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Folau - Higgins/Lehrmann P193

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djebel View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Apr 2019 at 1:19pm
Let's be fair dinkum the Folau tweets would not be an issue if it was not for the boss of Qantas. But I guess you guys and guys have discussed that in the previous 10 pages.


reductio ad absurdum
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oneonesit Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Apr 2019 at 2:40pm
I agree djebel. No one was going to stop watching / supporting the game based on Folau's comments. I mean who on here follow his Instagram posts ?Absolute beat up - he is a religious nutter as you say - & he is only saying stuff that you can here at the Domain any day of the week as you pass by. It certainly has been blown up by the Qantus sponsorship led by the the little Irish twat. If Joyce & Castle want to go around getting their photos taken at every Gay function going then they are setting themselves up for some backlash - which has happened. Joyce is also fully exposed on his involvement with Emirates - showing he is no better than what some are accusing Folau as (a hypocrite). And just how well is this "inclusiveness" stuff been helping the game anyway ? - its on its bloody knees. Maybe they should be targeting the bogan rednecks- probably do a whole lot better (couldn't be much worse)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote acacia alba Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Apr 2019 at 12:36am
Dont have sex I suppose ????  Confused
animals before people.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oneonesit Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Apr 2019 at 1:08pm
Originally posted by Whale Whale wrote:

Originally posted by Tlazolteotl Tlazolteotl wrote:

The reason Father Folau feels free to dispense Biblical advice to drunks, fornicators and homosexuals is that he, as a former drunken fornicator, has reformed and therefore not going to hell. Does Father Folau think that people choose to be homosexual and can therefore reform from homosexuality?

When you tease out most of the BS in the Bible you can see how primitive and ignorant it is. Why, you would think it was written thousands of years ago by primitive, ignorant, pre-science goat-herders or whatever they were.

No doubt the bible is a product of the beliefs of he time, purported to be god's word to give it more authority, but i doubt if it was written by goat herders. Would have been penned by the elite, literate , intellectuals of the time, no doubt high in the religion's  hierarchy
How about this. We all know we are all going to be wiped out from Climate Change anytime soon - so we should print off all the TBV threads ( since I've been on here anyway) - give them a quick once over (bin all the real lefty/racing /Trump gumpth) - & put it in a nice safe time capsule. To think our stuff might be getting quoted in 5000 years time rocks my boat
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oneonesit Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Apr 2019 at 1:27pm
Originally posted by Whale Whale wrote:

Originally posted by oneonesit oneonesit wrote:

Originally posted by rusty nails rusty nails wrote:

You cant ignore the brouhaha around the first offence a year ago.

RA made it crystal clear about their expectations, in regards to his views being broadcast in social media.

Izzie made several statements about the fact that he would not back down in his beliefs,and would walk away if it became untenable.

So its clear he understood where the line was.
"I had no idea* wont wash here

  Just reading this again. So if Izzy was showing defiance as you say - what did he actually formally sign to in the formal warning ? And secondly, if he was saying he would not back down on his beliefs - why would RA resign him to a new $4 million contract 12 months later with "no" extra protection in it. Silks will have a field day with that stuff i would have thought.

no why would he sign it with that clause rather than refuse at the time? Seems principles are trumped by cash, he wants it both wats
Fair comment. Thing is we don't really know what clauses were in the contract or what he actually signed off on the formal warning. What we do know is that RA saw fit to want to strengthen the social media clauses retrospectively a few months back.See his idea of terms like "inclusiveness" & "damage to the game" - assuming that was the sort of wording used in his contract - would be different to how you & i might see it. For example, he keeps saying this stuff was said with love - & that he wanted to help all these sinners become part of the kingdom of god. To him - that is being inclusive. All about interpretation. So Rusty is correct - it will all be about what the contract & formal warning actually says
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oneonesit Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Apr 2019 at 2:46pm
The relationship between RA & Qantus - & Castle & Joyce - has resulted in RA being a target for activists on both sides of this. Obvious battleground. Hopefully it will be the final straw to kill the game off completely. Too many footy codes in this country already
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dr E Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Apr 2019 at 1:22am
Originally posted by Daraabah Daraabah wrote:

Originally posted by oneonesit oneonesit wrote:

Originally posted by Whale Whale wrote:

Originally posted by oneonesit oneonesit wrote:

Originally posted by rusty nails rusty nails wrote:

You cant ignore the brouhaha around the first offence a year ago.

