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2019 Melbourne Cup

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SkyDancer View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SkyDancer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Jun 2019 at 4:19pm
I tried to help you.
No need to be so dismissive.
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Jamal View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jamal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Jun 2019 at 4:23pm
Originally posted by SkyDancer SkyDancer wrote:

I tried to help you.
No need to be so dismissive.


I wasn't being dismissive but up to you if you want to interpret it that way.
Australian racing is only good up to 1400m in terms of world standards when it comes to depth/quality in numbers
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jamal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Jun 2019 at 4:51pm
Interesting that Brew won the champion stayer award for the 2000/01 season. A G1, G2 and Listed successes
Australian racing is only good up to 1400m in terms of world standards when it comes to depth/quality in numbers
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Jun 2019 at 4:58pm
Originally posted by Jamal Jamal wrote:

Interesting that Brew won the champion stayer award for the 2000/01 season. A G1, G2 and Listed successes

Must have been  a terrible season for stayers.

He was not even the best stayer on Melbourne Cup day. 

Race 8 - 3:20PM FOSTER'S MELBOURNE CUP (3200 METRES)
Of $3,000,000. 1st $2,000,000, 2nd $540,000, 3rd $250,000, 4th $125,000, 5th $85,000Group 1
Handicap, Minimum Weight 46kg, Apprentices cannot claim.

Track Name: Main Track Type: Turf Track Condition: Good 3 RATime: 3:18.68 Last 600m: 0:35.36 Timing Method: Electronic


ColorFinishNoHorseTrainerJockeyMarginBar.WeightPenaltyStarting Price
124BREWMichael MoroneyKerrin McEvoy2249kg14-1
212YIPPYIOAllan DenhamDarren Beadman2L1752kg10-1
37SECOND COMINGMichael MoroneyMichael Coleman3.3L1552.5kg20-1
49KAAPSTAD WAYChris WoodDamien Oliver3.4L1052kg9-2
53ARCTIC OWLJames FanshaweDavid Harrison4.9L1956.5kg14-1
65FREEMASONJohn HawkesMr Larry Cassidy5.3L253kg8-1
722CELESTIAL SHOWLen MortonLenny Beasley5.7L949.5kg125-1
815PASTA EXPRESSPaul CaveJohn Marshall9.7L1451kg50-1
916SKYBEAULen SmithDwayne Dunn11.5L451kg160-1
1017HILL OF GRACERobert PriscottGlen Boss12L750.5kg25-1
114DIATRIBEGeorge HanlonMr Jim Cassidy13.3L1355kg2.57-1
1218CITRA'S PRINCECliff BrownCraig Williams13.7L1650kg (cd 51kg)80-1
1311THE HINDPeter HayesStephen Baster18.5L1152kg40-1
1423MAGUIREJohn CollinsLuke Currie18.8L149.5kg125-1
151ENZELIJohn OxxGreg Hall25.8L557kg15-1
1613BOHEMIATHRobert SmerdonDarren Gauci28.1L351.5kg10-1
176LIGHTNING ARROWSaeed Bin SuroorFrankie Dettori36.1L1253kg20-1
1814OUR UNICORNColin AldersonMr Matthew Gatt37.6L2151kg300-1
1920MR. NELSONRussell CameronMr Jason Patton38.4L1850kg50-1
208COCO COBANNAGai WaterhouseMr Chris Munce53.4L2052kg0.125-1
212FAR CRYMartin PipeKevin Darley55.9L857kg8-1
2210MARIDPOURMichael MoroneyGreg Childs60.9L652kg500-1
19MAJESTIC AVENUETony NoonanAaron Spiteri00.1
21PRAVDAPaul O'SullivanLance O'Sullivan0
reductio ad absurdum
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Jamal View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jamal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Jun 2019 at 5:26pm
First question...what do you mean he wasn't the best stayer on Melbourne Cup day?? He won the Cup and was the best horse on the day in that race.

In terms of other stayers during the 2000-01 season...Diatribe won the Caulfield Cup and Curata Storm won The BMW (Tancred Stakes).

Please refrain from quoting posts directly above. This applies to all who constantly feel the need Disapprove


Edited by Gay3 - 26 Jun 2019 at 11:13am
Australian racing is only good up to 1400m in terms of world standards when it comes to depth/quality in numbers
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Afros Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Jun 2019 at 9:43pm
Jamal, why do you always feel the need to quote the last post when you are replying to it? Just creates unnecessary clutter, people will understand thats the post your responding to when your post is the next in line.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shrunk in the Wash Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Jun 2019 at 11:39pm
Especially when it appears in such an unreadable format
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mr Grieves Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Jun 2019 at 12:27am
Worst post-Vintage Crop Cup field?  Probably.  Certainly the worst placegetters.
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Jamal View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jamal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Jun 2019 at 1:12am
Originally posted by Mr Grieves Mr Grieves wrote:

Worst post-Vintage Crop Cup field?  Probably.  Certainly the worst placegetters.


Does that devalue or deride Brew as a Melbourne Cup winner in your opinion?
Australian racing is only good up to 1400m in terms of world standards when it comes to depth/quality in numbers
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SkyDancer View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SkyDancer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Jun 2019 at 11:06am
For the 5000th time Stop Quoting and just type your reply.
We don’t want to read the same posts again and again.
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Xavier View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Xavier Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Jun 2019 at 11:07am
surely he is taking the piss
Karl and Susan Kennedy are my heroes
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Jun 2019 at 1:57pm
Big smile


reductio ad absurdum
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djebel View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Jun 2019 at 1:59pm
Big smile LOL

Wonder what science or math was used to come to this conclusion ?

