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Second Chance View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Second Chance Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Nov 2018 at 8:28pm
Let's just have a look in a couple of years time.

Comparing betting volume last year with this alone is clearly nonsensical, particularly given internationals have been here for quite some years now.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JudgeHolden Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Nov 2018 at 8:30pm
Originally posted by Second Chance Second Chance wrote:

Let's just have a look in a couple of years time.

Comparing betting volume last year with this alone is clearly nonsensical, particularly given internationals have been here for quite some years now.


Which should of course be obvious to anyone...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baguette Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Nov 2018 at 8:32pm
Hasn't the betting turnover been going down for a couple of years? This year was just a bigger drop.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JudgeHolden Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Nov 2018 at 8:35pm
Nope.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oneonesit Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Nov 2018 at 8:37pm
Originally posted by JudgeHolden JudgeHolden wrote:

You’re blaming it on the internationals. Then you’re blaming it on the Everest...round and round you go. Your own private little circle jerk.
You are obviously too dumb to comprehend or or just too lazy to read the thread. Sales on the MC are down considerably. Last year there was a late scratching which has a big impact on sales ( particularly exotics) - yet even so sales across Aust with the TAB are 7% down ( that includes SA these days as well btw). Sportsbet is the biggest on-line Corporate & they are on record apologising to their customers not taking a bet for 2 hrs. Ladbrokes were even down longer. So one would have expected a free kick to the TAB. I wouldn’t be surprised if the real figure across the board was not closer to 20% - not that we will ever know. I know Sportsbet copped negative criticism in the Financial press over their platform failure on the day. To put it all down to the track getting a bit of rain in the morning is a bit too easy imo. Obviously next year will be interesting. However if the Everest continues on its path of growth , & the MC field is dominated by internationals - I reckon we’ll see a further drop in turnover
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JudgeHolden Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Nov 2018 at 8:37pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JudgeHolden Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Nov 2018 at 8:42pm
Originally posted by oneonesit oneonesit wrote:

Originally posted by JudgeHolden JudgeHolden wrote:

You’re blaming it on the internationals. Then you’re blaming it on the Everest...round and round you go. Your own private little circle jerk.
You are obviously too dumb to comprehend or or just too lazy to read the thread. Sales on the MC are down considerably. Last year there was a late scratching which has a big impact on sales ( particularly exotics) - yet even so sales across Aust with the TAB are 7% down ( that includes SA these days as well btw). Sportsbet is the biggest on-line Corporate & they are on record apologising to their customers not taking a bet for 2 hrs. Ladbrokes were even down longer. So one would have expected a free kick to the TAB. I wouldn’t be surprised if the real figure across the board was not closer to 20% - not that we will ever know. I know Sportsbet copped negative criticism in the Financial press over their platform failure on the day. To put it all down to the track getting a bit of rain in the morning is a bit too easy imo. Obviously next year will be interesting. However if the Everest continues on its path of growth , & the MC field is dominated by internationals - I reckon we’ll see a further drop in turnover


It’s a one year sample you’re dealing with...internationals have been coming for decades. It’s like trying to explain algebra to a plush toy...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oneonesit Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Nov 2018 at 8:46pm
Well that makes it even stranger Judge. TAB sales down 7% across Australia - yet that article suggested sales up in Vic. So much for the rain theory
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JudgeHolden Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Nov 2018 at 8:48pm
The article’s from last year, and was in response to Baguette.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Discohips23 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Nov 2018 at 8:49pm
Originally posted by djebel djebel wrote:

Originally posted by Enabled Enabled wrote:

He has a point with these lightly raced NH 4yos beating the handicapper.


Like Kings Will Dream ?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oneonesit Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Nov 2018 at 8:53pm
Originally posted by JudgeHolden JudgeHolden wrote:

The article’s from last year, and was in response to Baguette.
Ok - that makes sense. Have you been able to find any similar article pointing out positives from this years carnival ? RV are usually pretty quick at giving themselves a wrap
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JudgeHolden Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Nov 2018 at 8:57pm
The carnival’s just finished.

Last year was good. The international dominance was there too. Penny dropped yet?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oneonesit Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Nov 2018 at 9:20pm
Originally posted by JudgeHolden JudgeHolden wrote:

The carnival’s just finished.

Last year was good. The international dominance was there too. Penny dropped yet?
Get out of those horse threads above for christs sake Judge. It’s muddying your outlook. The vast majority of punters don’t spend hours a day discussing / arguing the merits of a horses performance. You would be a true 1% in my opinion. They also don’t not have a bet in the Melbourne Cup because the track got a bit wet. The more likely reason they don’t have a bet is that they have lost interest in the event - or they have already spent their punting budget. That’s all I’m saying
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Enabled Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Nov 2018 at 9:31pm
Originally posted by Discohips23 Discohips23 wrote:

Originally posted by djebel djebel wrote:

Originally posted by Enabled Enabled wrote:

He has a point with these lightly raced NH 4yos beating the handicapper.