RA made it crystal clear about their expectations, in regards to his views being broadcast in social media.

Izzie made several statements about the fact that he would not back down in his beliefs,and would walk away if it became untenable.

So its clear he understood where the line was.
"I had no idea* wont wash here

  Just reading this again. So if Izzy was showing defiance as you say - what did he actually formally sign to in the formal warning ? And secondly, if he was saying he would not back down on his beliefs - why would RA resign him to a new $4 million contract 12 months later with "no" extra protection in it. Silks will have a field day with that stuff i would have thought.

no why would he sign it with that clause rather than refuse at the time? Seems principles are trumped by cash, he wants it both wats
Fair comment. Thing is we don't really know what clauses were in the contract or what he actually signed off on the formal warning. What we do know is that RA saw fit to want to strengthen the social media clauses retrospectively a few months back.See his idea of terms like "inclusiveness" & "damage to the game" - assuming that was the sort of wording used in his contract - would be different to how you & i might see it. For example, he keeps saying this stuff was said with love - & that he wanted to help all these sinners become part of the kingdom of god. To him - that is being inclusive. All about interpretation. So Rusty is correct - it will all be about what the contract & formal warning actually says

Well we do know that RA has said this is an issue about the responsibilities of employees to abide by their employers 'policies and procedures' and 'adhere to their values'.

So as RA has publicly stated it's values are 'inclusiveness,' 'equity' and 'embedding respectful relationships in the workplace', there must be something included in Folau's contract to the effect that Christian values are excluded from their definitions of inclusiveness, equity and respect.

Clap ... similarly with QANTAS's arrangements with Emirates and Islamic values ... and with American Airlines and Christian values ... has Mr Joyce "come out" anywhere else than in Australia?
In reference to every post in the Trump thread ... "There may have been a tiny bit of license taken there" ... Ok, Thanks for the "heads up" PT!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Whale Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Apr 2019 at 2:04pm
Originally posted by djebel djebel wrote:

Let's be fair dinkum the Folau tweets would not be an issue if it was not for the boss of Qantas. But I guess you guys and guys have discussed that in the previous 10 pages.




Totally incorrect, with the sensitivities these days no sponsor wants to be associated with those sort of comments.
  Is a slur on Joyce
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oneonesit Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Apr 2019 at 2:55pm
Originally posted by Daraabah Daraabah wrote:

Originally posted by oneonesit oneonesit wrote:

Originally posted by Whale Whale wrote:

Originally posted by oneonesit oneonesit wrote:

Originally posted by rusty nails rusty nails wrote:

You cant ignore the brouhaha around the first offence a year ago.

RA made it crystal clear about their expectations, in regards to his views being broadcast in social media.

Izzie made several statements about the fact that he would not back down in his beliefs,and would walk away if it became untenable.

So its clear he understood where the line was.
"I had no idea* wont wash here

  Just reading this again. So if Izzy was showing defiance as you say - what did he actually formally sign to in the formal warning ? And secondly, if he was saying he would not back down on his beliefs - why would RA resign him to a new $4 million contract 12 months later with "no" extra protection in it. Silks will have a field day with that stuff i would have thought.

no why would he sign it with that clause rather than refuse at the time? Seems principles are trumped by cash, he wants it both wats
Fair comment. Thing is we don't really know what clauses were in the contract or what he actually signed off on the formal warning. What we do know is that RA saw fit to want to strengthen the social media clauses retrospectively a few months back.See his idea of terms like "inclusiveness" & "damage to the game" - assuming that was the sort of wording used in his contract - would be different to how you & i might see it. For example, he keeps saying this stuff was said with love - & that he wanted to help all these sinners become part of the kingdom of god. To him - that is being inclusive. All about interpretation. So Rusty is correct - it will all be about what the contract & formal warning actually says

Well we do know that RA has said this is an issue about the responsibilities of employees to abide by their employers 'policies and procedures' and 'adhere to their values'.

