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First time breeder

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diomed View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote diomed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: First time breeder
    Posted: 07 Mar 2018 at 5:13am
I live in Ireland.
In December 2017 I picked a mare from the Arqana Breeding Stock Sale, Deauville, France catalogue.
The stud owner travelled there, bought the mare, and brought her back to Co Tipperary.
The mare never ran.  She had a filly foal at the end of February by Olympic Glory.

My planned mating (booked) is the Australian sire Epasulette with the mare Aksaray (2012) by Orpen (out of Anatolie by Peintre Celebre out of Anacapri by Anabaa out of Unopposed by Sadler's Wells out of Midnight Lady by Mill Reef out of Mia Pola by Relko.)
I am laying out the full dam line in the hope that someone can put the pedigree on screen (don't know how).

The pedigree has plenty of interesting  inbreeding, although I would prefer if some of it was not there.
Any comments appreciated, positive or negative.
kincsem
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Gay3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Mar 2018 at 6:22am
Sorry for the lack of size, it's the best I can do Smile
Pretty impressive in & linebreeding Big smile




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Gay3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Mar 2018 at 6:41am
Epaulette/Aksaray (XXXX) - X - 16c
by Epaulette out of Aksaray by Orpen to 7 generations
Epaulette
2009
Commands
1996
Danehill
1986
Danzig
1977
Northern Dancer
1961
Nearctic
1954
Nearco
Lady Angela
1935 - 4-r
1944 - 14-c
Natalma
1957
Native Dancer
Almahmoud
1950 - 5-f
1947 - 2-d
Pas De Nom
1968
Admiral's Voyage
1959
Crafty Admiral
Olympia Lou
1948 - 8-c
1952 - 4-n
Petitioner
1952
Petition
Steady Aim
1944 - 16-h
1943 - 7-a
Razyana
1981
His Majesty
1968
Ribot
1952
Tenerani
Romanella
1944 - 6-d
1943 - 4-l
Flower Bowl
1952
Alibhai
Flower Bed
1938 - 6-d
1946 - 4-d
Spring Adieu
1974
Buckpasser
1963
Tom Fool
Busanda
1949 - 3-j
1947 - 1-x
Natalma
1957
Native Dancer
Almahmoud
1950 - 5-f
1947 - 2-d
Cotehele House
1980
My Swanee
1963
Petition
1944
Fair Trial
1932
Fairway
Lady Juror
1925 - 13-e
1919 - 9-c
Art Paper
1933
Artist's Proof
Quire
1926 - 14-f
1918 - 16-h
Grey Rhythm
1954
Grey Sovereign
1948
Nasrullah
Kong
1940 - 9-c
1933 - 6-f
Metronome
1945
Solferino
Golden Meter
1940 - 19-b
1932 - 8-j
Eight Carat
1975
Pieces Of Eight
1963
Relic
1945
War Relic
Bridal Colors
1938 - 1-o
1931 - 8-f
Baby Doll II
1956
Dante
Bebe Grande
1942 - 3-n
1950 - 3-o
Klairessa
1969
Klairon
1952
Clarion
Kalmia
1944 - 1-n
1931 - 1-w
Courtessa
1955
Supreme Court
Tessa Gillian
1948 - 14-c
1950 - 9-c
Accessories
2003
Singspiel
1992
In The Wings
1986
Sadler's Wells
1981
Northern Dancer
1961
Nearctic
Natalma
1954 - 14-c
1957 - 2-d
Fairy Bridge
1975
Bold Reason
Special
1968 - 19-b
1969 - 5-h
High Hawk
1980
Shirley Heights
1975
Mill Reef
Hardiemma
1968 - 22-d
1969 - 1-l
Sunbittern
1970
Sea Hawk II
Pantoufle
1963 - 3-f
1964 - 9-e
Glorious Song
1976
Halo
1969
Hail To Reason
1958
Turn-To
Nothirdchance
1951 - 1-w
1948 - 4-n
Cosmah
1953
Cosmic Bomb
Almahmoud
1944 - 14-f
1947 - 2-d
Ballade
1972
Herbager
1956
Vandale
Flagette
1943 - 3-c
1951 - 16-c
Miss Swapsco
1965
Cohoes
