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Second Chance View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Second Chance Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jun 2018 at 4:45pm
Whereas we ALLknow it makes them sounder.
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djebel View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jun 2018 at 4:52pm
Originally posted by Second Chance Second Chance wrote:

Whereas we ALLknow it makes them sounder.

No, That is simply not a fact.

Thankfully we have the rest of the world to restock our racing horses.






reductio ad absurdum



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Second Chance View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Second Chance Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jun 2018 at 5:01pm
I'm sorry, you're incorrect.

The 50% decrease in testosterone alone means that geldings don't usually get as heavy topped as entires, which reduces the weight and impact on forelegs thus reducing the risk of tendon and suspensory injury.  Particularly in Oz where surfaces are historically less forgiving.
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djebel View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jun 2018 at 5:08pm
Originally posted by Second Chance Second Chance wrote:

I'm sorry, you're incorrect.

The 50% decrease in testosterone alone means that geldings don't usually get as heavy topped as entires, which reduces the weight and impact on forelegs thus reducing the risk of tendon and suspensory injury.  Particularly in Oz where surfaces are historically less forgiving.

That is a myth.

What creates horses getting heavy is the fact Australian trainers do not train the horses hard enough throughout a preparation leading up to racing.

If what you say is true why does Japan, Europe and America not have this issue ?






reductio ad absurdum



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Gay3 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gay3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jun 2018 at 5:11pm
Geez djebel, if you had your way, evry corner paddock in Oz would have a poorly performed, weak pedigreed stallion in it, serving 1 or 2 mongrel bred mares ayear.
The knackerys do well enough already due to discarded over supply, we don't need any more backyard breeders.

Experience is something you gain a few minutes after you could have used it!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jun 2018 at 5:15pm
Originally posted by Gay3 Gay3 wrote:

Geez djebel, if you had your way, evry corner paddock in Oz would have a poorly performed, weak pedigreed stallion in it, serving 1 or 2 mongrel bred mares ayear.
The knackerys do well enough already due to discarded over supply, we don't need any more backyard breeders.


Considering 30 years ago we had about 3000 stallions at stud nowt I doubt we have a 1000,

If they have proven themselves rank failures on track by the time they are 4 or 5 than fine geld them otherwise trainers and  connections should be more patient, especially with those that are bred to come on a little later.






reductio ad absurdum



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Second Chance View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote Second Chance Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jun 2018 at 5:24pm
Your comment about Australian trainers in the context of physiology is simply unsustainable.  No person can inhibit excessive muscle-mass growth in the neck and shoulders of entires unless drugs are used to suppress libido.  And we know what that meant for Criterion.  Dead

ps most poorly or ordinarily bred horses in all those countries get the chop, irrespective.

pss British, French, Irish and American surfaces are far more forgiving than in Oz.

psss why do you think so many Japanese horses race in bandages?

pssss the Americain horse we're talking about has virtually no prospect of making it a a racehorse, let alone as a stallion, so snip, snip, snip.


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linghi11 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote linghi11 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Jun 2018 at 12:03pm
Don’t forget the hassle of multiple colts in the stables- some fight each other over territory, can’t be next to fillies and mares etc.

Has Americain had a stakes winner somewhere just now?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Jun 2018 at 3:03pm
CAUSEFORCOMMOTION (USA)Bay filly 2014 
Americain
Bay or brown 2005
Dynaformer
Bay or brown 1985
Roberto
Bay 1969
Hail to Reason
Brown 1958
Turn-To
Nothirdchance
1951
1948
1-w
4-n
Bramalea
Bay or brown 1959
Nashua
Rarelea
1952
1949
3-m
12-c
Andover Way
Bay or brown 1978
His Majesty
Bay 1968
Ribot
Flower Bowl
1952
1952
4-l
4-d
On the Trail
Bay 1964
Olympia
Golden Trail
1946
1958
4-p
4-r
America
Chestnut 1997
Arazi
Chestnut 1989
Blushing Groom
Chestnut 1974
Red God
Runaway Bride
1954
1962
8-c
22-d
Danseur Fabuleux
Bay 1982
Northern Dancer
Fabuleux Jane
1961
1974
2-d
7>
Green Rosy
Bay or brown 1984
Green Dancer
Bay 1972
Nijinsky
Green Valley
1967
1967
8-f
16-c
Round the Rosie
Bay 1973
Cornish Prince
Rosayya
1962
1952
1-s
1-n
Causey
Chestnut 2007
Giant's Causeway
Chestnut 1997
Storm Cat
Bay or brown 1983
Storm Bird
Bay 1978
Northern Dancer
South Ocean
1961
1967
2-d
4-j
Terlingua
Chestnut 1976
Secretariat
Crimson Saint
1970
1969
2-s
8-c
Mariah's Storm
Bay 1991
Rahy
Chestnut 1985
Blushing Groom
Glorious Song
1974
1976
22-d
12-c
Immense
Bay 1979
Roberto
Imsodear
1969
1967
12-c
11>
Nasty Storm
Chestnut 1998
Gulch
Bay 1984
Mr Prospector
Bay 1970
Raise a Native
Gold Digger
1961
1962
8-f
13-c
Jameela
Bay or brown 1976
Rambunctious
Asbury Mary
1960
1969
19>
A4
A Stark Is Born
Bay 1987
Graustark
Chestnut 1963
Ribot
Flower Bowl
1952
1952
4-l
4-d
D J's Imp
Bay or brown 1980
Stonewalk
Fruit Cake
1971
1971
4-m
12-c
 Ancestor duplications:Roberto3m x 5f Ribot5m x 5m Flower Bowl5m x 5m 
  Blushing Groom4m x 5m Northern Dancer5f x 5m




