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Age Limit on Racehorses

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Shawy38 View Drop Down
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    Posted: 15 Jul 2015 at 10:18am
When did this rule occur?  Didn't Mustard still race at 15 or something a couple of years ago?
The horse is in career best form, I don't see why he should be banned?

Time’s up, Neil

TWELVE-year-old Run Neil Run continued his career-best form with a second at Geelong Synthetic yesterday, which followed a win and a third there also in 0-58 class.

But the gelding is close to his last run as the Rules Of Racing state that 13-year-olds, which is what Run Neil Run will turn on August 1, are banned from racing.

Racing Victoria chief steward Terry Bailey said there were no exceptions. (Herald Sun 15/7/15)

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Nocturnal View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nocturnal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jul 2015 at 10:23am
only lightly raced 54 starts for a 13 year old doesn't seem alot
The only problem with backing winners ? You never have enough on....
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tontonan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jul 2015 at 10:55am
That's strange.  The only rule I can find is :

AR 45B A horse that is aged 12 or more years shall not be permitted to start in any race unless it has undergone a pre-race veterinary examination which satisfies the Stewards that the horse should be permitted to start. [added 1/06/11].


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gay3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jul 2015 at 11:17am
Happily all's not lost since they've added the 'unless......' clause which should permit those deemed fit, happy & healthy to continue on Smile
Experience is something you gain a few minutes after you could have used it!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tlazolteotl Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jul 2015 at 11:18am
The age of entitlement and Greek style early retirement is over- horses to race till 20.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Geraldo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jul 2015 at 11:21am
Two 13yos and a 14yo running in Britain & Ireland today.  No rule about it I think, trainers and owners are trusted to be sensible and responsible about it, without the need for a rule.  Some horses are retired, and then come back into training because they're unhappy.
TBV - where it is the Silly Season all year round.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote linghi11 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jul 2015 at 11:23am
changed it recently - there was an article about a horse in NSW who has to retire end of this month as he's turning 13 and was trying to get to some 200 starts - apparently bleeding hearts complained too much about old horses getting raced - in my opinion the vetting rule seemed more reasonable
to the victor
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gay3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jul 2015 at 11:46am
Yes linghi, I think he's actually 13 now but could be wrong & whilst his name escapes me, it's something like King Of The West Confused
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Heavy10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jul 2015 at 11:52am
What's a bigger concern,horses starting to early or racing at an old age?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote linghi11 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jul 2015 at 11:56am
Originally posted by Heavy10 Heavy10 wrote:

What's a bigger concern,horses starting to early or racing at an old age?

if you read about their bone maturity - then definitely the former 
to the victor
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bachi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jul 2015 at 12:19pm
Yeah I was reading the rules in a racing calendar only a couple of nights ago and Mustard popped into my head.

Of course I can't find the book now but it said something like you need special permission to race in your 12th year then retire at 13.
You should never be in a hurry unless your 50 metres from the post and you're in front!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote OndaPunt Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jul 2015 at 12:24pm
This horse raced in June and is 14. 


STAR OF UNIVERSE

14yo Chestnut Gelding
D.O.B: 20-Oct-2000
by SKY CHASE (NZ)  from OCTEDI
5x Pedigree Report 

StatusActive
Owner’s Details (updated nightly)Mr J P Thompson, Mrs D M Thompson, Mr B R E Thompson
Stewards EmbargoesCurrent - Nil
Emergency Vaccination Record(Click here for more details)
Last Gear Change*13-Jul-2009, Blinkers, Off
TrainerMr Brett Thompson (Gulgong)
Racing ColoursWhite, Black Spots, Dark Green Sleeves
CareerSummary: 195-21:22:23    Prizemoney: $160,470     
Min/Max-Dist-Win: 1100/2175     1st Up: 16:1-1-1    2nd Up: 16:0-1-6     
Firm: 12:0-1-1     Good: 132:12-15-17     Soft: 46:8-6-4     Heavy: 4:1-0-0    Synthetic:0:0-0-0
Note: NSW & WA Gear Changes may be incomplete 