Soaring
1954 - 1-x
1960 - 12-c
Anna Matrushka
1984
Mill Reef
1968
Never Bend
1960
Nasrullah
1940
Nearco
Mumtaz Begum
1935 - 4-r
1932 - 9-c
Lalun
1952
Djeddah
Be Faithful
1945 - 13-c
1942 - 19-b
Milan Mill
1962
Princequillo
1940
Prince Rose
Cosquilla
1928 - 10-c
1933 - 1-b
Virginia Water
1953
Count Fleet
Red Ray
1940 - 6
1947 - 22-d
Anna Paola
1978
Prince Ippi
1969
Imperial
1960
Imi
Hurry
1953 - 3-o
1952 - 8-c
Prinzess Addi
1955
Agamemnon
Pindarella
1941 - 9-h
1938 - 1-s
Antwerpen
1972
Waldcanter
1956
Caran D'Ache
Wappenau
1949 - 4-p
1947 - 4-o
Adelsweihe
1954
Wahnfried
Addis Abeba
1933 - 4-o
1949 - 7-f
Aksaray
2012
Orpen
1996
Lure
1989
Danzig
1977
Northern Dancer
1961
Nearctic
1954
Nearco
Lady Angela
1935 - 4-r
1944 - 14-c
Natalma
1957
Native Dancer
Almahmoud
1950 - 5-f
1947 - 2-d
Pas De Nom
1968
Admiral's Voyage
1959
Crafty Admiral
Olympia Lou
1948 - 8-c
1952 - 4-n
Petitioner
1952
Petition
Steady Aim
1944 - 16-h
1943 - 7-a
Endear
1982
Alydar
1975
Raise A Native
1961
Native Dancer
Raise You
1950 - 5-f
1946 - 8-f
Sweet Tooth
1965
On-And-on
Plum Cake
1956 - 23-b
1958 - 9-c
Chappaquiddick
1968
Relic
1945
War Relic
Bridal Colors
1938 - 1-o
1931 - 8-f
Baby Doll II
1956
Dante
Bebe Grande
1942 - 3-n
1950 - 3-o
Bonita Francita
1987
Devil's Bag
1981
Halo
1969
Hail To Reason
1958
Turn-To
Nothirdchance
1951 - 1-w
1948 - 4-n
Cosmah
1953
Cosmic Bomb
Almahmoud
1944 - 14-f
1947 - 2-d
Ballade
1972
Herbager
1956
Vandale
Flagette
1943 - 3-c
1951 - 16-c
Miss Swapsco
1965
Cohoes
Soaring
1954 - 1-x
1960 - 12-c
Raise The Standard
1978
Hoist The Flag
1968
Tom Rolfe
1962
Ribot
Pocahontas
1952 - 4-l
1955 - 9-h
Wavy Navy
1954
War Admiral
Triomphe
1934 - 11-b
1947 - 5-i
Natalma
1957
Native Dancer
1950
Polynesian
Geisha
1942 - 14-a
1943 - 5-f
Almahmoud
1947
Mahmoud
Arbitrator
1933 - 9-c
1937 - 2-d
Anatolie
2006
Peintre Celebre
1994
Nureyev
1977
Northern Dancer
1961
Nearctic
1954
Nearco
Lady Angela
1935 - 4-r
1944 - 14-c
Natalma
1957
Native Dancer
Almahmoud
1950 - 5-f
1947 - 2-d
Special
1969
Forli
1963
Aristophanes
Trevisa
1948 - 9-c
1951 - 3-b
Thong
1964
Nantallah
Rough Shod
1953 - 6
1944 - 5-h
Peinture Bleue
1987
Alydar
1975
Raise A Native
1961
Native Dancer
Raise You
1950 - 5-f
1946 - 8-f
Sweet Tooth
1965
On-And-on
Plum Cake
1956 - 23-b
1958 - 9-c
Petroleuse
1978
Habitat
1966
Sir Gaylord
Little Hut
1959 - 2-s
1952 - 4-r
Plencia
1968
Le Haar
Petite Saguenay
1954 - 20-a
1961 - 9
Anacapri
2000
Anabaa
1992
Danzig
1977
Northern Dancer
1961
Nearctic
Natalma
1954 - 14-c
1957 - 2-d
Pas De Nom
1968
Admiral's Voyage
Petitioner
1959 - 4-n
1952 - 7-a
Balbonella
1984
Gay Mecene
1975
Vaguely Noble
Gay Missile
1965 - 1-d
1967 - 3-l
Bamieres
1978
Riverman
Bergamasque
1969 - 10-a
1969 - 1-n
Unopposed
1991
Sadler's Wells
1981
Northern Dancer
1961
Nearctic
Natalma
1954 - 14-c
1957 - 2-d
Fairy Bridge
1975
Bold Reason
Special
1968 - 19-b
1969 - 5-h
Midnight Lady
1975
Mill Reef
1968
Never Bend
Milan Mill
1960 - 19-b
1962 - 22-d
Mia Pola
1966
Relko
Polamia
1960 - 16-h
1955 - 16-c
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote furious Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Mar 2018 at 7:59am
Hi Diomed.  Just saying on a look at your mare that the best from the family was Mia Pola by Relko.  As you get closer to your mare you find a few unraced.  Injury or are they carrying some faults which have stopped them racing?

