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2018 G1 Caulfield Cup 2400m |
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3blindmice
Champion Joined: 22 Oct 2012 Status: Offline Points: 18105 |
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Posted: 11 Sep 2018 at 12:40pm |
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3blindmice
Champion Joined: 22 Oct 2012 Status: Offline Points: 18105 |
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3blindmice
Champion Joined: 22 Oct 2012 Status: Offline Points: 18105 |
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djebel
Premium Joined: 07 Mar 2007 Status: Offline Points: 53960 |
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Off the top of my head Torcedor has only ever won one group 3 race.
What do people make of his weight ? |
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reductio ad absurdum
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TOLEDO
Champion Joined: 17 Jul 2009 Status: Offline Points: 604 |
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Typical. In my opinion UK horses normally get abt 1-1.5kg more than they deserve
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TOLEDO
Champion Joined: 17 Jul 2009 Status: Offline Points: 604 |
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I focus on the lightly raced or improving UK horses as a result
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Redemption
Champion Joined: 09 Apr 2017 Location: Melbourne Status: Offline Points: 5387 |
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Avilius now down to $8 in most markets.
Still value in my opinion. I think Kings will Dream is way under the odds. More dour type. Avilius can sustain a long sprint. |
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Red Rancher
Champion Joined: 28 Oct 2009 Location: Sydney Status: Offline Points: 747 |
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I see Tosen Basil has drifted to $51 for the CC after his poor run in the MD on Sat. Can he improve enough in the next 5 weeks to win? On best form he would be a huge winning chance.
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FFB1975
Weanling Joined: 09 Oct 2011 Location: Melbourne Status: Offline Points: 61 |
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As far as I know (third hand via a connection) MC still very much on the agenda for TB, wouldn’t say it was a poor run but they did want to see him hit the line a bit better - that said it was fairly fast run and he had the fastest 800-400 split (think it was that).
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Magnolian Khan
Champion Joined: 23 Dec 2015 Location: SA Status: Offline Points: 8437 |
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Track was too hard for Basil apparently
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VOYAGER
Champion Joined: 03 Aug 2007 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 18737 |
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He is one of the horses who made me think that the middle of the straight was not the place to be.
Kementari and Kings Will Dream, sprinted quickly and looked as though they would push Grunt, but their run came to and end quickly, and to many horses performed like that for it to be a fitness issue. I still think you needed to be inside three of the fence and forward to have a winning hope. |
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Remember, it might take intelligence to be smart , but it takes experience to be wise
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VOYAGER
Champion Joined: 03 Aug 2007 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 18737 |
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Am warming to Ace High here after today.
No knock on his Flemington hopes either. |
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Remember, it might take intelligence to be smart , but it takes experience to be wise
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VOYAGER
Champion Joined: 03 Aug 2007 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 18737 |
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Okay where are we sitting leading into the Turnbull, Bart Cummings.
Here is me. Only from the form I have seen, so not including the overseas runners. Avilius, Kings Will Dream, Tosen Basil, Ace High, Jon Snow, Youngstar. |
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Remember, it might take intelligence to be smart , but it takes experience to be wise
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cotto1
Yearling Joined: 24 Jul 2016 Status: Offline Points: 119 |
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Hi guys:
Quick question if you win the Caulfield cup.is that then like a ballot exempt.race into the Melbourne cup?. |
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VOYAGER
Champion Joined: 03 Aug 2007 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 18737 |
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No.
That is why horses who win the Caulfield cup, need a weight penalty, to move up the order. Having said that, I can not remember a Caulfield cup winner who has paid up for the cup, that has not made the field. |
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Remember, it might take intelligence to be smart , but it takes experience to be wise
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djebel
Premium Joined: 07 Mar 2007 Status: Offline Points: 53960 |
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I think Voyager you will find the first 4 across the line are exempt from ballot.