 
4th of 7CBAR 09May15 1370m Good BM45 $6,000 ($225) Jake Pracey-Holmes (a) 57.5kg Barrier 5 Rtg 42 
1st The End 54kg, 2nd Right of Reply 60.5kg 1:22.65, 2.8L $11
8th of 13TAMW 18May15 1600m Good3 BM55 $15,000 ($275) Sophie Young (a) 54kg Barrier 12 Rtg 42 
1st Topending 56.5kg, 2nd The Iliad 61kg 1:35.93 (600m 36.50), 2.6L, 11th@800m, 7th@400m $61
10th of 12GULG 07Jun15 1800m Soft5 BM48 $6,000 Sophie Young (a) 56kg Barrier 3 Rtg 42 
1st Basic Model 53kg, 2nd Declasse 56.5kg 1:53.14, 11.5L $17
4th of 11WALG 13Jun15 1600m Good BM45 $6,000 ($225) Jake Pracey-Holmes (a) 56.5kg Barrier 3 Rtg 40 
1st Toucan Ukelele 53.5kg, 2nd House Rules 59.5kg 1:36.48, 3.9L $13
12th of 12GILG 20Jun15 1800m Soft5 BM45 $6,000 Jake Pracey-Holmes (a) 56.5kg Barrier 9 Rtg 40 
1st Tiger Bassie 59kg, 2nd Enley 53kg 1:57.25, 19.4L $15
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gay3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jul 2015 at 12:27pm
Thanks OndaPunt, I knew someone'd come to the rescue! I can never remember his name & God knows, he's been around long enough LOL
Experience is something you gain a few minutes after you could have used it!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote linghi11 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jul 2015 at 12:28pm
yes the article was about him - he'd been vetted and passed under the old rules but now has to retire
to the victor
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote max manewer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jul 2015 at 12:42pm
Silly arbitrary rule, imo. Pandering to whom, I wonder.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nocturnal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jul 2015 at 12:59pm
Has TBV applied the same rule to Maccamax... Anyone heard from him ? ,I hope he is ok and still with us. Havent seen him here for ages
The only problem with backing winners ? You never have enough on....
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote max manewer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jul 2015 at 1:09pm
Originally posted by Nocturnal Nocturnal wrote:

Has TBV applied the same rule to Maccamax... Anyone heard from him ? ,I hope he is ok and still with us. Havent seen him here for ages
He's been "re-birthed" as "blackdog", having had some problem with the log-in of his old name. Which I also had a while back.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote djebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jul 2015 at 1:15pm
Originally posted by Heavy10 Heavy10 wrote:

What's a bigger concern,horses starting to early or racing at an old age?


There is no concern about either.

Every horse should be judged on its own merits.

As Geraldo says above, Owners and trainers should be sensible enough and trust worthy enough to not warrant a rule on the old age question and the same should apply for 2yos.



STRIKE WHILST THE IRON IS HOT

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Gay3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jul 2015 at 1:31pm
Originally posted by Heavy10 Heavy10 wrote:

What's a bigger concern,horses starting to early or racing at an old age?
Stats from the major countries have consistently shown that horses who raced as 2yos have much more longevity & win more p'money than those started later.
The system responds best, both physiologically & anatomically, to stress, at an early, rather than late stage with 4yo+ taking twice as long to recover from stressful workouts than 2 or 3yos. Hence the reason for mini preps in youngsters vs. nothing being done 'till they're 4+ 'because they needed to mature'. The latter will continually go shinsore at best, chip joints & strain tendons/ligs at worst, making it very hard & tedious to train & race successfully.
Of course there are exceptions Wink
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote linghi11 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jul 2015 at 1:42pm
read that article too Gay and wondered if the results are somewhat skewed as I'd imagine majority of racehorses not raced at 2 or 3 may perhaps have something wrong with them to begin with - and would of course result in poor longevity 

as their vertebrae are almost the last bones to fuse in their body, I'd hazard a guess that a very light and experienced/balanced rider is paramount during early stages most of all 
to the victor
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nocturnal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jul 2015 at 2:15pm
Originally posted by max manewer max manewer wrote:

Originally posted by Nocturnal Nocturnal wrote:

Has TBV applied the same rule to Maccamax... Anyone heard from him ? ,I hope he is ok and still with us. Havent seen him here for ages

He's been "re-birthed" as "blackdog", having had some problem with the log-in of his old name. Which I also had a while back.


Good to hear thanks
The only problem with backing winners ? You never have enough on....
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tontonan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jul 2015 at 3:30pm
I can't find anything in the rules apart from -

AR 45B A horse that is aged 12 or more years shall not be permitted to start in any race unless it has undergone a pre-race veterinary examination which satisfies the Stewards that the horse should be permitted to start. [added 1/06/11].