So I'd go back to look at Mia Pola.  She was by Relko who was a son of Tanerko from Relance.  Relance appears also as the dam of Match.  So there you have two stallions to look for in pedigrees.  Before Mia Pola there was Judy O'grady a daughter of Man o'War.  Man o'War also appears in the pedigree of Relance to they looked for something which had worked before.

Interesting to see a closer stakes winner Stop Making Sense is by Lujain who comes from a different branch of the Polly Agnes (ancestress of Relance) female line.  So look for that family in the stallion you go to where possible.

Some names to look for include Diesis, 2nd dam of New Approach has Match etc.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote diomed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Mar 2018 at 8:45am
I don't know why a couple of mares on the dam line were unraced.
I am playing online poker atm so will read the posts properly later.

Thanks for the pedigree charts and pedigree comments.
Many of the offspring of most recent dams went jumping.
Aksaray was joint Arqana yearling sale topper at 115k but never raced.
She is a big mare.
There is probably too much Northern Dancer in the Epaulette - Aksaray mating but can't be avoided.
kincsem
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diomed View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote diomed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Mar 2018 at 8:53am
I was trying to bring in a 4x4 full brother and sister into the proposed foal pedigree, the sister in the top half producing a male, and brother in the bottom half producing a female (Glorious Song (f) and Devil's Bag (m) ).
As a bonus using Epaulette you also get a 5x5 full brother and sister (Pieces Of Eight (m) and Chappaquiddick (f) ).
As poster Ticino pointed out German Oaks winner Anna Paola (in Epaulette's pedigree) has this 4x4 (actually 4x4x4).
I don't know if 4x4 full siblings is good.
It was in Bart Cummings's early Melbourne Cup winners Light Fingers and Red Handed.
kincsem
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote furious Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Mar 2018 at 9:03am
Nothing wrong with your ideas Diomed.  Just saying see if you can find some of the blood which has worked.  You might find a package with all involved.

There must be plenty of medium stallions to bring your size down and I see why you want speed in the stallion if a lot went to the jumps.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote Carioca Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Mar 2018 at 9:35am
Quote " I am playing online poker ATM will read your post later", only the Irish
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote ENJOY Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Apr 2018 at 8:04pm
Mia Pola dam line  stallion Office Bearer   Murrulla Stud  NSW.

 Plus Stallion Charge Forward. 

 Ken Mc Lean Book Designing Speed in  the race horse , page 133  . Stallion Officer
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote furious Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Apr 2018 at 9:07am
I think this mare is overseas Enjoy so Australian based sires of no use.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote diomed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Apr 2018 at 11:21am
Aksaray had a filly foal by Olympic Glory at the end of February 2018.
Since then she visited Epaulette, and I am waiting for news of pregnancy or not.
kincsem
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote diomed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Apr 2018 at 2:01pm
I got the news today that she is "empty".  Not pregnant.
The Olympic Glory filly foal is progressing very well.
She has a white face and four white socks.  If she had eight legs she would probably have eight white socks.
kincsem
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Shrunk in the Wash Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Apr 2018 at 3:16pm
Post a photo some time mate
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