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Australian property crash

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Whale View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Whale Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 2018 at 9:44am
Originally posted by Redemption Redemption wrote:

What isnt said, is that if you buy a property at $1 million, and it flatlines, and worth $1 million, you are still making a major loss, as your mortgage repayments, debt to property, makes you miles behind.

Many people bought to "Reno", in the trendy "buy and reno" period, due to tv shows etc, and now have huge mortgages, and even if the market just flatlined, didnt go up, nor down, they are still making major losses, as they are paying debts to properties that simply flatlined.

So the whole business of, "oh market down 5%", isnt really even factoring that if the market sat at 0%, flatline, its still a huge loss for property owners.

Australian Bureau of Statistics released data, saying that its cheaper to rent longterm, than be a property owner. There are many unsaid costs to being a property owner.
Its cheaper to rent longterm, and that is a statistical fact.



That is bare costs not taking into account increase in property values over time
There is no way you will be better off by renting than buying over a period of 10 years.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Isaac soloman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 2018 at 10:43am
Originally posted by Afros Afros wrote:

Hey Doc, why don't you just come out with the industry you're in? Calling rusty stupid and other insults while dodging the question is only making you look like this is more about your dislike of ANYTHING on the left of the political spectrum, it also supports the online fantasist theory...

and what is your industry afros?

my guess for some on here

public servants retired on "beautiful" supers, contributed to by the tax payer.

as for doc, you had him riding track work.

why do you keep digging?

as for rust, too much time on his hands and NEEDS to FIND a job, before his punting sends him brokeLOL

maybe a lawyer; no a bureaucrat. yes minister comes to mind.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shrunk in the Wash Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 2018 at 3:06pm
Originally posted by maccamax maccamax wrote:

Doc has given spot on Real Estate advice and is up with the golden rules .    He has nominated the areas with a future t .



I missed that. Can You point me to the posts
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rusty nails Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 2018 at 3:15pm
If it’s in pink, I’d recommend a 2nd opinion before investing your hard earned....

Actually, anyone taking property advice of someone with his posting history has no respect for their money...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stayer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 2018 at 3:49pm
Originally posted by Whale Whale wrote:

Maybe the profits he talks about are specific to his business, or maybe he is only across those profits in his industry and is not qualified to talk about other types of business.

So any illustration of how he would profit may identify him

Holy gelati what happened to whale???
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stayer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 2018 at 3:53pm
And after reading on, holy gelati there's a thread where people are actually discussing stuff!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dr E Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 2018 at 4:58pm
Originally posted by Afros Afros wrote:

Are losses on paper really losses? The only actual profit/loss on an asset is after you sell, yes I'm aware market value has implications elsewhere but unless people their losses on the property are on paper only.

True! a loss or gain is only "paper" until the asset is actually sold. 

Property values represent a large chunk of the NATIONS wealth, not just individuals, so there are many and far-reaching consequences when those values increase or decrease even notionally.

Some simple examples are, if you own a real estate asset with debt, then any loss in value can put you in a precarious position if you are unable to meet the holding costs, and a sale is forced.

If you want to use that asset as security for any other acquisition, and the value has diminished, that will be problematic too, may restrict the owner from doing anything, even say improving, repairing or maintaining.

So those are two obvious examples.

Your approaching this like increasing value and profits continually should be a guarantee but this isn't how the free market economy the Liberals love works, for every winner there has to be a loser. 

No, not at all - there is no such assumption, and it would be unrealistic - history tells us that markets move in cycles, but they are hardly smooth and predictable, with lots of bumps along the way! You can apply the decelerating future growth as a negative if you wish, it accentuates the losses accordingly. Have a look at the most recent property Bust in the USA - NOBODY benefited out of that, for every Loser there were MORE LOSERS - people were leaving the house keys in the front door and walking away, creating Ghost Towns in the Mortgage Belt - there was nobody taking advantage in that case, other than repo agents and the like - even the banks had to be bailed out by the Federal Reserve, so EVERYONE LOST.