That's from the latest edition July 2015.  There doesn't appear to be a local rule either except in WA.

Can anyone reference where the new rule is ?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote linghi11 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jul 2015 at 3:39pm
http://www.smh.com.au/sport/horseracing/australias-oldest-racehorse-star-of-universe-to-miss-200-starts-as-retirement-age-to-be-introduced-20150615-gho8k7.html

must start Aug 1
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tontonan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jul 2015 at 3:51pm
Thanks for that. 

The rule hasn't been gazetted  (no wonder I can't find it) and it seems that they intend to introduce it as you say from 1 August. 

It reminds me of old Jorrocks, the champion of the 1840's who raced until he was 19 years old.  He won his last race at 18 years at Bathurst when the horse he was racing lost his rider.  When he finally gave it away at Homebush in 1850 they gave him three cheers that was heard two miles away.  He lived until 27 years of age at the Clifden Stud and is buried there, the grave marked with a cairn that is now within the Richmond RAAF base. 


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gay3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jul 2015 at 3:53pm
I suspect it's a media beat up, conveniently omitting the "......... unless it has undergone a pre-race veterinary examination which satisfies the......................" clause, it sure wouldn't be the 1st time Smile
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote max manewer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jul 2015 at 4:08pm
The trouble with new rules is they never seem to include ones that curtail the introduction of unnecessary new rules.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote JadeLace Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jul 2015 at 4:49pm
That would be the most ridiculous rule ever...I see umteen horses close 20 yro competing on equestrienne circuits in all fields, in NZ I have seen 15 yro jumpers still going round & they love it, these old horses have a better life having a few runs a year than falling into the hands of a hair-brain pony clubber who forgets about them after the novelty wears off...if they are healthy and sound I cant see why not!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote Shawy38 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jul 2015 at 5:30pm

When a spirited two year old chestnut named Run Neil Run made his debut back in March 2005, TVN did not even exist. Ten years later and the racing station has gone, but the now twelve year old sprinter is still going strong.  So strong in fact, that he added another chapter to his unique story on June 23rd, bringing up his first win in over six years at Geelong. His patient trainer, Ballarat’s Kevin McCartin, was naturally over joyed with the result. “It was a really good run because he came so wide on the home turn” McCartin explained. “He was probably about six wide and so they got away from him, but he still mowed them down. I thought at the 200 metre mark he was a chance as he was making ground slowly, but then all of a sudden he seemed to take off. We got a real kick out of it, particularly because we’ve had him such a very long time”. 

It’s been nearly nine years since McCartin first obtained Run Neil Run for next to nothing from his long-time friend Neil Menz. Then a three year old with just 10 starts to his name, he was in the Stawell stable of Terry O’Sullivan. O’Sullivan had long trained horses for Menz and together they had enjoyed success for the best part of 20 years. Even though it is now almost a decade since Run Neil Run left his stable, O’Sullivan still took a keen interest when he saw the veteran was racing at Geelong last week. “When I saw him I thought to myself, `gee Kev, you don’t give up easy’” O’Sullivan said. “Naturally I was really pleased he won the race. It’s been a great performance by Kevin to keep him going so long”.  The Stawell trainer recalled last week how the horse had shown some ability, but that he was also a bit of a handful around the stable. “I remember that he was a nice looking chestnut, but that he used to play up a bit and he was a bit of a difficult horse. I do recall taking him to Horsham one day and he went through the running rail”.  This incident would mark the first turning point in the career of Run Neil Run.

Neil Menz had bred Run Neil Run from a well credentialed, but poorly behaved, mare named Judith Louise. “I bought her as a broodmare and she was a well breed mare, but she was a bit of a bandit and she passed that trait onto him in spades” Menz recalled. He vividly remembers that day at Horsham that almost ended the sprinters career.  “He was always getting into trouble. That day at Horsham he’d drawn one or two and he jumped well, but then when straight through the inside fence for no reason and then out into the carpark and ended up on the streets. That was enough for me and I retired him to a paddock at home”.  After just 10 starts and not even so much as a place to his name, the Run Neil Run story would have ended then and there, had it not been for the invention of Menz’s long-time friend Kevin McCartin. Working from Menz’s property, McCartin crossed paths with the horse and sensed the potential. “I thought he was a nice horse and I knew his mother had won at Flemington, so I was keen to get a hold of him” McCartin said. “I felt that if I could iron him out and mend his ways, we might be able to have a bit of fun with him”.  Menz gave the horse to McCartin for virtually nothing and so began a new chapter.  