Like Kings Will Dream ?




First up. The thing has been in AUS for a year.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tontonan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Nov 2018 at 9:45pm

CROWDS

Derby Day: 91,194
Cup Day: 83,471
Oaks Day: 61,355
Stakes Day: 67,567
4-Day Total: 303,587

 


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote acacia alba Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Nov 2018 at 9:51pm
Locals, as in old blokes who have a bet on the Cup,  dont any more.   They have no clue about the internationals.  The oldies in my TAB just sit there shaking their heads and thinking about the good old times when they could assess a horse , and have a bet.    And me ?   I am here every day reading all the tipsters posts,,follow the form folks.  But its got to the point now where I dont really care.  i am not a punter. And it seems to be centered  around the punters ideas of whats good.  And whats not.   Lots of locals now have lost interest.  They have no concept of the overseas horses, who have no connection to us Ozzies, so they are just saying, Feck it,,,,,

animals before people.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote acacia alba Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Nov 2018 at 9:53pm
Originally posted by Tontonan Tontonan wrote:


CROWDS

Derby Day: 91,194
Cup Day: 83,471
Oaks Day: 61,355
Stakes Day: 67,567
4-Day Total: 303,587


How many of those went to bet big bucks , and how many went to socialise, and how many went to get pissed as a parrot ?? 


 


animals before people.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Tontonan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Nov 2018 at 10:10pm
YearDerbyCupOaksStakesTotal
2018 91,194  83,47161,355 67,567303,587
2017 87,526 90,536 63,673 68,873310,608 
201690,13697,47960,88870,351318,854
2015 85,943 101,015 57,560 68,711 313,229 
201490,244100,79464,430 70,051 325,519  
201395,223 104,169 66,75765,047331,196 
201298,823106,16271,82574,546351,356
201192,336105,97971,65985,112355,086
201090,361110,22375,08877,506353,178
2009108,178102,16180,11278,478368,929
2008117,776107,28089,33881,652396,046
2007115,705102,41195,23084,067397,413
2006129,089106,691104,13178,158418,069
2005115,660106,479100,26361,382383,784
2004115,54298,161110,67745,734370,114
200397,059122,736101,17955,793376,767
2002101,898102,533103,26947,593355,293
200193,02992,477101,20142,760329,467
200092,581121,01596,40642,311352,313
199976,514104,02883,87031,728296,140
199875,805100,60777,30131,249284,962
199764,528 94,14375,48226,357260,510
199664,09990,14967,08625,736247,070
199560,40474,84362,38825,318222,953
199454,46781,65050,17622,624208,917
199349,02974,766 46,74422,162192,701
199245,72986,20650,92521,495204,355
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oneonesit Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Nov 2018 at 10:19pm
Interesting numbers Tontonan. Bit all over the place - however the overall trend across the entire carnival is pretty bleak. Bit surprised actually - thought the Carnival was fairly immune to general drop off in course attendances being seen around the country - athough it would seem not .
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tontonan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Nov 2018 at 10:32pm
I offer the statistics without comment and leave it to others to misread them Tongue


AVERAGE CROWDS 1992-2018

Derby Day: 88,652
Cup Day: 99,765
Oaks Day: 81,602
Stakes Day: 55,344
4-Day Total: 319,472

AVERAGE CROWDS 1980-1991

Derby Day: 42,637
Cup Day: 89,014
Oaks Day: 43,528
Stakes Day: 22,020
4-Day Total: 197,199  

Melbourne Population 1980 = approx 2.5 million
Melbourne Population 2018 = approx 4.7 million
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oneonesit Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Nov 2018 at 10:44pm
Yes cheers Tontonan. Not sure there is any correlation though between on-course attendance & punting turnover. Pretty sure punting turnover has been increasing year on year - which is why I thought this years poor MC day figure was worth commenting on. I’d be surprised if RV were not a bit concerned by it as well. Can’t cop the wet track excuse
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oneonesit Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Nov 2018 at 10:50pm
It is interesting that the “Golden Period” for on-course attendance was just before the Corporate bookie onslaught really took off.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Enabled Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Nov 2018 at 11:20pm
What about AFL gf, F1 and Aus tennis open numbers for same periods.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tontonan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Nov 2018 at 11:21pm
Funny you should mention that.  I have already written in my notes  (but did not post) .....

It is very likely that the attendance figures peaked (and absolutely peaked given the restraints of the venue, access, etc) in the mid noughties.  The figures are moderating.  

There is no doubt though that the internationalization of the race coincided with the largest rise in attendance seen in 100 years or more with average attendances more than doubling in the space of a couple of decades and the gambling and gaming explosion of the 1990's and early 2000's. 