Do you know why we are interested in what industry your in? Because you keep claiming you'll do well out of it but then talk in riddles about exactly how and why and yet you also keep banging on about how bad the policy is, you can't have it both ways, either your lieing that you'll do well out of it or your dislike of it comes from your hatred of the left, don't try pretend you just care how other people will fare out of that, we all know that isn't true.

Afros, what does it matter what the industry is? Take your pick! You said it, for every winner, there has to be a loser! Whale picked out a bunch of industries that would somehow benefit ... but the fact is, everyone would be taking a massive step backward financially to start with, if property values went backwards and we were tipped into a recession. AND I HAVE SAID IT SEVERAL TIMES, THE BENEFIT I WILL GLEAN, AND TRUST ME, I WILL BE BUSY, WILL BE OFFSET BY THE GENERAL PROPERTY VALUE LOSSES, and ECONOMIC LOSSES ... same as everyone in all of those industries and businesses that Whale suggested and dozens of others - in the end NOBODY WILL WIN! 

So I'm not lying, I don't lie, plenty of dick heads have accused me of that, but never put up! ... why would you bother lying in an anonymous online forum? 

I don't hate the left, I don't hate anyone on the left (apart from Malcolm of course!Angry) in fact, I have great friends who are left-wing nutter ideologues - I call them idiots and they reciprocate! I do get frustrated with, and I disagree with a lot of their policies and ideologies - I don't think that is "Breaking News" though! 

The facts are, this policy is;
1. Poorly thought through 
2. Poorly articulated ... why is it so hard to find the facts - the virtue signaling "message" - Rob from the "rich" despised property investors, and give to the "poor" first Home Buyer/victim is clear though!  
3. CERTAIN to cause losses to property owners - THEY ADMIT IT! ... and it must if as they claim, it helps First Home Buyers and housing affordability - that makes sense if nothing else does!!!
4. UNCOSTED ... why won't they offer some numbers as I have? ... is it because the numbers are worse than they had ever imagined? ... remember, this was proposed 3 years ago, at the 11th hour of an election that they didn't think they could win going in ... and it has NOT been reviewed since, and the economy and markets are totally different.
5. Has a "Butterfly Effect" - they have not considered the direct consequences properly - the certainly have not considered the unintended consequences, none of which is "good".

Again, this is simply NOT a policy that can achieve anything beneficial, not even a break even, on the best scenarios ... and the worst outcome - which of course everyone would hope against ... but, which tend to come with the ALP's economic policies ... is a catastrophe.

Our economy is thriving at present Afros - as a society, we have never lived a better lifestyle or been so prosperous - we will be in budget deficit soon, and we can then start addressing debt ... why would we want to change what is not broken?


What do you think - turned over a new leaf - get it green - leaf!Wink




In reference to every post in the Trump thread ... "There may have been a tiny bit of license taken there" ... Ok, Thanks for the "heads up" PT!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dr E Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 2018 at 5:01pm
Originally posted by Whale Whale wrote:

Originally posted by Dr E Dr E wrote:

[QUOTE=Whale]


Where is this from Whale, or did you draft it yourself? ... nice work if so!Clap





Surely you jest LOL  It is from one of those property spruikers whose newsletters I receive 

OK ... so he doesn't seem to argue that the ALP Policy is damaging, he says that they have done things to "minimise" the damage ... I agree with that. 
In reference to every post in the Trump thread ... "There may have been a tiny bit of license taken there" ... Ok, Thanks for the "heads up" PT!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dr E Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 2018 at 5:09pm
Originally posted by rusty nails rusty nails wrote:

What?
The ALP policy doesn’t have changes in it,that will identify anybody who knows how to benefit from it.
I’m now not even asking for industry details,just an explanation of which particular changes will improve profitability.

Then an explanation of why would anyone who’s going to benefit so substantially, be so demented in their opposition to this very policy that’s going to entich them.

If you read the policy, you can have a guess!

