligence to be smart , but it takes experience to be wise
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Shawy38
Champion Joined: 13 Jun 2015 Status: Offline Points: 17253 |
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Racing Victoria gave away the trainers medal to Joseph OBrien
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Xavier
Champion Joined: 28 Jul 2016 Location: Melbourne Status: Offline Points: 3660 |
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Finally gets back to the races on Saturday.
Looking forward to having a good look at her |
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Karl and Susan Kennedy are my heroes
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