Benchmark weight for NH 3yos in Melbourne Cup moves to 56.5kg (from 55.5kg) and in Caulfield Cup and Cox Plate moves to 56.5kg (from 56kg)
reductio ad absurdum
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote breeding_above_all Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Jun 2019 at 10:36am
Ridiculous to change it.. they’re lightly raced... like any horse they were carrying light weights due to this.. Australian protectionism strikes again. Instead of incentivising local trainers they Handicap visitors
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote breeding_above_all Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jul 2019 at 11:41am
Bukhurst just won a group 3... Lloyd owned, Nick sounded like they will be potebtially bringing him over for MC assault
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Carioca View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Carioca Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jul 2019 at 5:41pm
Originally posted by breeding_above_all breeding_above_all wrote:

Ridiculous to change it.. they’re lightly raced... like any horse they were carrying light weights due to this.. Australian protectionism strikes again. Instead of incentivising local trainers they Handicap visitors

Didn't the same happen to Choiser when he went over there as a 3yo, not so sure about Merchant Navy but maybe it did also.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote breeding_above_all Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jul 2019 at 7:23pm
Our 3 years olds are their 4 year olds a lot of the one.. that’s why..
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Second Chance Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jul 2019 at 7:30pm
Sorry, I don't quite understand that post b-a-a.  Would appreciate if you could please elaborate.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Morston Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jul 2019 at 7:54pm
Originally posted by Second Chance Second Chance wrote:

Sorry, I don't quite understand that post b-a-a.  Would appreciate if you could please elaborate.


Northern hemisphere racehorse birthday is January 1st....it is August 1st in Southern Hemisphere.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Second Chance Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jul 2019 at 1:40pm
Thanks Morston, but everyone knows that and still don't understand what what was meant above.

The place-getters in the 3yo Merchant Navy's win were 4yo's.  Needless to say both were close to 6 months older than the winner, however all three carried 58.5kgs which doesn't make much sense to me.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jul 2019 at 2:11pm
Originally posted by Second Chance Second Chance wrote:

Thanks Morston, but everyone knows that and still don't understand what what was meant above.

The place-getters in the 3yo Merchant Navy's win were 4yo's.  Needless to say both were close to 6 months older than the winner, however all three carried 58.5kgs which doesn't make much sense to me.

Merchant Navy as a southern hemisphere 3yo in June is the same as a northern hemisphere 3yo in November.

In Octobers Ascot British Champions Sprint the 3yo colts get just 1 lb from their elders.If it was run in November they would be carrying level weights.

4yos in the North do not get a Weight allowance like they do down here.




reductio ad absurdum
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Second Chance Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jul 2019 at 2:24pm
Everyone keeps saying the fairly obvious, but haven't thus far explained just why there's no allowance for the 6 months younger horse in the Golden Jubilee which is run in June.  I certainly wouldn't be in a hurry to run a southern hemisphere 3yo in GB under that current weight condition.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jul 2019 at 2:25pm
Originally posted by Second Chance Second Chance wrote:

Everyone keeps saying the fairly obvious, but haven't thus far explained just why there's no allowance for the 6 months younger horse in the Golden Jubilee which is run in June.  I certainly wouldn't be in a hurry to run a southern hemisphere 3yo in GB under that current weight condition.


Didn't i just explain it ?

reductio ad absurdum
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Second Chance Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jul 2019 at 2:33pm
No.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Second Chance Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jul 2019 at 2:41pm
Or to put it rather better, you've explained what the current situation is but haven't addressed the rationale behind a weighting situation which to me at least appears clearly inequitable.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Carioca Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jul 2019 at 3:08pm
Originally posted by Second Chance Second Chance wrote:

Thanks Morston, but everyone knows that and still don't understand what what was meant above.

The place-getters in the 3yo Merchant Navy's win were 4yo's.  Needless to say both were close to 6 months older than the winner, however all three carried 58.5kgs which doesn't make much sense to me.

You know a 3yo born to SH time and goes to NH to race they are 4yo there , so why can't you understand that he's getting the same as the other 4yos weightwise? same as when Adelaide came here for the Cox Plate as a NH 3yo but had to carry 56kg as against a 3yo weight of 49-5kg, yet the same horse carried 58kg in a Group 2 in France as a 3yo.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Second Chance Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jul 2019 at 3:15pm
As a three and a half year old Adelaide still received 1 kg from southern hemisphere 4yo's.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Carioca Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jul 2019 at 3:26pm
Have a look at the WFA scale for 3yo as the distance increases through the months and you will find your answer, they have made a change again but it's very close to NH 4yo time , it makes sense to me but maybe not to some , protectionism= rubbish , we cop it, they cop it, 1 all.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Second Chance Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jul 2019 at 3:28pm
Can see we'll just have to agree to disagree.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Carioca Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jul 2019 at 3:38pm
Originally posted by Second Chance Second Chance wrote:

As a three and a half year old Adelaide still received 1 kg from southern hemisphere 4yo's.



He was Not 3 years and 6 months, he was 3 years and 10 months, NH Jan 1.
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