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Jameka |
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Carioca
Champion Joined: 13 Nov 2015 Status: Offline Points: 21830 |
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Fwiw,.How Now 1976 ,.won Ajc Oaks,.Underwood Stk,.Caulfield Stk..Caulfield Cup,..Swell Time 1973 won NZ oaks
won Caulfield Cup ( God bless her ) it was an absolute bog that day and I knew the Mellay stock were swimmers 33/1 ,.i was betting well then,..now it's just lotto |
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ExceedAndExcel
Champion Joined: 20 Dec 2008 Status: Offline Points: 16245 |
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First I'm just talking Oaks winning 4yos who are mainly just more mature as 3yos and get more weight than their 4yo ability warrants. So not all 4yo mares. But yes, with the right one then of course they could win, Winx proved that last year. Very little history this century unfortunately. Lay every Oaks winner and you'll be a winner. |
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Baghdad Bob
Champion Joined: 10 Feb 2010 Location: Victoria Status: Offline Points: 13693 |
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Sobar was trained by Cyril Beechey, I do not recall him training at Caulfield. Yangtze was a SA horse trained by G Heagney, Regal Wench was trained by Bill Murrell at Epsom and Beer Street was from Tassy
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Carioca
Champion Joined: 13 Nov 2015 Status: Offline Points: 21830 |
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I think you will find Sobar was trained by Ken Hilton at Caulfield ,.ha trained all of Kemball,.Lord ,Havelock,Post
and heaps more, he was Kemballs private trainer,.Brian Ralph was his foreman,.Beer Street did come from tassie, but I can assure you Dess Judd trained him when he won the cup because I was working for him at the time, while I was there we had Yangsze there ,.Des had moved into PHIL Bourkes stable at Flemington ,.prior to that he was at caul,.i know J Stocker rode Yangsze in the cup so he may have been trained in Sa and came over later Bill Murrel Epsom for sure ,.think the kid who rode him Allen Yeomans was based at caul.cheers mate. |
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Bonfield
Champion Joined: 07 Nov 2013 Status: Offline Points: 10291 |
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Jameka will be very hard to beat in CC. On her ratings in the Naturalism and Turnbull, and considering her weight, with luck in running she would have won all of the last 10 runnings of the CC.
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Kingy
Champion Joined: 13 Oct 2009 Location: Warrnambool Status: Offline Points: 8310 |
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Great to see a couple of knowledgeable racing fans putting in their 2c. That's what this forum is all about.
fwiw GO JAMEKA!
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Red Hare
Champion Joined: 11 Jan 2015 Location: Victoria Status: Offline Points: 4233 |
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The ‘cup winners trained on course’ stat is definitely an
eye-catcher, but I wonder how much relevance it holds in today’s game,
considering the amount of work done away from Caulfield?
Many of the current
custodians have satellite properties away from the city – Maher, in particular,
runs three.
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Baghdad Bob
Champion Joined: 10 Feb 2010 Location: Victoria Status: Offline Points: 13693 |
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You are right Sobar was trained by Hilton, Beechey trained that good horse Gay Icarus, which won the 1971 Caulfield Cup,however it was not trained at Caulfield.
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Baghdad Bob
Champion Joined: 10 Feb 2010 Location: Victoria Status: Offline Points: 13693 |
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Carioca, from this newspaper article in 1963 Des Judd trained out of Flemington. Beer Street won the 1970 Caulfield Cup. In your prior post you indicated he trained at Caulfield before moving to Flemington, therefore if he trained Beer Street to win the CCUP, he was at Flemington.
Are you sure he trained at Caulfield before moving to flemington or was it the other way around. Flemington to Caulfield ? ttps://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1300&dat=19630828&id=031VAAAAIBAJ&sjid=rJYDAAAAIBAJ&pg=4891,4076772&hl=en
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Baghdad Bob
Champion Joined: 10 Feb 2010 Location: Victoria Status: Offline Points: 13693 |
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That newspaper's link should be https://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1300&dat=19630828&id=031VAAAAIBAJ&sjid=rJYDAAAAIBAJ&pg=4891,4076772&hl=en |
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Carioca
Champion Joined: 13 Nov 2015 Status: Offline Points: 21830 |
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Hi Baghdad Bob,.from all accounts he moved into PHIL Bourkes stable in st Leonards crescent Ascot Vale, after
PHIL died,that may have been around the early 60 s,.im pretty sure before that it was Caulfield,When Des retired early 70 s Bart bought the stables and nice home, there was another house on the property next door ,Brian Gilders bought that ( Des' s stable jock) Ron Dillon bought Borehead down from QLD 1965 won the CC and left it with Des who I think won Aust.Cup, now Beer Street came over from tassie as a promising young horse ,Des trained him to win the 1970 CC,.we also had his younger sister Gin Lane,.also Yangtse won the CC 1964 when trained by Ron Dini ADL,.somehow Des had him as an 8 y/o bull,.those three horses were there while I was there,. Sobar was trained by Ke Hilten,private trainer for Mr W kemball,.think Lord, Future, Havelock,,.he won CC 1972 broke down badly in the VRC derby,.may of had 2 years off,.you might be getting him mixed up with Gay Icarus who was trained by Cyril Beechly,.hope I've been of some help mate. |
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Carioca
Champion Joined: 13 Nov 2015 Status: Offline Points: 21830 |
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Ps,.Sobar was like all Ken Hilten horses ,.trained at Caulfield,.( bit of trivia, Brenden McCarthy was a strapper for him) .
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Sunline
Champion Joined: 01 Jul 2008 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 22302 |
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People still wondering what we saw in her?
