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Trap For Fools |
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Afros
Champion Joined: 14 Jan 2009 Status: Offline Points: 15512 |
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They let a maiden in a few years ago, that should have destroyed the idea of leaving ANY horse out.
Before djebel chimes in, yes I get it that Shamus Award wasn't maiden class even if he had yet to win a race prior to that Cox Plate but if you present your race as the WFA Championship it's a bit of a joke to allow a horse that hasn't managed to win a race in. Of course one could be cynical and suggest that if Trap For Fools was an entire they may have let him in... |
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Tlazolteotl
Champion Joined: 02 Oct 2012 Location: Elephant Butte Status: Offline Points: 31448 |
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It's hard to know if the MVRC has an actual policy written down on Cox Plate entry. Most years they are desperate to get a full field no matter what no-hopers make up the numbers but once in a blue moon they get picky. Not that winning this year's dreadful Mackinnon has anything to do with a horse's suitability for a CP start. |
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An honest politician is one who when he is bought will stay bought.
Simon Cameron |
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djebel
Premium Joined: 07 Mar 2007 Status: Offline Points: 53960 |
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Despite being a maiden Shamus Award wss and is a far superior horse to Trap For Fools. |
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reductio ad absurdum
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djebel
Premium Joined: 07 Mar 2007 Status: Offline Points: 53960 |
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I think people are overstating how poor the Mackinnon was.
Irish and Victoria Derby winners. Blair House who ran Banbatl to a lip. There were 6 group 1 winners in the race. |
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reductio ad absurdum
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Prince of Penzance
Champion Joined: 17 Jan 2018 Location: Melbourne Status: Offline Points: 1938 |
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I agree, nothing wrong with the field yesterday. They were some pretty good horses
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Tlazolteotl
Champion Joined: 02 Oct 2012 Location: Elephant Butte Status: Offline Points: 31448 |
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TFF would have 6th at best in Cox Plate- 7th if KWD didn't break down.
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An honest politician is one who when he is bought will stay bought.
Simon Cameron |
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djebel
Premium Joined: 07 Mar 2007 Status: Offline Points: 53960 |
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The Matt Chapman school of handicapping I have Trap For Fools winning the Plate by 3 lengths. |
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reductio ad absurdum
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Jamal
Champion Joined: 25 Jul 2011 Status: Offline Points: 8684 |
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Will be interesting to see what Timeform rating Trap For Fools gets for his Mackinnon win:
Timeform Ratings: WA Horses - Mackinnon Winners: Past 20 Years 2018: Trap For Fools: ??? 2016: Awesome Rock: 122 2009: Scenic Shot: 123 1999: Rogan Josh: 115 |
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Australian racing is only good up to 1400m in terms of world standards when it comes to depth/quality in numbers
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Jamal
Champion Joined: 25 Jul 2011 Status: Offline Points: 8684 |
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Just in...
Timeform Ratings: WA Horses - Mackinnon Winners: Past 20 Years 2018: Trap For Fools: 118 2016: Awesome Rock: 122 2009: Scenic Shot: 123 1999: Rogan Josh: 115 |
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Australian racing is only good up to 1400m in terms of world standards when it comes to depth/quality in numbers
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kavg
Champion Joined: 08 Jun 2009 Status: Offline Points: 3993 |
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Prejudice is an emotional attachment to ignorance.
DiEM25 for the world. |
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Enabled
Yearling Joined: 04 Nov 2018 Status: Offline Points: 151 |
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How far would he have beaten Winx by in the CP if allowed to run Jamal?
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Jamal
Champion Joined: 25 Jul 2011 Status: Offline Points: 8684 |
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He doesn't beat Winx and there is no more to be said on that. It is quite obvious what the result would be. |
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Australian racing is only good up to 1400m in terms of world standards when it comes to depth/quality in numbers
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Shawy38
Champion Joined: 13 Jun 2015 Status: Offline Points: 17413 |
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He would’ve been beaten around 5 lengths by Winx.
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Enabled
Yearling Joined: 04 Nov 2018 Status: Offline Points: 151 |
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Would have been a sight leading strong.