The decline in attendances have coincided with the proliferation of corporate bookmakers and vision broadcast hours of the carnival. 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Platinum Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Nov 2018 at 2:32am
Originally posted by oneonesit oneonesit wrote:


TABCORP reported a 7% decrease across its TAB & UBET business on Melbourne Cup Day vs last year. Their press release suggested poor weather in Melb was "probably" the main reason. Well I think a few things can be said - firstly the weather in Melb is nearly always crap so we can throw that old chestnut out. Secondly, we had no late scratching's this year so the comparison is not horses for courses ( actually a lot more than 7%). Thirdly, the Everest Carnival is getting bigger & bigger & getting first bite at the cherry. Strategically brilliant by V'Landys. Will only continue to eat away at Melbourne's carnival as time goes on


The only old chestnut is the Melbourne is crap weather.

Maybe 35 years ago, now it gets the least rainfall of any capital city in Australia and all without the Phillipines humidity that many get .
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baguette Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Nov 2018 at 9:02am
Originally posted by JudgeHolden JudgeHolden wrote:

https://www.news.com.au/sport/superracing/melbournes-spring-carnival-surges-again-as-numbers-rise-significantly/news-story/c66a21451501b3aa05bceb1a9c90067c
https://www.tabcorp.com.au/news-media/media-releases/tabcorp-2017-emirates-melbourne-cup-turnover . Seems to be differing numbers . Tabcorp say 2017 Melbourne Cup turnover on the Cup itself was down 5.7%.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tlazolteotl Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Nov 2018 at 9:12am
Victorians enthusiasm for going to everything in large numbers always seems weird to me. Those 100 thousand days on Oaks day- what's that all about? And I bet I get a reply along the lines of, we go to the races then to get a drunken root with a random. Sure you do.LOL
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TJMitchell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Nov 2018 at 9:17am
We have a race for the Aussie plodders, it's called The Jericho Cup
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Whale Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Nov 2018 at 9:21am
Originally posted by Tlazolteotl Tlazolteotl wrote:

Victorians enthusiasm for going to everything in large numbers always seems weird to me. Those 100 thousand days on Oaks day- what's that all about? And I bet I get a reply along the lines of, we go to the races then to get a drunken root with a random. Sure you do.LOL

your point being Confused
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote skippy123 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Nov 2018 at 11:32am
Originally posted by acacia alba acacia alba wrote:

Originally posted by Tontonan Tontonan wrote:

<strong style="color: rgb102, 102, 102; font-family: Roboto, sans-serif; font-size: 14px; line-height: 1.8em; -sizing: border-; : relative;">
<strong style="color: rgb102, 102, 102; font-family: Roboto, sans-serif; font-size: 14px; line-height: 1.8em; -sizing: border-; : relative;">CROWDS<p style="-sizing: border-; : relative; font-family: Roboto, sans-serif; font-size: 14px; line-height: 1.8em; color: rgb102, 102, 102;"><strong style="-sizing: border-; : relative;">Derby Day: 91,194<strong style="-sizing: border-; : relative;"><br style="-sizing: border-; : relative;">Cup Day: 83,471<strong style="-sizing: border-; : relative;"><br style="-sizing: border-; : relative;">Oaks Day: 61,355<strong style="-sizing: border-; : relative;"><br style="-sizing: border-; : relative;">Stakes Day: 67,567<br style="-sizing: border-; : relative;"><strong style="-sizing: border-; : relative;">4-Day Total: 303,587

<p style="-sizing: border-; : relative; font-family: Roboto, sans-serif; font-size: 14px; line-height: 1.8em; color: rgb102, 102, 102;"><strong style="-sizing: border-; : relative;"><strong style="-sizing: border-; : relative;"><strong style="-sizing: border-; : relative;"><strong style="-sizing: border-; : relative;"><strong style="-sizing: border-; : relative;">

<p style="-sizing: border-; : relative; font-family: Roboto, sans-serif; font-size: 14px; line-height: 1.8em; color: rgb102, 102, 102;"><strong style="-sizing: border-; : relative;"><strong style="-sizing: border-; : relative;"><strong style="-sizing: border-; : relative;"><strong style="-sizing: border-; : relative;"><strong style="-sizing: border-; : relative;">How many of those went to bet big bucks , and how many went to socialise, and how many went to get pissed as a parrot ?? 

<p style="-sizing: border-; : relative; font-family: Roboto, sans-serif; font-size: 14px; line-height: 1.8em; color: rgb102, 102, 102;"><strong style="-sizing: border-; : relative;"><strong style="-sizing: border-; : relative;"><strong style="-sizing: border-; : relative;"><strong style="-sizing: border-; : relative;"><strong style="-sizing: border-; : relative;">

<p style="-sizing: border-; : relative;"><span style=": rgb251, 251, 253;"> </span>

<p style="-sizing: border-; : relative;">




No offence AA but that would make it the same as any other (recent) year
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