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Fiorente At Stud

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kavg View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kavg Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Nov 2018 at 5:19pm
Also it would be easy to put it to the test although too early as you'd have to give it another 2 years when his 1st and 2nd crops have fully matured and 3rd crop are 3yo's. 

There are quite a few sires who carry Bahram such as At Talaq, Kalaglow, Anabaa and Noble Bijou. Just a matter of seeing how many of the dams carried one of these in their pedigrees and in turn seeing how many of them are winners, stakeswinners etc.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gay3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Nov 2018 at 5:39pm
Originally posted by TJMitchell TJMitchell wrote:

What do you mean Gay?


There aren't many races longer than a mile up Townsville way.
Experience is something you gain a few minutes after you could have used it!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gay3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Nov 2018 at 5:47pm

Either Phil or Jamie (??) interviewed y/day said his book's now full & yes, he fee will increase next year so well done to all who got the great deals this year Clap
Experience is something you gain a few minutes after you could have used it!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Second Chance Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Nov 2018 at 6:01pm
And good luck to Sun Stud.  They very much need a new headliner with Bel Esprit aging and Magnus proving upper level bread and butter, so let's hope it's this fellow.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gee Gee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Nov 2018 at 7:47pm
Will serve 150 mares this season.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gee Gee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Nov 2018 at 2:36pm
Originally posted by TJMitchell TJMitchell wrote:

Originally posted by HH88 HH88 wrote:

Early days but is there a sex balanced line-breeding trend emerging with his winners to date?
Dams carrying daughters of Bahram figure in 6 of his 9 winners i.e.
Stars of Carrum
Alessandro
Mangione
Moor Gait
Lord Gladstone
Continuation
In 5 of the 6 the daughter of Bahram comes through Summertime, the other (Alessandro) comes through Galileo.
Star of Carrum's pedigree is perhaps additionally reinforced by including a sex balanced line of Bahram's son Persian Gulf.
Also of interest the sire of Summertime, Precipitation is a half brother to Persian Gulf.
Two of the remaining 3 (Hawkshot and Fariha) are out of mares by Encosta De Lago.


Spensierato (by Fiorente), winner at Pakenham yesterday, has a 7m x 8f of Bahram


Little Phoenix (C Waller) - through Big Game 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gee Gee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Nov 2018 at 2:36pm
Originally posted by TJMitchell TJMitchell wrote:

Originally posted by HH88 HH88 wrote:

Early days but is there a sex balanced line-breeding trend emerging with his winners to date?
Dams carrying daughters of Bahram figure in 6 of his 9 winners i.e.
Stars of Carrum
Alessandro
Mangione
Moor Gait
Lord Gladstone
Continuation
In 5 of the 6 the daughter of Bahram comes through Summertime, the other (Alessandro) comes through Galileo.
Star of Carrum's pedigree is perhaps additionally reinforced by including a sex balanced line of Bahram's son Persian Gulf.
Also of interest the sire of Summertime, Precipitation is a half brother to Persian Gulf.
Two of the remaining 3 (Hawkshot and Fariha) are out of mares by Encosta De Lago.


Spensierato (by Fiorente), winner at Pakenham yesterday, has a 7m x 8f of Bahram


Little Phoenix (C Waller) - through Big Game 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HH88 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Nov 2018 at 3:55pm
What is the name of the dam?
HH88
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Nov 2018 at 6:05pm
Looks a perfect horse for the new ballot free race.