So as RA has publicly stated it's values are 'inclusiveness,' 'equity' and 'embedding respectful relationships in the workplace', there must be something included in Folau's contract to the effect that Christian values are excluded from their definitions of inclusiveness, equity and respect.
Correct - in a nutshell. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dr E Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Apr 2019 at 1:25am
Originally posted by djebel djebel wrote:

Originally posted by acacia alba acacia alba wrote:

Geeez,   Djebel, you must have a miserable life if you think like that.  Unless of course you are in heaven and the rest of us are in hell.

I am an atheist. 

Surely nobody seriously believes all this religious nonsense ?

Although as a wise man once said, Better to be safe than sorry. 


Clap

All you have to do is repent ... apparently everything is forgiven ... just don't go dying in your sleep djebel!LOL
In reference to every post in the Trump thread ... "There may have been a tiny bit of license taken there" ... Ok, Thanks for the "heads up" PT!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Passing Through Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Apr 2019 at 12:56pm
He also understood that saying he would walk away for his belief was tantamount to a concession of breach and that it would mean forfeiting his $4m. Challenging on some spurious religious beliefs furphy gives him the opportunity to argue for a settlement.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Carioca Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Apr 2019 at 2:10pm
Originally posted by oneonesit oneonesit wrote:

Originally posted by oneonesit oneonesit wrote:

Originally posted by TJMitchell TJMitchell wrote:

I got one.

Proverbs 31:6 
“Let beer be for those who are perishing, wine for those who are in anguish!”
Jesus - not much of a choice. On balance i'll settle for the wine LOL
  Were does OP rum fit in ?

Just before the beer chaser.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Whale Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Apr 2019 at 3:14pm
Originally posted by djebel djebel wrote:

Originally posted by acacia alba acacia alba wrote:

Geeez,   Djebel, you must have a miserable life if you think like that.  Unless of course you are in heaven and the rest of us are in hell.

I am an atheist. 

Surely nobody seriously believes all this religious nonsense ?

Although as a wise man once said, Better to be safe than sorry. 



Hatch does
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TIGER Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Apr 2019 at 9:57am
Folau is right though, Easter and Xmas are pagan holidays
EAD
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Passing Through Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Apr 2019 at 1:10pm
Jesus said ''Blessed are the cheese-makers''

You have red win with cheese, so it is pretty clear.





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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Apr 2019 at 2:34pm
Originally posted by acacia alba acacia alba wrote:

Geeez,   Djebel, you must have a miserable life if you think like that.  Unless of course you are in heaven and the rest of us are in hell.

I am an atheist. 

Surely nobody seriously believes all this religious nonsense ?

Although as a wise man once said, Better to be safe than sorry. 