reductio ad absurdum



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djebel View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Jun 2018 at 3:07pm




reductio ad absurdum



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linghi11 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote linghi11 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Dec 2018 at 11:02am
Has anyone had much to do with his foals? Do they seem to have a lot of leg conformation issues?
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Paul Hogan View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Paul Hogan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Dec 2018 at 11:46am
Only early days.

Apart from getting a good one now and again probably won't make it.
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Glencoe View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Glencoe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Dec 2018 at 8:14pm
I think his mother did
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linghi11 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote linghi11 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Dec 2018 at 8:58pm
Originally posted by Glencoe Glencoe wrote:


I think his mother did


Have poorly conformed limbs? Do you know what sort of issues?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Glencoe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Dec 2018 at 8:17pm
From memory I think it was front legs plus she was small
I do remember who saw her (in France I think) .I will try to contact them
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Glencoe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Jan 2019 at 2:04pm
The eye -witness report on America
 
Chestnut, lot of white, quite small (as was Arazi; she could run though). Very bad feet
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote linghi11 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Jan 2019 at 5:38pm
Originally posted by Glencoe Glencoe wrote:


The eye -witness report on America<div abp="2478"> <div abp="2479">Chestnut, lot of white, quite small (as was Arazi; she could run though). Very bad feet


So Americain inherited her bad feet and a bit of bling. Thanks Glencoe!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Second Chance Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Jan 2019 at 5:45pm
But little brilliance, sadly.

He's dead in the water as a sire at this point of time imo, and that'll remain the case unless he can sire a half-way decent stakes performer or two before the end of this season.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote linghi11 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Jan 2019 at 11:34am
Originally posted by Second Chance Second Chance wrote:

But little brilliance, sadly.

He's dead in the water as a sire at this point of time imo, and that'll remain the case unless he can sire a half-way decent stakes performer or two before the end of this season.


Tiny book this year. Don’t know if he served any decent mares but he’s a serious let down.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Glencoe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Jan 2019 at 7:43pm
David Payne has a Lightly raced 3YO called Costello.   I particularly liked it at the on-farm yearling parade. Cost only $40k.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lord Hybrow Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Jan 2019 at 7:16pm
Interesting to see that Americain has a son at stud already!! Gee Gees Americane (a 2 start maiden out of a Zabeel mare) served 11 mares in Tasmania @ fee of $2,750.

But as for Americain himself, I’d love for him to have a few more Derby/Oaks runners in those first few crops, but his oldest are only 4yo now so, fingers crossed some of them show up older stayers & jumpers.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote acacia alba Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Jan 2019 at 7:43pm
He must be owned, or stand, at the same place as Wordsmith ?  They are the Gee Gee people in Tassie.  
animals before people.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote crooked_gambler Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Jan 2019 at 7:50pm
Geard family are listed as the contact in the Studbook , which from memory are the Gee Gee people
This space has been intentionally left blank
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote acacia alba Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Jan 2019 at 9:16pm
Yep,,thats them.
animals before people.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Red Hare Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Mar 2019 at 10:54am
No longer at Swettenham.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sister Dot Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Mar 2019 at 1:32pm
Pelonomena just won 2100M for Kah & Freedman at Sandown, 4yr old mare
“Where in this wide world can man find nobility without pride, friendship without envy, or beauty without vanity? Here where grace is laced with muscle and strength by gentleness confined”
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Second Chance Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Mar 2019 at 1:38pm
From another thread about Rebel Dane leaving Swettenham:

Americain also departing.

Melbourne Cup winner Americain will have a new home at stud this breeding season.

The 2010 Melbourne Cup winner will remain in Victoria, standing at Daisy Hill in Doreen, which is 26km north-east of Melbourne's CBD.

Daisy Hill is owned by Colleen and Kevin Bamford, whom raced Americain in partnership with Jayco Caravans proprietor Gerry Ryan.

Racing.com
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shrunk in the Wash Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Mar 2019 at 2:06pm
How many did he serve last season?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Mar 2019 at 4:41pm
Just 25.




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