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2019 Melbourne Cup

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Grey Affair View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Grey Affair Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Nov 2019 at 10:49pm
I'm not saying I agree with it.

Also, many would suggest that the allowance for 3yos is far greater than it should be.

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VOYAGER View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote VOYAGER Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Nov 2019 at 10:55pm
I do think what you said was correct, but it should not be, so I was agreeing with you, and having a dig at Timeform
Remember, it might take intelligence to be smart , but it takes experience to be wise
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Grey Affair View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Grey Affair Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Nov 2019 at 11:22pm
I hope I didn't sound argumentative. I didn't mean to as I agree with your comments. Often, the reason young horses perform well as 2yo & 3yo is because they have matured earlier than their contemporaries & they may have no or little improvement left as they grow older, certainly in comparison to the WFA scale. You raise a very good point as to whether ratings services should allow for improvement.

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Jamal View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jamal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Nov 2019 at 12:39am
Originally posted by VOYAGER VOYAGER wrote:

Originally posted by Grey Affair Grey Affair wrote:

Il Paradiso probably gets an additional 9 or 10 pounds for being a Northern Hemisphere 3yo.



I would understand that GA, but for one thing.

He has already been given the advantage by carrying less weight!, That factor should have already been used in the rating of the performance, there should be no need for adjustment in a handicap race.

You can not put up a rating in Timeform, for potential. In this race he was carrying less weight than the older POA, but POA's, form was analysed as being only slightly better than the 3yo's. And do not forget Carpenter is a member of the Timeform group for this region of the world, I hope I have read that correctly.

Either the Timeform rating is on a specific performance or it is not.

Either way I have a very cautious view of Timeform ratings, regardless of where the rating is given.


Carpenter is not part of the Timeform team in Australia. Carpenter is the Australian rep for the Lingines IFHA (International Federation of Horseracing Authorities)

Each rep from each country meet to discuss the ratings for best races horse in the world for awards. For me more info on that..see link below:

https://www.longines.com.au/universe/events-sports/rankings/race-horse-rankings

Timeform is different and they use different methods. However I use Timeform ratings over the Longines ratings.
It's always good when a WA horse does well in the Eastern States or abroad.
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Jamal View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jamal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Nov 2019 at 12:39am
And also Timeform is for performances
It's always good when a WA horse does well in the Eastern States or abroad.
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kavg View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kavg Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Nov 2019 at 10:13am
All the ratings systems are flawed.

The logic behind them is outdated.

The rating for il paradiso is overinflated. He got baulked over last 50m. Probably cost him half length at most. It was a low rating slowly run cup with a very bunched finish.

How he is rated 5 points higher than v+d is not logical. How he is rated 4 above master of reality who carried a lot more weight is also not logical.

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Jamal View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jamal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Nov 2019 at 12:00pm
Prince Of Arran off to HK. Original idea was Japan Cup but no barrier blankets are allowed so he is off to HK
It's always good when a WA horse does well in the Eastern States or abroad.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote VOYAGER Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Nov 2019 at 3:34pm
fiddlesticks, they make it difficult.

At the recent Melbourne City Council meeting there was a motion put forward, to eliminate the Melbourne Cup parade.

The motion was put forward by a greens councillor, and another wept as she told of her horror that her council supported such a barbaric industry.

Any type of activist, protestor or radical extreme supporter of anything are the individuals who strengthen the voice of those who do not want change.

I am absolutely 100% serious when I say this.

These individuals, will not stop until every person stops consuming animals for food, we all stop having pets, and the only animals on the planet are wild.

I am all for promoting, supporting and overseeing animal protection, but we all need to be very careful, that we do not allow a section of the community to dictate what we all think, we have already been through that when the church was more influential, and we have seen what happened in those days.

Remember, it might take intelligence to be smart , but it takes experience to be wise
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