MANNZA (AUS)Chestnut colt 2015 
Fiorente
Brown 2008
Monsun
Bay or brown 1990
Konigsstuhl
Brown 1976
Dschingis Khan
Brown 1961
Tamerlane
Donna Diana
1952
1956
1-e
6-e
Konigskronung
Brown 1965
Tiepoletto
Kronung
1956
1957
2-c
5-h
Mosella
Bay 1985
Surumu
Chestnut 1974
Literat
Surama
1965
1970
7-b
19>
Monasia
Bay 1979
Authi
Monacensia
1970
1969
14-b
8-a
Desert Bloom
Bay 2000
Pilsudski
Bay 1992
Polish Precedent
Bay 1986
Danzig
Past Example
1977
1976
7-a
8-h
Cocotte
Bay 1983
Troy
Gay Milly
1976
1977
1-b
11>
Desert Beauty
Bay 1994
Green Desert
Bay 1983
Danzig
Foreign Courier
1977
1979
7-a
A4
Hellenic
Bay 1987
Darshaan
Grecian Sea
1981
1978
13-c
5-h
Rue de l'Amour
Bay 2007
Street Cry
Bay or brown 1998
Machiavellian
Bay or brown 1987
Mr Prospector
Bay 1970
Raise a Native
Gold Digger
1961
1962
8-f
13-c
Coup de Folie
Bay 1982
Halo
Raise the Standard
1969
1978
2-d
2-d
Helen Street
Bay 1982
Troy
Bay 1976
Petingo
La Milo
1965
1963
22>
1-b
Waterway
Chestnut 1976
Riverman
Boulevard
1969
1968
10-a
1-l
Western Love
Chestnut 1995
Western Symphony
Bay 1981
Nijinsky
Bay 1967
Northern Dancer
Flaming Page
1961
1959
2-d
8-f
Millicent
Bay 1969
Cornish Prince
Milan Mill
1962
1962
1-s
22-d
Miracle of Love
Bay 1985
Kaoru Star
Chestnut 1965
Star Kingdom
Kaoru
1946
1955
1-g
31>
Panvorelle
Bay or brown 1974
Convamore
Pandorelle
1962
1960
2-f
3-h
 Ancestor duplications:Danzig5m,5m x Troy5f x 4f


STRIKE WHILST THE IRON IS HOT

reductio ad absurdum

The richest man is not he who has the most, but he who needs the least.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gee Gee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Nov 2018 at 10:23am
Originally posted by HH88 HH88 wrote:

What is the name of the dam?

Fiammarosa (Danehill)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote HH88 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Nov 2018 at 12:23pm
Big Game is a son of Bahram.
Fiorente's winners highlighted in the post carry daughters of Bahram in the dams.
Trust this helps.
HH88
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Carioca Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Nov 2018 at 12:46pm
I have a feeling Big Game may be the sire of one of my favourites Faux Tirage , but memory may be out lol, Knave and Straight Draw come to mind.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Mr Prospector Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Nov 2018 at 2:45pm
Spot on Carioca

Big Game - A rich bay colt foaled on 24th January 1939, by Bahram out of Myrobellea, by Tetratema , the fourth foal of his dam . Myrobella raced 15 times for 11 wins , whilst Bahram was unbeaten on the Turf. Both his sire and dam headed the free handicap foe two year olds . 
He was a massively built , handsome , quality colt, with heavy shoulders and powerful quarters. 
race record 9 races (2 seasons) 8 wins 1 placing.
Notable progeny : Combat; Faux Tirage; Makapura ( broodie sire of Biscay); Bride Elect (dam of Hethersett);  Ambiguity and Queenpot. 
2 years
Hurstbourne Plate 5f
Cranbourne Stakes 5f
Salisbury Plate 5f
Champagne Stakes 5f
at 3 years
Salisbury Stakes 7f
Two Thousand Guineas 1m
Champion Stakes 1m.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TJMitchell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Nov 2018 at 3:46pm
Originally posted by Gay3 Gay3 wrote:

Originally posted by TJMitchell TJMitchell wrote:

What do you mean Gay?


There aren't many races longer than a mile up Townsville way.