reductio ad absurdum
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TJMitchell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Apr 2019 at 11:22pm
How does someone repent their sexual preference exactly?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oneonesit Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Apr 2019 at 12:58pm
Former NSW Supreme Court judge Anthony Whealy says Folaus case was a "legal & moral minefield". "The topics of religious discrimination, discrimination against gay people, & the right of employees to express personal views on social media raise complicated & uncertain times". "He speaks from a genuinely & deeply held religious view". "He is otherwise a person of exemplary character & his opinions, whilst offensive to some,are more or less consistent with a point of view not uncommonly expressed in churches & mosques around Australia". "Freedom of speech & religious freedom issues could form part of his defense". With respect to his breach of contract with RA - "it seems likely there are no specific provisions in his contact prohibiting him from expressing publicly his religious convictions". The formal warning may off-set some of that. Muddying the water is an overriding unfair dismissal case - re comparison to Beale, Slipper & Hunt. "They were charged with incidents that brought the game into disrepute - inappropriate text messaging or drug use -  but where allowed to stay in the game, whereas Folaus crime was quoting the bible". As to whether the case goes onto costly court action will be in Folaus hands - his acceptance of the Conduct panels findings or whether he wants to take it further."A legal fight could be avoided by paying out his contract, but either way it shapes as a costly exercise"
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TJMitchell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Apr 2019 at 1:03pm
I was hoping John would have something about Gin somewhere...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote acacia alba Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Apr 2019 at 2:26pm
Geeez,   Djebel, you must have a miserable life if you think like that.  Unless of course you are in heaven and the rest of us are in hell.
animals before people.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TJMitchell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Apr 2019 at 6:55pm
Originally posted by oneonesit oneonesit wrote:

I cant cop it - however for the past few thousand years it has been a pretty popular belief system. We cant deny that. And Folaus comments would have been the norm for most of it - & the so called "inclusive" ones would be getting burnt at the stake. Think a bit more tolerance needs to be shown from both sides. Not taking away a blokes livelihood & his joy of playing a game he loves would be a nice start 

Not telling someone they'll go to hell for their sexual preference would be an even better one. However I don't think tearing up his contract is the solution either.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oneonesit Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Apr 2019 at 12:13pm
Gee Tlazz - you almost made me choke on my high fibre fruit enriched muelsi then. Goat-herders......my initial read was goat- ......something else  LOL 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oneonesit Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Apr 2019 at 12:56pm
Originally posted by oneonesit oneonesit wrote:

Originally posted by TJMitchell TJMitchell wrote:

I got one.

Proverbs 31:6 
“Let beer be for those who are perishing, wine for those who are in anguish!”
Jesus - not much of a choice. On balance i'll settle for the wine LOL
  Were does OP rum fit in ?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Apr 2019 at 2:12pm
Originally posted by Whale Whale wrote:

Originally posted by djebel djebel wrote:

Let's be fair dinkum the Folau tweets would not be an issue if it was not for the boss of Qantas. But I guess you guys and guys have discussed that in the previous 10 pages.




Totally incorrect, with the sensitivities these days no sponsor wants to be associated with those sort of comments.
  Is a slur on Joyce

They were religious nutter comments. They have garnished far more attention than they deserve.

NOBODY IS GOING TO HEAVEN.

NOBODY IS GOING TO HELL.

We are already there.

 
reductio ad absurdum
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I cant cop it - however for the past few thousand years it has been a pretty popular belief system. We cant deny that. And Folaus comments would have been the norm for most of it - & the so called "inclusive" ones would be getting burnt at the stake. Think a bit more tolerance needs to be shown from both sides. Not taking away a blokes livelihood & his joy of playing a game he loves would be a nice start 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tlazolteotl Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Apr 2019 at 12:02pm
The reason Father Folau feels free to dispense Biblical advice to drunks, fornicators and homosexuals is that he, as a former drunken fornicator, has reformed and therefore not going to hell. Does Father Folau think that people choose to be homosexual and can therefore reform from homosexuality?

When you tease out most of the BS in the Bible you can see how primitive and ignorant it is. Why, you would think it was written thousands of years ago by primitive, ignorant, pre-science goat-herders or whatever they were.
An honest politician is one who when he is bought will stay bought.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Whale Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Apr 2019 at 1:06pm
Originally posted by oneonesit oneonesit wrote:

Originally posted by rusty nails rusty nails wrote:

You cant ignore the brouhaha around the first offence a year ago.

RA made it crystal clear about their expectations, in regards to his views being broadcast in social media.