Whale did it with ease, and identified several businesses/industries that would certainly be busier, but as I have said, EVERYONE IS WORSE OFF in a property market crash and a recession - you still need customers who can afford to pay - hard if unemployment goes to double digits!Dead

In reference to every post in the Trump thread ... "There may have been a tiny bit of license taken there" ... Ok, Thanks for the "heads up" PT!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dr E Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 2018 at 5:17pm
Originally posted by Redemption Redemption wrote:

What isnt said, is that if you buy a property at $1 million, and it flatlines, and worth $1 million, you are still making a major loss, as your mortgage repayments, debt to property, makes you miles behind.

Many people bought to "Reno", in the trendy "buy and reno" period, due to tv shows etc, and now have huge mortgages, and even if the market just flatlined, didnt go up, nor down, they are still making major losses, as they are paying debts to properties that simply flatlined.

So the whole business of, "oh market down 5%", isnt really even factoring that if the market sat at 0%, flatline, its still a huge loss for property owners.

Australian Bureau of Statistics released data, saying that its cheaper to rent longterm, than be a property owner. There are many unsaid costs to being a property owner.
Its cheaper to rent longterm, and that is a statistical fact.



This guy https://www.yourempire.com.au/team/chris-gray/ has been a renter all his life! ... a "rentvestor".
In reference to every post in the Trump thread ... "There may have been a tiny bit of license taken there" ... Ok, Thanks for the "heads up" PT!
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Dr E View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dr E Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 2018 at 5:26pm
Try this;

https://www.yourempire.com.au

Chris Gray - rent's multi-million dollar properties where he WANTS to live in at a tiny cost compared to owning, buys investment properties where real people live and gets the right yields ... anyone can do that, even the poor first home buyer ... just need a job and negative gearing!Wink
In reference to every post in the Trump thread ... "There may have been a tiny bit of license taken there" ... Ok, Thanks for the "heads up" PT!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rusty nails Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Dec 2018 at 6:37am
Wow,
You really don’t have a fcucking clue.

That’s not investment advice you clown,that’s a commission agent touting for business....
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dr E Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Dec 2018 at 1:59pm
LOL
Originally posted by rusty nails rusty nails wrote:

Wow,
You really don’t have a fcucking clue.

That’s not investment advice you clown,that’s a commission agent touting for business....

So, what do YOU charge for advice?LOLLOLLOL
In reference to every post in the Trump thread ... "There may have been a tiny bit of license taken there" ... Ok, Thanks for the "heads up" PT!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dr E Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Dec 2018 at 2:00pm
Welfare cheques don't count as "commissions from my Government Contract" either!Embarrassed
In reference to every post in the Trump thread ... "There may have been a tiny bit of license taken there" ... Ok, Thanks for the "heads up" PT!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rusty nails Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Dec 2018 at 2:10pm
Originally posted by Dr E Dr E wrote:

LOL
Originally posted by rusty nails rusty nails wrote:

Wow,
You really don’t have a fcucking clue.

That’s not investment advice you clown,that’s a commission agent touting for business....

So, what do YOU charge for advice?LOLLOLLOL

You think you could afford my rates?

From the bits you’ve shared on here, you’re not in the ballpark.

But that’s ok,I don’t bag you for being a battler.
I bag you for the way you behave on here.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote maccamax Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Dec 2018 at 7:30pm
Originally posted by rusty nails rusty nails wrote:

Originally posted by Dr E Dr E wrote:

LOL
Originally posted by rusty nails rusty nails wrote:

Wow,
You really don’t have a fcucking clue.

That’s not investment advice you clown,that’s a commission agent touting for business....

So, what do YOU charge for advice?LOLLOLLOL

You think you could afford my rates?

From the bits you’ve shared on here, you’re not in the ballpark.

But that’s ok,I don’t bag you for being a battler.
I bag you for the way you behave on here.


   Your a numbers man Rusty
Good at the competitive games
   Doc has done a Jeff Horn on most of you
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rusty nails Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Dec 2018 at 7:51pm
If Doc is Jeff Horn, then i’m Terence Crawford
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote maccamax Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Dec 2018 at 8:00pm
Originally posted by rusty nails rusty nails wrote:

If Doc is Jeff Horn, then i’m Terence Crawford


hahahahah   Grandiose a lot.

Unless your line of knowledge is divulged of course .