After a year and a half on the sidelines, Run Neil Run resumed his career for McCartin in 2008 and within four starts had recorded a maiden win at Geelong. After a few more promising runs, a second win was recorded the followed summer at Colac. However the sprinters form gradually dropped away in the months and years that followed, and after several preparations and 19 starts without a placing, he was eventually retired in December 2011.  It was here the story would have ended once and for all, had it not been for Run Neil Run’s zest for racing.  “He was flying around the paddocks at home just like a two year old, and so my kids said, `Dad give that horse another go’.  I agreed and so we brought him back in for one more go”.  Despite his age, the sprinter returned to racing as healthy as ever in November 2013.  “He is the soundest horse I have ever had” said McCartin.  “He has never had a bandage on his legs or anything like that. He has got a good constitution, although he can be a bit hyperactive.  He should have won a lot of other races but he’s never had much luck. He can be a bit tardy away and there is only one way to ride him – let him get balanced and come with one run”. 

The horse would gradually regain some form, and by early 2015 McCartin sensed a win was a distinct possibility.  His confidence grew on the back of an eye catching run at Donald in early May. Frustratingly for McCartin, his hope were dashed by the weather at his next start at Swan Hill. “That race at Donald was a good run and so I took him to Swan Hill confident that he would go well on a better track because he’s no good on wet ground.  Well you wouldn’t believe it, but when I got up there it was rain affected”.  Run Neil Run ran last, but to avoid the problem he decided to try the horse on the synthetic at Geelong.  It did the trick as Run Neil Run scored a much deserved win. In a nice touch, Neil Menz, who had remained a part of the journey throughout, was also on course to celebrate the occasion.  “The horse lives on my property so I still see him virtually every day” Menz explained. “I was there at Geelong and for him to win after six and a half years was a remarkable feat. I had actually thought Kevin was being a bit optimistic when he brought him back again”. 

For McCartin, the thrill of winning at Geelong was second only to the day he trained a city winner back in the 1980’s.  “The horse was named Versifier and I’d got him more or less for nothing out of a sale ring” he remembered. “He won at Caulfield and then ran third at Adelaide for me, before we sold him to Hong Kong”.  McCartin started his journey in racing at the age of 16 when he worked for trainer Vin Grace.  He then decided to train in his own right a while later. and was lucky enough to be able to train from Menz’s Ballarat property. He has helped to maintain the property which is the home to Menz’s broodmares, whilst training three horses of his own.

Sadly for McCartin, that will soon be down to just two horses as Run Neil Run’s remarkable ten year career will end in just over a month from now. A new rule introduced by Racing Australia will prohibit the horse from racing beyond the age of 12. “We’ve only got five more weeks with him because on the 1st of August he is banned” McCartin explained. “I think it’s a bit of a shame because I would have pushed on otherwise. I probably would have given him five or six weeks off now with the aim of bringing him back around Christmas time when the tracks were better. He is still sound and even this morning when I was working him, he was carrying on like a two year old. I have always had faith in him. Even when he wasn’t winning, he’d trial well and I knew it was just a matter of getting the right race and a bit of luck”.  Run Neil Run is likely to have at least one more start in that time, with McCartin planning on heading back to Geelong next week. “We will press on and go there Tuesday week for another 0-58 over 1200 metres on the synthetic” he said. Perhaps his veteran sprinter could even win again and go out on a winning double, adding another incredible chapter to his unique racing story.  

Update – Run Neil Run ran a solid race at Geelong on July 7, flashing home late to finish in third place. 7 days later he returned to Geelong and finished second for the first time in his amazing ten year career.   

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote max manewer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jul 2015 at 5:33pm

back in the 90's there was a 14 year old first starter at Eagle Farm at a midweek meet, in a 2200 metre race, I kid you not. It ran dismally at 25/1. That is a rather unique occurrence.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote subastral Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jul 2015 at 5:40pm
Originally posted by Nocturnal Nocturnal wrote:

Has TBV applied the same rule to Maccamax... Anyone heard from him ? ,I hope he is ok and still with us. Havent seen him here for ages



I have been tapped on the shoulder already by the Mayor. Once I hit 25000, I am to be retired.
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