Any horse that already has more than 56 kgs will not be penalised. This is off the top of my head and am happy to be corrected. |
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reductio ad absurdum
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Carioca
Champion Joined: 13 Nov 2015 Status: Offline Points: 21830 |
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Ha ha voyager, don't mean to be smarty pants lol, TULLOCH ..1957. |
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Tontonan
Champion Joined: 13 Oct 2007 Status: Offline Points: 3898 |
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BALLOTING CONDITIONS (1) The Directors may in their absolute discretion exclude any horse or horses from the race, whether the safety limit of 24 horses at final acceptance time shall be reached or not, and if such exclusion occurs, and more than 24 final acceptors remain, balloting of surplus horses will continue in the normal manner to its conclusion. The winner of the following, if any should be a nomination and a first, second and final acceptor for the 2018 Lexus Melbourne Cup, shall be exempt from any ballot on this race: - 2018 VRC Bart Cummings - 2018 VRC Hotham Handicap - 2018 MVRC Cox Plate - 2018 MRC Caulfield Cup (2) Subject always to the Directors' absolute discretion, as stated, remaining final acceptors in excess of the safety limit of 24 horses shall be eliminated in the following order, until the safety limit is reached: Horses OTHER THAN those that have registered a “Relevant Race Performance”, as set out below: Relevant Race Performances A) since 1 February 2017 inclusive, won or was placed 2nd or 3rd in an internationally recognised Group or Graded flat race run over 2300 metres or further; OR won or was placed 2nd or 3rd in the Queensland Derby, Queensland Oaks or Brisbane Cup OR B) since 1 February 2017 inclusive, was placed 4th or 5th in an internationally recognised Group 1 or Grade 1 flat race run over 2300 metres or further in which horses older than 3 years old could run, OR C) since 1 February 2017 inclusive, won an internationally recognised Listed flat race run over 2300 metres or further, OR D) since 1 February 2017 inclusive, won or was placed 2nd or 3rd in the York Ebor (UK) or Champions & Chater Cup (HK), OR E) since 1 February 2017 inclusive, won the Northumberland Plate (UK), Cesarewitch (UK), or Queen Mother Memorial Cup (HK), OR F) was placed 6th, 7th or 8th in the 2018 MRC Caulfield Cup, OR G) was placed 2nd or 3rd in the 2018 MVRC Cox Plate, OR H) won the 2018 VRC Seppelt Turnbull Stakes, OR I) won or was placed 2nd or 3rd in the 2016 Melbourne Cup, OR J) won the 2016 Caulfield Cup Should the number of such horses exceed the number of horses required to be eliminated from the race, then such elimination shall be effected by order of the lowest appended weight figure against the benchmark weight for individual horses, as the case may be. Horses in this clause (2) with the same lowest appended weight figure against the benchmark weight for individual horses, as the case may be, shall be eliminated at the discretion of the Directors. (3) If, after Balloting Clause (2) has been exhausted, excess horses remain, then subject to the exercise of the Directors’ discretion, elimination of such horses shall be effected by order of the lowest appended weight figure against the benchmark weight for individual horses, as the case may be. Horses in this clause (3) with the same lowest appended weight figure against the benchmark weight for individual horses, as the case may be, shall be eliminated in order of lowest aggregate prizemoney received in “Relevant Race Performances” since 1 February 2016 inclusive. Horses equal in both of these respects shall be eliminated at the discretion of the Directors. |
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Jamal
Champion Joined: 25 Jul 2011 Status: Offline Points: 8684 |
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Tenno Sho (3200m) was a ballot race too up to a few years ago
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Australian racing is only good up to 1400m in terms of world standards when it comes to depth/quality in numbers
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Tontonan
Champion Joined: 13 Oct 2007 Status: Offline Points: 3898 |
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What does it mean ?
Well, if Winx was nominated and paid up she wouldn't get a run unless she won the Turnbull on Saturday or the Cox Plate (the point is moot as she will probably win both.) Curiously the directors claim the absolute power to exclude any horse/s but not to include them. You must qualify by the ballot or you cannot race. Them the rules.
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Tlazolteotl
Champion Joined: 02 Oct 2012 Location: Elephant Butte Status: Offline Points: 31445 |
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Youngstar wins.
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An honest politician is one who when he is bought will stay bought.
Simon Cameron |
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JudgeHolden
Champion Joined: 16 Apr 2011 Status: Offline Points: 11729 |
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Youngstar impressive but took a while to stoke up. Distance will suit but I think she may be better at Flemington. Also not much between the placegetters there- horses like Ventura Storm and TFF. Warming to Homesman after today.
Might be seeing two rare birds here- a Williams horse they actually want to win a CC with, and with Youngstar an Aussie horse that might be competitive in the big one. |
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Sneck
Champion Joined: 16 Feb 2013 Location: Payout Queue Status: Offline Points: 7555 |
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VOYAGER
Champion Joined: 03 Aug 2007 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 18737 |
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And of course any Brisbane classic winners have no chance in the cups
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Remember, it might take intelligence to be smart , but it takes experience to be wise
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Jamal
Champion Joined: 25 Jul 2011 Status: Offline Points: 8684 |
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It is rare but: 2001: Ethereal won the QLD Oaks and went on to do the Cups Doubleater that year. 2009: Shocking ran 2nd in the QLD Derby (beatem by 0.4 lengths) and went on to win the Cup later that year |
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Australian racing is only good up to 1400m in terms of world standards when it comes to depth/quality in numbers
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Heavenly Glow
Champion Joined: 24 Aug 2009 Location: Melbourne Status: Offline Points: 1569 |
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Winx aside, Youngstar was pulling away from that field on the line. I see nothing behind her beating her in a Caulfield Cup. She will get better as the distances get longer. The 2400m will be more suited in the CC. It will take a special horse to beat her, as it did on the weekend.
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cotto1
Yearling Joined: 24 Jul 2016 Status: Offline Points: 119 |
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Very interesting.I like kings will dream.What did you make of his run?.
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Second Chance
Champion Joined: 02 Dec 2007 Status: Online Points: 45806 |
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Very nice mare, but meets KWD 2.5 kgs worse off in the CC and sometimes finds it hard to take up an A1 position.
Toss of the coin job for mine with relative barriers crucial.
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JudgeHolden
Champion Joined: 16 Apr 2011 Status: Offline Points: 11729 |
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KWD has been short in the market for a very long time but I think he's now at a backable price. No doubt in my mind the rail was not the place to be yesterday.
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djebel
Premium Joined: 07 Mar 2007 Status: Offline Points: 53960 |
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Youngstar goes into the Cup at her 4th run, Kings Will Dream goes in at his 5th start for the campaign. I think that gives the edge to the filly.
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reductio ad absurdum
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