   Maths teacher maybe , without Real Estate experience. ( how is my guess )
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rusty nails Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Dec 2018 at 8:20pm
Going to be a looong 2 weeks for you as well,by looks of it.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote maccamax Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Dec 2018 at 8:26pm
Originally posted by rusty nails rusty nails wrote:

Going to be a looong 2 weeks for you as well,by looks of it.

   Tell me why Rusty ... Am I missing something

     Comp been down again .
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dr E Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Dec 2018 at 12:03am
Originally posted by maccamax maccamax wrote:

Originally posted by rusty nails rusty nails wrote:

If Doc is Jeff Horn, then i’m Terence Crawford


hahahahah   Grandiose a lot.

Unless your line of knowledge is divulged of course .

   Maths teacher maybe , without Real Estate experience. ( how is my guess )

Unemployed something or other would be my guess - no wait, make that unemployable.

Ask a simple question like what will the ALP Neg Gearing and CGT Policy cost residential property holders and he just goes off on a myriad of totally irrelevant tangents, and then abuses you!Clown

Imagine if you employed him, and told him to go to Office Works and buy a pad of verbal agreement forms - he'd be the one to come back with a left-handed screwdriver, for sure!
In reference to every post in the Trump thread ... "There may have been a tiny bit of license taken there" ... Ok, Thanks for the "heads up" PT!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dr E Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Dec 2018 at 12:09am
Originally posted by maccamax maccamax wrote:

Originally posted by rusty nails rusty nails wrote:

If Doc is Jeff Horn, then i’m Terence Crawford


hahahahah   Grandiose a lot.

Unless your line of knowledge is divulged of course .

   Maths teacher maybe , without Real Estate experience. ( how is my guess )

I think he means Michael Crawford macca - this exactly as I imagine rusty, but not as smart.

"Bettttyyyy ... the cat did a whoopsie in my beret ....!"Cry


In reference to every post in the Trump thread ... "There may have been a tiny bit of license taken there" ... Ok, Thanks for the "heads up" PT!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rusty nails Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Dec 2018 at 7:32am
Oh dear,
Someone’s going to do it tough for a couple of weeks
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oneonesit Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Dec 2018 at 7:43am
Originally posted by rusty nails rusty nails wrote:

Oh dear,
Someone’s going to do it tough for a couple of weeks
May well be you Rusty. You do realise you & Doc are in a symbiotic relationship don't you. Anyhow, good luck with that
Refer ALP Election Promises
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rusty nails Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Dec 2018 at 8:11am
tough couple of weeks for you as well by the looks of it....
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dr E Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Dec 2018 at 8:46am
I bet they don't even miss you in the circle jerk rusty!LOL
In reference to every post in the Trump thread ... "There may have been a tiny bit of license taken there" ... Ok, Thanks for the "heads up" PT!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Whale Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Dec 2018 at 9:00am
Originally posted by Dr E Dr E wrote:

I bet they don't even miss you in the circle jerk rusty!LOL

Doc's fav topic Embarrassed
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Whale Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Dec 2018 at 9:05am
I see Gay updated SUSPENDEES thread, I sort of feel neglected that I am not there LOL

23 days to Christmas
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote maccamax Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Dec 2018 at 9:28am
Originally posted by Whale Whale wrote:

I see Gay updated SUSPENDEES thread, I sort of feel neglected that I am not there LOL

23 days to Christmas



PT has done a marvelous job on you Whale.

     I'd say he has you on Middy's and off the schooners & pints .

Top marks for your return to form ...     Jeff Horn would be proud.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oneonesit Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Dec 2018 at 9:33am
Originally posted by maccamax maccamax wrote:

Originally posted by Whale Whale wrote:

I see Gay updated SUSPENDEES thread, I sort of feel neglected that I am not there LOL

23 days to Christmas



PT has done a marvelous job on you Whale.

     I'd say he has you on Middy's and off the schooners & pints .

Top marks for your return to form ...     Jeff Horn would be proud.
Yes well done Whale. You have become boring & predictable - but hey - at least your active & out from under that grey blanket.
Refer ALP Election Promises
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