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Sunline...simply supreme
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Shawy38
Champion Joined: 13 Jun 2015 Status: Offline Points: 17411 |
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She killed them
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Einstein
Champion Joined: 21 Dec 2015 Status: Offline Points: 1290 |
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Love this mare. She could easily do another lap, still full of energy, you wouldn't think she just ran 2400m.
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Shawy38
Champion Joined: 13 Jun 2015 Status: Offline Points: 17411 |
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That all in mc bet loooks good now
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JudgeHolden
Champion Joined: 16 Apr 2011 Status: Offline Points: 11729 |
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Strangely underrated still by some. But for bad luck and bad rides she would have been back in the G1 winners stall well before this. Had a lap on those Autumn fillies, Olly... Market got it right, though the drift was a bit of a spoil.
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poczynek
Champion Joined: 25 Aug 2015 Status: Offline Points: 1281 |
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What about now DD? |
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Speediskey
Champion Joined: 18 Feb 2014 Status: Offline Points: 4116 |
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I was wrong about her, I said she was the best of the Aussies but still thought (albeit knowing nothing about them) that the internationals would beat her just because I thought her form was terrible. Was wrong, great win, she wins the Cup on that run with less than a 2kg penalty. Internationals not much chop.
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Sunline
Champion Joined: 01 Jul 2008 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 22302 |
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Like i said in my post a week or two ago, her Turnbull run was as good a Caulfield Cup trial as you'll see.
She was beaten only by a star, belted the rest, ran super time, and she had weight relief to come - not to mention an ordinary field. It was easy. |
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Sunline...simply supreme
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Nocturnal
Champion Joined: 26 Sep 2008 Location: at the 800 Status: Offline Points: 13667 |
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One of the better judges on here. Sometimes we get it wrong . |
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The only problem with backing winners ? You never have enough on....
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jacko1
Champion Joined: 26 Jun 2007 Status: Offline Points: 1801 |
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Good win, but hard to put it into context given the field was woeful, she had a light weight and relatively easy run.
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crooked_gambler
Champion Joined: 27 Jan 2015 Status: Offline Points: 4676 |
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Give DD a break. He is a guru when it comes to finding winners. He is allowed to make the occasional mistake. We all do.
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Sunline
Champion Joined: 01 Jul 2008 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 22302 |
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I know what you mean but two things: the margin was what she needed to do to that standard of field - she didn't fall in and that was despite pulling her head off most of the way which you just can't do and win; and I wouldn't call it a light weight - 4yo mares normally carry less. That was a good weight for a 4yo mare.
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Sunline...simply supreme
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jacko1
Champion Joined: 26 Jun 2007 Status: Offline Points: 1801 |
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Yes you're right it was a dominant win. I do think she is a very good mare and will do well in the M Cup, which is also not going to be a vintage edition, but in the context of CC winners it's hard to line her up.
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poczynek
Champion Joined: 25 Aug 2015 Status: Offline Points: 1281 |
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Everyone makes mistakes. It's more about how he arrogantly dismisses others when they suggest a horse he doesn't like. |
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pnclick
Champion Joined: 13 Mar 2009 Status: Offline Points: 1023 |
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There is one horse that just wins the Melbourne Cup based on Jameka's win yesterday and thats Hartnell.
He absolutely brained her in the Turnbull. Had 57.5kgs drops to 55kgs, assuming he gets beat next week by Winx so no penalty. Jameka carried 54.5 in the Turnbull, she's got 52 in the Cup today, but that will increase to at least 53.5kg (most likely a 1.5kg penalty), so she meets Hartnell 1.5 worse for getting brained. He's had experience at the 3200m, and his run last year was good. Wasn't a case of didn't stay etc..., and he has improved massively this prep. We all know the Melbourne Cup is the one race Goldolphin has been trying desperately to win, and they've been bringing all these late arrival internationals across, and been close a number of times... They've got the right one this year!!!
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Speediskey
Champion Joined: 18 Feb 2014 Status: Offline Points: 4116 |
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Few mistakes in your post. First of all Hartnell can't get a penalty for winning the Cox Plate. It's WFA. Secondly Jameka currently has 51.5kg in the Melbourne Cup. Hartnell has 55kg, so until she gets a penalty she has less weight than him. But yeah, she will most likely get a 1.5kg penalty, thus she's giving him an extra kg. I also disagree with your assessment of the Sydney Cup run, he was in great form and was a near cert in the Sydney Cup if he ran it out, all he had to do was carry 52kg and failed. |
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djebel
Premium Joined: 07 Mar 2007 Status: Offline Points: 53960 |
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When Hartnell won the 3200m Queens Vase back in 2014 we had Our Century in second and Big Orange in 4th.
You would have to think Our Century despite being a 7 year old next season, he will open favourite for next years Melbourne Cup when first markets go up. BM87. I'd prefer Jameka did not get anymore weight but hopefull she gets no more than 1 kg taking her to the weight she carried yesterday. With 53.5 kgs she will have to give 1.5 kgs to Almandin. |
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reductio ad absurdum
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djebel
Premium Joined: 07 Mar 2007 Status: Offline Points: 53960 |
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When Hartnell won the 3200m Queens Vase back in 2014 we had Our Century in second and Big Orange in 4th.
You would have to think Our Century despite being a 7 year old next season, he will open favourite for next years Melbourne Cup when first markets go up. BM87. I'd prefer Jameka did not get anymore weight but hopefull she gets no more than 1 kg taking her to the weight she carried yesterday. With 52.5 kgs she will have to give 1.5 kgs to Almandin.
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reductio ad absurdum
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