Izzie made several statements about the fact that he would not back down in his beliefs,and would walk away if it became untenable.

So its clear he understood where the line was.
"I had no idea* wont wash here

  Just reading this again. So if Izzy was showing defiance as you say - what did he actually formally sign to in the formal warning ? And secondly, if he was saying he would not back down on his beliefs - why would RA resign him to a new $4 million contract 12 months later with "no" extra protection in it. Silks will have a field day with that stuff i would have thought.

no why would he sign it with that clause rather than refuse at the time? Seems principles are trumped by cash, he wants it both wats
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Daraabah Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Apr 2019 at 2:28pm
Originally posted by oneonesit oneonesit wrote:

Originally posted by Whale Whale wrote:

Originally posted by oneonesit oneonesit wrote:

Originally posted by rusty nails rusty nails wrote:

You cant ignore the brouhaha around the first offence a year ago.

RA made it crystal clear about their expectations, in regards to his views being broadcast in social media.

Izzie made several statements about the fact that he would not back down in his beliefs,and would walk away if it became untenable.

So its clear he understood where the line was.
"I had no idea* wont wash here

  Just reading this again. So if Izzy was showing defiance as you say - what did he actually formally sign to in the formal warning ? And secondly, if he was saying he would not back down on his beliefs - why would RA resign him to a new $4 million contract 12 months later with "no" extra protection in it. Silks will have a field day with that stuff i would have thought.

no why would he sign it with that clause rather than refuse at the time? Seems principles are trumped by cash, he wants it both wats
Fair comment. Thing is we don't really know what clauses were in the contract or what he actually signed off on the formal warning. What we do know is that RA saw fit to want to strengthen the social media clauses retrospectively a few months back.See his idea of terms like "inclusiveness" & "damage to the game" - assuming that was the sort of wording used in his contract - would be different to how you & i might see it. For example, he keeps saying this stuff was said with love - & that he wanted to help all these sinners become part of the kingdom of god. To him - that is being inclusive. All about interpretation. So Rusty is correct - it will all be about what the contract & formal warning actually says

Well we do know that RA has said this is an issue about the responsibilities of employees to abide by their employers 'policies and procedures' and 'adhere to their values'.

So as RA has publicly stated it's values are 'inclusiveness,' 'equity' and 'embedding respectful relationships in the workplace', there must be something included in Folau's contract to the effect that Christian values are excluded from their definitions of inclusiveness, equity and respect.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shrunk in the Wash Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Apr 2019 at 10:46pm
Originally posted by TJMitchell TJMitchell wrote:

Originally posted by oneonesit oneonesit wrote:

I cant cop it - however for the past few thousand years it has been a pretty popular belief system. We cant deny that. And Folaus comments would have been the norm for most of it - & the so called "inclusive" ones would be getting burnt at the stake. Think a bit more tolerance needs to be shown from both sides. Not taking away a blokes livelihood & his joy of playing a game he loves would be a nice start 


Not telling someone they'll go to hell for their sexual preference would be an even better one. However I don't think tearing up his contract is the solution either.


TJ
Is that what he said? I do recall he said IF you don’t repent
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Whale Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Apr 2019 at 12:42pm
Originally posted by Tlazolteotl Tlazolteotl wrote:

The reason Father Folau feels free to dispense Biblical advice to drunks, fornicators and homosexuals is that he, as a former drunken fornicator, has reformed and therefore not going to hell. Does Father Folau think that people choose to be homosexual and can therefore reform from homosexuality?

When you tease out most of the BS in the Bible you can see how primitive and ignorant it is. Why, you would think it was written thousands of years ago by primitive, ignorant, pre-science goat-herders or whatever they were.

No doubt the bible is a product of the beliefs of he time, purported to be god's word to give it more authority, but i doubt if it was written by goat herders. Would have been penned by the elite, literate , intellectuals of the time, no doubt high in the religion's  hierarchy
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