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kavg
Champion Joined: 08 Jun 2009 Status: Offline Points: 3993 |
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It would have been good to see TFF in cox plate setting a fast tempo. Would have set it up for a more impressive win by winx. As the others would have been feeling the pinch, she would have been cruising and won easily.
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Prejudice is an emotional attachment to ignorance.
DiEM25 for the world. |
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djebel
Premium Joined: 07 Mar 2007 Status: Offline Points: 53960 |
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The maths says he'd have beaten Winx by a good 3 to 4 lengths.
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reductio ad absurdum
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Overseer
Champion Joined: 26 Jul 2013 Status: Offline Points: 2225 |
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Darren Weir and Jarrod Maclean are the best trainers to ever be licenced in Australia. They can take good horses from Group 1 trainers like Lindsay Smith and Grahame Begg and put lengths on them. Smith and Begg should apply for a job with them to learn what they have been doing wrong all these years. Perhaps they could even sleep at the stables and ride in the floats with the horses to the races. Land of Plenty and Trap For Fools are just a few examples of how horses can improve under Darren and Jarrod's "care".
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Watch the commission go on
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monty1
Champion Joined: 30 May 2017 Status: Offline Points: 1060 |
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Is this post tongue in cheek Overseer?
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Mr Grieves
Champion Joined: 28 Jan 2014 Location: Canberra Status: Offline Points: 935 |
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The best part Overseer, is how after both being caught cheating several years back, they said "This is not for us" and turned over a new leaf. Very heartwarming!
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maccamax
Champion Joined: 18 Jun 2010 Status: Offline Points: 41473 |
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Trap The Fools outstanding run in the Course Record MV Cup should have been enough for him to get a run in anything.
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Tlazolteotl
Champion Joined: 02 Oct 2012 Location: Elephant Butte Status: Offline Points: 31448 |
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An honest politician is one who when he is bought will stay bought.
Simon Cameron |
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Jamal
Champion Joined: 25 Jul 2011 Status: Offline Points: 8684 |
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How so? Surely Winx wins? |
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Australian racing is only good up to 1400m in terms of world standards when it comes to depth/quality in numbers
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Jamal
Champion Joined: 25 Jul 2011 Status: Offline Points: 8684 |
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Trap For Fools had a Timeform rating of 118 for the Mackinnon win, however his official rating for the Mackinnon win was 110. They must use different methods? 110 seems low for a G1 WFA win?
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Australian racing is only good up to 1400m in terms of world standards when it comes to depth/quality in numbers
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speedingaway
Champion Joined: 03 Jan 2009 Location: Carlton Status: Offline Points: 632 |
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That's just his VIC handicapping rating. He's effectively gone up 2-1/2 kilos from his previous rating. |
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Jamal
Champion Joined: 25 Jul 2011 Status: Offline Points: 8684 |
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But its in pounds not kilos? This is where things get confusing for me. |
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Australian racing is only good up to 1400m in terms of world standards when it comes to depth/quality in numbers
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Shawy38
Champion Joined: 13 Jun 2015 Status: Offline Points: 17413 |
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One is a handicap rating, the other is a timeform rating
Two completely different things - nothing to do with pounds or kilos. You are making it harder than it needs to be. |
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Bonfield
Champion Joined: 07 Nov 2013 Status: Offline Points: 10291 |
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I think you may have gone a bridge too far saying best trainers ever in Australia, however I do rate them both very highly. None I would rate higher at the moment.
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Bonfield
Champion Joined: 07 Nov 2013 Status: Offline Points: 10291 |
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On my ratings TFF would have run a clear 4th in Cox Plate. He deserved a spot. The committee should only ballot out horses that will be disgraced in the race. TFF's form was easily good enough to warrant a spot in Cox Plate. In fact one can argue he would have enhanced it by being the natural frontrunner. Waller would then not have sacrificed D'Argento as pacemaker for Winx.
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Gee Gee
Champion Joined: 31 Aug 2009 Status: Offline Points: 8300 |
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The Moonee Valley race club Committee should ballot themselves out. Fools
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Shawy38
Champion Joined: 13 Jun 2015 Status: Offline Points: 17413 |
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Back to this horse, he has returned to Perth.
Will be running in the Kingston Town |
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