Ahhh I gotcha now. Post order made me think you were talking about the filly I posted
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Carioca Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Nov 2018 at 4:11pm
Originally posted by Mr Prospector Mr Prospector wrote:

Spot on Carioca

Big Game - A rich bay colt foaled on 24th January 1939, by Bahram out of Myrobellea, by Tetratema , the fourth foal of his dam . Myrobella raced 15 times for 11 wins , whilst Bahram was unbeaten on the Turf. Both his sire and dam headed the free handicap foe two year olds . 
He was a massively built , handsome , quality colt, with heavy shoulders and powerful quarters. 
race record 9 races (2 seasons) 8 wins 1 placing.
Notable progeny : Combat; Faux Tirage; Makapura ( broodie sire of Biscay); Bride Elect (dam of Hethersett);  Ambiguity and Queenpot. 
2 years
Hurstbourne Plate 5f
Cranbourne Stakes 5f
Salisbury Plate 5f
Champagne Stakes 5f
at 3 years
Salisbury Stakes 7f
Two Thousand Guineas 1m
Champion Stakes 1m.

Thanks Mr Prospector, the mention of Makapura reminds me of the story he came out to OZ with the great ( or soon to be ) Star Kingdom, I have just watched a replay of the 1962 English Derby won by Larkspur ridden by Neville Selwood ( V. O'Brien) was that the Hethersett ( the fav.) that fell in the race?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mr Prospector Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Nov 2018 at 5:55pm
I'm not exactly working from memory CariocaLOL. Big Game is a great speed influence IMHO and a magic influence if you can strengthen it in a pedigree and hence whenever i see it in a pedigree I look a bit closer . 
I had to scramble for 1962 Bloodstock breeders Review for your question and yes your memory is spot on again .Hethersett fell in the derby . 
Reading the story four or five horses fell and Larkspur with Sellwood on board had to violently swerve to avoid the pile up . 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Carioca Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Nov 2018 at 7:39pm
Thanks again for your response Mr P.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ticino Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Nov 2018 at 10:08pm
Hello,
may I point out Big Game is to find in "Aggressor", dam Sire of Acatenango, Sire of Dalicia and dam of Animal Kingdom. He stud a few seasons in AUS.
 
As already known Bahram appears via Espresso (by Acropolis, stood in Germany) sire of Anatvka, dam of the FS's Allegretta (Galileo) and Alya (Adlerflug) and Antuco/Mondrian/Beeshi. Espresso had a HB named King of Babylon (by King of the Tudors) sent to AUS.
 
Btw, in 2016 a book was published about abovementioned Sire, by Peter Corbett:
Bahram & the Aga Khan III, published by Rinaldo Publishing, Stowmarket, ISBN 987-0-9566642-1-1
A lot of Information, not only about his racing career, but with much info about his offspring (Sire and dams). I paid about 30 English Pounds for it. Probably hard to find in your part of the world.
 
regards, Ticino
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HH88 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 3 hours 16 minutes ago at 2:12pm
Mannza can be added to Fiorente's list of winners who's dams carry daughters of Bahram.
In this instance there is also a daughter of Persian Gulf.

A very good-looking horse was Bahram - possibly a shade on the leg, like so many god racers - and his performances were impeccable. He was far and away the best of his age at two and three years old, winning all nine races value 43,086 pounds. His success included the 2000 Guineas, the Derby and the St. Leger, and he never new defeat. He left the racecourse an absolutely sound horse and started at stud as a 4-year-old at a fee of 500 guineas a mare. As a personal opinion I would place him as near the best of my time. It was not only the easy manner in which he won his races, and it must be confessed that his generation as a whole were not particularly good, but the horse himself was such an attractive individual.
Attribution: Bloodstock Breeding by Sir Charles Leicester
Published by Odhams Press Limited London. 1957.

Faux Tirage ( by Big Game) was mentioned earlier in the thread. 
He stood at Okawa Stud in Hawke's Bay and his race record follows:
At two years won both starts - the Granville Stakes at Ascot and the Rous Memorial Stakes at Newmarket. Won 3 times at three years including the Newmarket Stakes, St. James Palace Stakes and ran third in the Eclipse Stakes, his only defeat.



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